ITGITC Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 So, in short (pun intended), it's a summing cable, yes? Who you callin' SHORT? I'm vertically challenged (5'7"), but I make up for it by trying to look MEAN every chance I get! How's that working for me, you ask? Not too good. "Music expresses that which cannot be put into words and that which cannot remain silent." - Victor Hugo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Tatum Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 this just in from my daughter: GUESS WHAT I JUST PUT TOGETHER! it actually ridiculously reminds me of the feel of dads upright. about 15 years ago. i love how it really just feels like a middle line real piano, and not an electric keyboard at all. and yea, the speakers really work! i have no need to go beyond half way on them. this is fun props to Casio! "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITGITC Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Hey Sue - tell your daughter 'Hi!' from some redneck in North Carolina. (I'll fill BluesKeys in on this the next time I see him.) "Music expresses that which cannot be put into words and that which cannot remain silent." - Victor Hugo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Hhaha, I'll do that. Wait a minute. Maybe that's not a good idea. Hi Tom. "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoodyBluesKeys Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Gee, I thought they called that kind of barrel a keg. Howard Grand|Hamm SK1-73|Kurz PC2|PC2X|PC3|PC3X|PC361; QSC K10's HP DAW|Epi Les Paul & LP 5-str bass|iPad mini2 "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 15, 2010 Share Posted January 15, 2010 I'd like to pick up a single (variable) sustain pedal for the Casio. Any reason why the Korg DS1H wouldn't work? From what I've read, Casio and Korg both have "normally open" contacts. God I hate pretending I know what I'm talking about. Ronny - do you have this pedal? It's looks awfully narrow.. wondering if it feels ok. Thanks! "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 16, 2010 Share Posted January 16, 2010 After thinking about this, I've answered my own question. It won't work. As a sustain switch, sure, but that's not want I wanted. I've assumed all along (mistakenly) that the terms "variable sustain" and "half-pedaling" are interchangeable. I figured all new sustain pedals contain a potentiometer to measure the resistance, like the Promega pedal - which I just took apart to confirm. In my search I haven't come across any "normally open" sustain pedals with a TRS plug, just TS. 2 wires can only mean ON or OFF. So sustain pedals like the Casio SP-30 operate on a different principal. I don't know what it is, but however it's done, it does seem crude and hardly worth pursuing. On/Off/Halfway. It is thoughtful of Casio to provide a choice for the midpoint value. When I consider the sheer number of samples that would be needed to represent all these different pedal positions, squeezing the dampers or slowly releasing them, I realize I've been barking up the wrong tree. and taking GEM's damper physical model for granted! Anyway, no matter. The Privia's still a great little instrument. Sorry for wasting valuable bandwidth. "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff_g Posted January 16, 2010 Share Posted January 16, 2010 The SP-30's sustain pedal has 3 positions: Off, half-damper, and full damper. There is no further variation beyond that. In other words, the half-damper effect is always the same. It can't be varied. The connector for the SP-30 has 5 pins. Two of the pins are dedicated to the sustain pedal. When the pedal is not depressed, both pins are low. When half-pedal, one pin is high. When fully depressed, both pins are high. So, the only way you can rig up your own SP-30 compatible pedal is by having a pot that has 3 positions (not just two). When I get some time, I'm going to put up some details on the SP-30's connector, and some notes on how to adapt standard pedals to work with the PX-130's SP-30 connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 16, 2010 Share Posted January 16, 2010 Hi Jeff - I feel pretty dumb for thinking that the Casio would know what to do with a Korg pedal besides blink. Thanks for the info! Looking forward to hearing your ideas. "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffLearman Posted January 16, 2010 Share Posted January 16, 2010 If you're using a mono amp without two independent channels, just use one side. Don't try to mix to mono using an adaptor cable or connector, because output drivers were not designed to be used this way -- the left and right sides would be fighting each other trying to control a single voltage to two different values.The correct approach is to make a mixer circuit which combines the audio signals without overloading the outputs. This kind of circuit will safely load the outputs as they are designed to be and provides very nice even mix of the two signals to the output. A mixer circuit of this kind does not have to be anything complicated. Two correctly selected resistors will do the job very well. The circuit below shows a circuit which works very well. KLONK HERE FOR CIRCUIT DIAGRAM This circuit construction provides 10 kohm input impedance and around 5 kohm output impedance. Both of the values are well within what you would expect from most audio equipment. I made a cable with a 1/4" stereo plug on one end and a 1/4" mono plug on the other end. The stereo plug goes to the headphone jack on my keyboard. The mono plug goes to the mixer input. Two small 10 kohm resistors can be used and mounted directly within the 1/4" mono plug if the barrel is large enough.Good one, Tom. With this, you may lose some volume, so just turn up the sensitivity (gain) on the input and you're good to go. The other thing to consider is that mono patches will be attenuated less than stereo ones (and this is true whenever you sum to mono). So, you may want to adjust the patch volume settings a bit to compensate. The difference is at most 3dB, which is noticeable but not extreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 The new Casio models shown at NAMM, have greatly improved action (excellent escapement -- amongst the best out there). I couldn't hear them very well in that environment, but it seemed the sound has also gotten smoother across the dynamic range and via pedalling. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Loving Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 Mark, were those the px330 and px-130 or are there still newer ones coming along? "Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 Daviel, We had the PX-130, PX-330 and a new PX-830 (which is a less portable version that only comes with the stand). The PX-830 has a new "Ivory Touch" keyboard which has a matte finish on the keys. The mechanics of the action and the piano sounds are the same as the PX-130 and PX-330. -Mike Martin Casio Mike Martin Photography Instagram Facebook The Big Picture Photography Forum on Music Player Network The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhodaway10 Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 The guys at Casio were probably the nicest guys at Namm. I met a cool professor from Minnesota that was working for casio. We had a nice time talking about some of the Chopin études I was playing. Sorry for the detour - I really liked the 830! I enjoyed it more than the 330. I have to look into that keyboard. www.brianho.net http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/brianho www.youtube.com/brianhojazz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 The guys at Casio were probably the nicest guys at Namm. I met a cool professor from Minnesota that was working for casio. We had a nice time talking about some of the Chopin études I was playing. We had some great players at the booth. That was Anthony Patterson from Michigan. He's a really great guy. -Mike Martin Casio Mike Martin Photography Instagram Facebook The Big Picture Photography Forum on Music Player Network The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 Mike, hope you don't mind a simple question. Does the PX-130 recognize a pedal on start up and accept either normally open or closed momentary switches? I'd assumed the answer was no but would hate to shortchange it! Also, I'll put in a request for midi volume control on the successor to the PX-330. It's all there: audio ins, MIDI, "local off", user registrations - but that one thing alone would keep me from taking a Privia onstage with a laptop. I suppose Midi Solutions offers a workaround, but in the interests of keeping it simple.... Thanks! "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 Mike, hope you don't mind a simple question. Does the PX-130 recognize a pedal on start up and accept either normally open or closed momentary switches? Sorry but no it does not. Thanks for the feedback regarding the PX-330. -Mike Martin Casio America, Inc. -Mike Martin Casio Mike Martin Photography Instagram Facebook The Big Picture Photography Forum on Music Player Network The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 I only tried the highest-end full-console Celviano, but the guy I spoke with seemed to be saying that the sound engine is more or less the same vs. the Privias. It was very noisy and busy and I forgot to go back to the Casio booth later in the show, and also didn't spot Mike Martin during my brief visit. Mike, can you provide a quick summary of the current line-up, highlighting the main differences in sound engine and action (I specifically mean the Celviano line and the three newest "x30" Privia models)? Other stuff like connectivity is easier to glean directly from the specs. Specifically, since you've already stated the difference between the new Privia models in terms of keybed action, does the Celviano line use the PX-830's keybed? And though your on-line specs aren't identical, do all six models (the three new Privia's and the three Celviano's) share the same piano engine? I realise there may be other differences such as number of additional sounds. BTW I notice that Best Buy is now selling the Privia line, including the PX-330. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 I meant to mention that the Celviano name sounds suspiciously like Clavinova. :-) I think it's pretty obvious which keyboards they are being competitively positioned against. I did print out all the lit from the website, for the three Celvianos and the PX-130/PX-330/PX-830 Privias, and it does look like they're all using the same new up-to-date sound engine, even though the descriptions are not identical, and that the keybed action is the same but the key texture begins to get upgraded starting with the PX-830 model. The Celvianos seem to mostly be about the furniture aspect, and maybe better speakers etc. In other words, things that matter for a home vs. gigging situation. The PX-830 is probably meant to be a compromise model between gigging needs and home needs. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Mark, Sorry I missed you at the booth. We had a very busy show. To clarify, all of the new models (Privia and Celviano) have the same engine when it comes to the piano sound. All of the new models also have the same mechanics in the key action but as you correctly point out the PX-830 as well as the AP-420 and AP-620 have the "Ivory Touch" matte finish on the keys. You are also correct that the Celviano line is very much about the furniture. The Privia models tend to be more modern, slim and sleek while the Celviano line is very traditional. Due to their size the Celviano models offer much larger speaker systems they also come with matching benches. All models have USB MIDI too. We have new Privia and Celviano websites going up very soon which will have more detailed information. I'll post links here when they go live. -Mike Martin Casio America, Inc. -Mike Martin Casio Mike Martin Photography Instagram Facebook The Big Picture Photography Forum on Music Player Network The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Mike, thanks for such a succinct yet complete explanation of the model differences! I'll give the new models another try soon at Guitar Centre, as they probably have them in stock by now (at least the PX-330). Although the lack of support for continuous damper bothers me a bit, I'm not very advanced in my pedaling (never was), so the availability of a mid-way sensitivity zone may be enough for now. I'm hoping to make a final review of the new Casios within the next week, as it affects whether I stick to the original plan of getting a PC3X, or whether I get a PC3 instead. The PC3 action is semi-weighted and heavy enough to not give problems at a gig the way a typical unweighted synth action does. I don't use much acoustic piano at gigs, so this combination might work well for me. I'll know soon enough. The level of support that Casio is showing of late, gives me a lot of faith in the rate of development. This is also true of Kurzweil, and Korg as well. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Martin Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Mark, I should mention that with the PX-130 and PX-330, if you buy the stand and optional pedal board (SP-32) you do get continues damper control. All Celviano models offer this capability as does the PX-830. If you don't have the pedal board and you're using the an instrument like the PX-330 live it only accepts a standard on/off style pedal. Using this type of pedal, I should note that the Privia's do "catch the release" of any note still sounding. -Mike Martin Casio Mike Martin Photography Instagram Facebook The Big Picture Photography Forum on Music Player Network The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Ah, I must have gotten confused after gangsu's recent discussion of the SP-32 then. I'll investigate this more fully. One of the drawbacks to the PC3X is that there isn't really an available "in the box" tri-pedal solution. You can put something together but the ergonomics won't be the same as a dedicated tri-pedal. It's less of a problem than with the LE model though. Granted, few keyboards other than dedicated Digital Pianos allow this. It's one of the reasons I have for some time considered a dual solution of Digital Piano for the home (and occasional piano-oriented gigs) and general high-quality ROMpler (i.e. PC3 series) for gigs. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoodyBluesKeys Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 One of the drawbacks to the PC3X is that there isn't really an available "in the box" tri-pedal solution. You can put something together but the ergonomics won't be the same as a dedicated tri-pedal. Available in the US is key - Fatar makes such an assembly. I have three Kurzweil dual pedals that have been custom modified to add a third pedal; and have just gotten one more, but don't yet have it modified. It is getting more difficult, because the Korean made Kurz single pedals are not made like the Fatar pedals. I've got a friend with an SP88X and the old single Kurz pedal, going to trade them a new Kurz single pedal for it, and mount it in the dual assembly. With a bit of cutting out in the middle, the Kurzweil dual pedal, and one of the older Kurzweil made in Italy single pedals - take the shell off the single pedal, cut out the needed space in the middle, and put the pedal in the middle. Gives a very nice three pedal assembly that is heavy enough to sit in one place pretty well. Not a real clear picture, but my avatar shows the modified pedal assembly. I do wish that the commecial Fatar pedal was available here - based on recent web pages, I'm no sure they even make it anymore. Howard Grand|Hamm SK1-73|Kurz PC2|PC2X|PC3|PC3X|PC361; QSC K10's HP DAW|Epi Les Paul & LP 5-str bass|iPad mini2 "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Ah, I must have gotten confused after gangsu's recent discussion of the SP-32 then. Sorry about that, Mark. Digital half-pedaling, variable damper control, continuous damper control.. these terms are hardly synonymous and yet that's the way they're thrown around. I have yet to try Casio's half-damper feature but I'm willing to bet it's enough to take the edge off. "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Ah, thanks for clearing that up, Sue. I have a contact person at Fatar/Studiologic that I was going to call back about the not-in-US tri-pedals (with three separate cables), but didn't want to call until I was finalised on my keyboard (I sold the VMK188plus over the holidays). Although the SP-32 is especially for the Casio Privia series, I'm also wondering whether Fatar's solution would work properly with them and thus be bi-purposed for both Casio and Kurzweil? Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Although the SP-32 is especially for the Casio Privia series, I'm also wondering whether Fatar's solution would work properly with them and thus be bi-purposed for both Casio and Kurzweil? Out of the box, no, not if you're expecting the sustain pedal to work as anything other than an on/off switch. Nice thought though, I wondered the same thing. Neither of Casio's 1/4" pedal inputs recognize CC type pedals, and apparently Kurz doesn't support variable sustain. Earlier in this thread, jeff-g mentions some possible modifications in order to use standard pedals with the Casio 3-in-1 pedal jack located under the keyboard. ..hope I'm not passing out misinformation. I'd never given this much thought before a week ago, either. "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Naw, I was aware of those internal limitations, but was hoping it didn't affect what is passed through (such as if driving Pianoteq). At least on the Kurz, where I think MAYBE you can set it up so it doesn't filter the input and passes it along as variable sustain. If the Casio inputs are TS, then there's no way a variable sustain could be passed along to software or hardware using it as a controller. The other option is the unreliable CME tri-pedal setup, which can use MIDI or TRS jacks. The MIDI could pass through, but I'll have to check whether Casio supports MIDI in, and whether Kurz echoes MIDI in to MIDI through or MIDI out. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 I was hoping to try one of the x30 models today at Guitar Centre, but they only had the older models. I thought these were already in stores, but I'll call some of the other locations in the area. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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