Would you advise the singer if...

[stepay]

...he was using a wrong word and not really getting the signature vocal part right?

 

Here's the deal...

 

I'm in a new band. My former bass player and I have joined a band of three others who don't have near the gigging experience as we do (a tiny bit naive they are with regard to some things, but they are good guys who will learn soon enough).

 

The lead singer guy is actually halfway decent, but on Traffic's "Dear Mr. Fantasy", he uses the word "song" instead of "tune" and then doesn't sing "happy" with the same inflection that Winwood does - "hap-pee-ee". I'm far from a perfectionist, and I don't expect him to do an imitation of Winwood, but these seem to me to be two very signature things from that song.

 

Soooo,

 

1) Do I suggest to him that he use the right lyric and sing it correctly, OR

 

2) Am I being too strict on this one song for whatever reason? I mean I sure don't play note for note on most things (except for signature keyboard licks, I sure try to).

 

He's new to public performance and has mentioned a little bit of confidence issues, so I don't know if my constructive criticism will help or hurt. Besides, I JUST joined this band, and they have had a few gigs without me, so I don't want to be the punk joining the band telling them all what to do.

 

So, any advice here?

 

Thanks!

[timwat]

If it was me, yes, I'd talk to him because I agree it's a bit of a sig to the song in question.

 

That being said, it's all in the "how" of how you handle it. There's 1000 punk ways to do it (and alienate the guy), and a few diplomatic, humble, helpful ways.

 

I'd grab some coffee w/ him offline, talk him up for all the stuff he's doing well, encourage him that you dig playing with him, "oh, and by the way, I wasn't sure if you knew that Winwood's original take went like this, while a few times you've been doing this other thing..."

 

That's just me, others may have a diff take.

 

 

 

[Postman]

I agree with timwat. Ask him if he knows about the discrepancies first. If he does, then you know he's doing it as some sort of artistic interpretation or something. If so, I'd shut up about it. Otherwise, he'll probably fix it.

[stepay]

Ok. Good advice guys. Thanks.

[Jeff_D_in_MD]

Personally, I wouldn't say anything, at least not yet. If the band is perfect except for that minor discrepancy on a cover tune, then fine - bring it up diplomatically and you'll achieve perfection. If, however, you guys need more work together in a variety of areas (as I know the band I'm in does), then getting that bit of Dear Mr Fantasy just exactly right is icing on the cake.

 

Put another way, you are responsible only for playing your parts the way you want them played. If the vocalist makes a mistake, that's not your business, especially if you're the new guy.

 

[Moog_Man]

If you guys are just hanging out or taking a break from practice sometime just kind of sing the song like it should be. Don't do this directly to him of course but if he hears it being sung casually the way it is supposed to be he might pick up on it.

[Bill H.]

If you two new guys brought the song with you (which is what I suspect) yeah I'd mention it. You are showing the band a song you've been doing all along and they may not know as well.

 

If they have been performing it that way before you two joined I'd leave it.

[J. Dan]

I would say something and I wouldn't wait. The longer you practice something wrong, the harder it is to break the habit.

 

I would take it offline. Saying something in front of everybody is more likely to cause defensiveness, etc. - at least until you guys have been together long enough to feel comfortable about that sort of thing.

[JeffLearman]

 

I think everyone should sing a song the way it works for them. If he makes it work, that's all that matters. If he's saying something that doesn't make sense, or misunderstands the words, I'd point out "what it is on the record".

 

If you can find a positive way to say it, without sounding critical, no harm. But it often ain't easy to do that; it all depends on the chemistry and the moment and your approach.

 

Good luck!

[toad]

I'd let it go and wait 'til it happens again on other songs. Maybe phaze out that song later, and work on some songs up his alley.

[MidLifeCrisis]

If your singer is anything like mine he probably doesn't even realize. I have to correct mine all the time. I always do it in a semi-joking manner. I'll walk up to him laughing and say something like "Dude, that's my favorite line of that tune. You sure you don't want to do it like the original?"

 

[kanker.]

I'd probably take more issue with the word Tune than the pronunciation of Happy.

[King Julien]

I personally wouldn't worry too much about it in your situation. But I'm not in the camp of always trying to play covers as close to the original as possible. In general I find that the original is a good starting point that can be varied in many interesting ways - either intentionally or accidentally.

[Moonglow]

.....I'd grab some coffee w/ him offline, talk him up for all the stuff he's doing well, encourage him that you dig playing with him, "oh, and by the way, I wasn't sure if you knew that Winwood's original take went like this, while a few times you've been doing this other thing...".....

Excellent approach.

 

I always try to frame a negative statement by starting with at least two genuine, positive attributes the person displays. (e.g., "You really nailed the chorus of that song and your phrasing on the bridge is excellent. I hope you don't feel that I'm being overly nit-picky, but I'm really used to hearing...."). This may take some of the sting out of your suggestions and temper any defensiveness he may exhibit. Also, since he appears a little green, I like the idea of pulling him off to the side (away from the other band members), which may allow him to save face somewhat until he develops thicker skin.

 

I realize this does not address the philosophical issue of trying to perform a cover song "just like the record" versus a more interpretative approach, but the reported elements of your singer's version of the song appear to be resonating with you. So in terms of maintaining favorable working, relational dynamics within the band, I would suggest that you talk with your singer about this song. Otherwise, if a similar situation arises, your "build up" of frustration may result in you being more inclined to respond in a more critical and ego-threatening manner.

 

Whose idea was it to do this song? In my band, if a song is more important to a particular member, I will try to show deference to that persons recommendations. I figure they probably have listened to the song 1000 times more than I have (or ever will), and by modeling "openness to suggestions" I hope they will be more receptive to any recommendation I may have for one of my songs.

 

Good luck!

 

[Cloud_9]

I would say something and I wouldn't wait. The longer you practice something wrong, the harder it is to break the habit.

 

I would take it offline. Saying something in front of everybody is more likely to cause defensiveness, etc. - at least until you guys have been together long enough to feel comfortable about that sort of thing.

 

This is definetley the way to go here, but dont forget to comment on the good stuff he does too.

[stepay]

Thanks for all the thoughtful responses. I haven't said anything to him about it yet, but I do plan to. He's still on a high from our Saturday gig which went crazily well considering we've only had two practices with all the band members there. I will do it though.

 

The song is one that HE wanted to do. The bass player and I did not bring that song with us, but man I love jamming to that song, and I hope we don't drop it from our set list anytime soon.

 

I've got a couple suggestions to make to him. Either I just ask if he's done his own interpretation on that song and just flat out tell him that they use the word "tune" and not "song", and tell him that I don't really care but that if he wants to be true to the lyrics that "tune" is the right word (I already corrected them when playing the break with no pushback; the break goes Em, G, Em, G, Em, G, Em, F, D; they were playing it with with an extra G in there after the last Em). I told them I didn't really care how we played it just as long as we all played the same thing. They decided to go with how Traffic wrote it.

 

Our first gig at this particular popular live music bar in town netted us a monthly ongoing gig there, so that's a good thing. The fact that it's 5 miles from my house and their schedule has the music stopping at 1:00 instead of 2:00 is even better.

[Bill H.]

Wow that sounds like a great gig. And they're getting harder to find these days. Congratulations!

 

Anyway if the whole group is learning the song at the same time, in every band I've been in, there has always been open discussion and corrections between members as the piece is being put together. It's only a little after the fact but sure... tell him... and your approaches sound fine.

[Phred]

Just tell him that 'song' doesn't rhyme with 'gloom'... At least not quite as well as 'tune' does .

[MikeT156]

The main thing is to do it on the side, one-on-one. As previously posted, you don't want to do this in the group setting.

 

Yep, sounds like a good gig. You guys couldn't have been too bad if you got a steady gig there.

 

Mike T.

[AUSSIEKEYS]

maybe a simple non impossing method to front him with,

would be this.....

 

 

if you can bother and have the time , make a practise tape up of ALL your songs, making the first song the song he has problems with...

 

simply make numerous copies of this "practise tape" and hand it out to ALL members of the band saying simply...

 

"hi guys, just made a practise tape up to listen to in my car, thought you guys might like one also, to listen to while driving around"

 

no singling out anyone, it sounds like you are keen, and most band members wouldn't mind having a tape to listen too while driving.

 

if he listens to it...he will soon start to let the song sink in.

 

its just means a little effort by you to pull it off...

of coarse you cant make him listen to it...but most will while driving.

 

 

 

 

[Phred]

Good idea, uh... What's a tape?

[stepay]

The main thing is to do it on the side, one-on-one. As previously posted, you don't want to do this in the group setting.

 

Yep, sounds like a good gig. You guys couldn't have been too bad if you got a steady gig there.

 

Mike T.

 

We actually did pretty well. I was slightly concerned about it since we've nto been together that long. We picked mostly some easy to play songs that were pretty easy to get tight, and for whatever reason there aren't a ton of keyboard players in this town, so when a band shows up with one, it adds a whole new dimension. We played a funky version of Big Legged Woman, and I used the clav on that one and the crowd went nuts. To the lead guitar player's credit though, we also did Bridge of Sighs, and he flat out killed on that one, and he's a very dramatic player that bar goes like to see. I thought he was going to start smashing some amps with his guitar and then light it on fire after that song.

 

We sort of got in the club in a backwards way. Our bass player was in a previous band (that I used to play in with him) and then the guitar player quit, so he joined up with these other guys and he just told the club owner that the guitar player left and we changed the name of the band. In a very very loose way that's what happened, but we worked it out and the owner loved it, so we're back in monthly now. Just one or two more like that and that's enough.

[AUSSIEKEYS]

Good idea, uh... What's a tape?

 

hee hee

 

well...its the latest technology to come to Australia...

 

its this crazy 1/8th inch tape looking stuff in this little cassette thingy..

 

it's unbelievable...it sounds so good...you dont get those scratch sounds you get on record albums..

 

you buy it in Woolworths next to the lightglobes and batteries..

 

apparently the top quality tape brands are available in record stores...

 

I"ll bet one day there will be no more record stores and just tape stores...Imagine that...I thought 8 track was the living end but now cassette tapes...man this is gotta be the final recording medium.

 

 

[harmonizer]

How about trying the "I'm dumb" approach:

"hey, you know it's always confused me on this piece....does anyone know if the word "song" or "tune" is the correct one - what's on the original recording, anyway? Does anyone know?"