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Looking for a new B3 simulator


zaj58

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I have been looking to upgrade my organ clone keyboard to compliment my new s70xs. Currently using a CX3. I have been listning to the new nord C2 on you tube and i am liking what I hear. A double keyboard organ that weighs 35lbs, wow! This board seems and sounds great to me, but it seems like there are a lot of hammond ( suzuki) fans at this forum. Has anyone purchased or played this c2 that could give me some feedback. Any comparison to the hammond xk3c or even the nord c1 would be appreciated. I realize there is the button drawbar issue, but that is not a concern of mine. bottom line is the sound and response of play. thanks...
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Shameless Plug here.....

 

Go to You Tube. Search for the "lightbg" channel

 

All band recordings were done through a Zoom Q3 and feature my C1 through a Leslie 2101 top/ Yorkville Blok 100 K bottom.

 

I think it's superb.

 

Jake

1967 B-3 w/(2) 122's, Nord C1w/Leslie 2101 top, Nord PedalKeys 27, Nord Electro 4D, IK B3X, QSC K12.2, Yamaha reface YC+CS+CP

 

"It needs a Hammond"

 

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Seems to me that you are not particularly concerned about the drawbar versus "drawbuttons" issue that gives us a lot to talk about. I have an XK and an NE2, so I've worked them both. Since you want to "compliment" your S70XS, have you considered a rack mounted version of the organ? Nord and Ham-Suz make them and there are other options as well. This might give you what you are after with a lighter load to lug around.
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A couple things regarding the above posts (and a question).

 

Is the S70xs weighted or non-weighted? (If it's weighted, probably not the greatest organ controller around.)

 

Do you intend to carry a leslie? (If not, the Hammond Suzuki bumps down a couple notches from other self-contained clones with excellent leslie sims.)

 

Are you going to stack your instruments above each other, or in an L shape? A big problem with the Nord C1/C2 is the depth of the keyboard: You can't put anything over it because you can't access the controls of the C1, and you'll never be able to reach the controls of your S70xs. And you can't put the C1 on top because you'll never reach the controls of the C1, so you're locked into an L shape, which can be difficult on most smaller stages.

 

If you're not carrying a leslie, the Hammond Suzuki's leslie sim may be a real sticking point; some folks like it, but compared to the sim on the Nord Electro 3 or C2, or Native Instruments B4 or EVB3, it comes up pretty short IMO. However, the addition of a Ventilator leslie sim will take care of that no problem (I use my XK1 through it, and it's really the clone rig of choice for me without a leslie).

 

If you're carrying a leslie, then the XK series of clones rises to the top. You have drawbars, excellent fundamental Hammond tone, and courtesy of the leslie, great overdrive.

 

If stacking and carrying no leslie is more indicative of your gigging scenario, I'd be more inclined to think Electro 3, or XK1 or XK3 with a Ventilator.

Hitting "Play" does NOT constitute live performance. -Me.
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One other thing: this may not be important to you but the XK series has the distinction of allowing you to program Motor Stop, basically emulating the sound of the motor being shut off with subsequent pitch drop and volume fade (I set it to the mod wheel), and the reverse effect when releasing the wheel (Pitch and volume returning to normal, emulating the power up).

 

The Electro has ring modulation.

Hitting "Play" does NOT constitute live performance. -Me.
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The Electro has ring modulation.
Note that the electro 3 has the C1 organ engine not the C2 engine, even though they were both released around the same time.

-Greg

Motif XS8, MOXF8, Hammond XK1c, Vent

Rhodes Mark II 88 suitcase, Yamaha P255

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The Electro has ring modulation.
Note that the electro 3 has the C1 organ engine not the C2 engine, even though they were both released around the same time.

 

I am curious about this point. I have not really found anything on the Nord website that states clearly that the C2 engine and the C1 engine are fundamentally different. They refer to the C2 engine as "third generation" but I am not sure what that means. Can anyone confirm this?

 

My band Thousand Houses: www.thousandhouses.com
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Adjustable key click and an additional Leslie model are the C2 changes to the core engine.

 

Everything else is related to either the Pipe organ or the board: control layout, improved midi functions, keybed, monitor input and routing, bass, etc.

 

That's based on forums and the NAMM lit.

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Thanks for all the the helpfull insights.I was not aware of the ventilator device and Will check it out further. Maby thats all i need to get me to keep my CX3 and save 3K. On the other hand I am a bit infatuated w/ that C2 right now. The idea of a double keyboard organ that can be set and played like a real B3 and weighs in @ 35lb is grabbing me. I will not be using any kind of real leslie so the integral leslie simulator is a big factor. Some seem to think the nord is superior. I am concerned about what tonysounds mentioned regarding the logistics of the double keyboard in a stack set up. That would be the only way i would set up. It does seem that with the nord on top it could work. Has any one done this? I will not use the s70xs as a controller for an organ module. It is a hard action and i prefer my organ as a stand alone keyboard. Then there is still the xk3c to think about and listen to. I wish my local music store had these axes on display so i could demo them myself. It's not like i am out in the stix somewhere. i am in a suburb of NYC. I have major music stores close buy, namely guitar center and sam ash and neither stock the xk3c or c2. Well feel free to keep this subject open. I will be listning. Keep an eye out for a new topic i will be opening on why the piano sounds in this new yamaha s70xs are inferior to it's predecessor the s90es. I think this new sampled S6 piano sucks...
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Well, the keyclick on the Electro 3 is adjustable with three different settings, so unless the C2 has more adjustability than that, they are probably the same, with the exception of the additional Leslie simulator.
My band Thousand Houses: www.thousandhouses.com
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I am concerned about what tonysounds mentioned regarding the logistics of the double keyboard in a stack set up.
Nevermind tonysounds logistics, just go get one... then report back :snax:

-Greg

Motif XS8, MOXF8, Hammond XK1c, Vent

Rhodes Mark II 88 suitcase, Yamaha P255

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You funny Mogut........ Hey went on that hammond link and alot of the stores that rep hammond local to me I have been in and had not seen hide nor hair of that xk3c OR C2. Sure, they say they can order for me, but won't put one on the floor.
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I am concerned about what tonysounds mentioned regarding the logistics of the double keyboard in a stack set up.
Nevermind tonysounds logistics, just go get one... then report back :snax:

 

Yeah, do that. God knows I dont know what the hell Im talking about. :wave:

Hitting "Play" does NOT constitute live performance. -Me.
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I had the same problem when deciding what to buy. No one had a C2 or an XK3c in stock anywhere in a tri-state area. Nor were they planning to. I was lucky enough to use a friends XK3c. I was also lucky to get a NE2/73 on loan from guitar center to try. It really is a shame that these boards aren`t out there for players to try. Especially for the kind of money they cost. I likened it to buying a 3K-6K car. Would I spend that kind of money after just seeing a picture of the car? NO! I would want to touch it and drive it. See how it handled. Same is true for these clones.

Motif ES7

Korg Triton Pro76

Roland Fantom X8

CP -33

Custom B-3 Chop w/ 145 Leslie

 

 

 

 

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It really is a shame that these boards aren`t out there for players to try. Especially for the kind of money they cost. I likened it to buying a 3K-6K car. Would I spend that kind of money after just seeing a picture of the car? NO! I would want to touch it and drive it. See how it handled. Same is true for these clones.
Thats because guitar's core customers are teenagers with no money, or bum musicians with no means of transportation. The world has no shortage of both these types.

-Greg

Motif XS8, MOXF8, Hammond XK1c, Vent

Rhodes Mark II 88 suitcase, Yamaha P255

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This stuff has gotten so expensive that the retailers can't afford to put one out as a demo. That is just the way things are today. I bought a PC1X that I still use several years ago and I think that is the last piece of gear I got to test drive. Brook Mays, who I bought it from at a most righteous price I might add,is now out of business. I hope it wasn't my fault. You know clavia is a good company and what kind of gear they make; you know how hammond-suzuki has excelled with the hammond clones. You have to decide based on how you like the companies, their OS, and their gear's personalities. You have to act on faith!
"Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown."
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Well daviel i respect what your saying, but i disagree. I have to act on which one of these axes feel and sound better. I am sure quality wise i can trust either company, but damm I want to put my hands on one of these things before i decide which one is the better for me. By the way i recently for the first time ever purchased a new keyboard withoutplaying/hearing it first based on "trust" and faith and i am not exactly thrilled with the instrument. Don't want that to happen again. I am going to make some phone calls to the music stores in NYC like mannys and ash and see if they have either of these boards on display

 

I think the problem w/ these music stores not having floor models available on these high end hammond clones is that they know they will never realy sell all to many of them compared to other types of keyboards. They display the high end sequencers by yamha, korg, and roland all the time. The cost of these instruments being more then even the nord c2. The sam ash by me has a floor model of a new roland digital "grand" piano that lists for about $6500 every time i go in there some little kid is thrashing on it. That same store has a cx3 that i have seen sitting there for almost two years.I know for a fact it is the only one the store has. No one will buy it. Belive or not most people who buy keyboards don't by hammond clones. We are actually a minority.

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