Neck dive vs balance points

[Rocky McDougall]

With previous threads discussing neck weight, lightweigt tuners, balance points, etc, etc, I thought I would check the balance points on several basses I had laying around. I set up a balance blade and laid each bass on the blade on it's backside. As an average, the US & MIM Precisions balanced on the forward screw area of the neck plate. US & MIM Jazz basses balanced on the rear neck plate screws. This would indicate that Jazz basses with their smaller, lighter necks would be less prone to neck dive (as would be expected). This of course will vary from bass to bass and it's body wood. Neck strap width and friction will effect this but I thought it interesting that the Jazz neck/body had a different balance point. For what it's worth, the upper horn and strap attachement are the most critical. Most Fenders have the upper horn coming out to the 12-13th fret.

Rocky

[alexclaber]

My RIM Custom balances at the 20th fret and my Warwick at the 22nd fret. The upper horn on the RIM comes to the 12th fret and on the Warwick to the 14th fret. The rear strap pin on the Warwick is about 4" behind the bridge saddles whilst on the RIM it's only 1.5" back from them.

 

The Warwick balances fairly well though prefers being closer to horizontal than tilted up, whilst the RIM tends to hang at almost 45 degrees naturally. I use a rough backed leather strap to stop the Warwick neck diving but I think I'm going to get some kind of slippy strap that lets me throw the RIM around more, as it always ends up back where I want it without trying.

 

I hate neck dive!

 

Alex

 

P.S. Where are the Fender neck plates in relation to the frets?

[DavidMPires]

How do you check that on a neck through

[Rocky McDougall]

What may be best on a neck thru is to compare the balance point in relation to the 12th fret. On a Fender Jazz, the balance point is approx. 5 inches to the rear of the 12th fret. On a Precision, it is about 3 inches behind the 12th fret. Most Fender basses are a little neck heavy. A wide, high friction strap compensates for the off balance. I have one custom bass with a Jazz neck and a "reduced size" Precision body. It balances very nicely even though the upper horn does not come as far as a standard Fender.

Rocky

[Rocky McDougall]

For those of us who like a high playing position and a more upright angle, moving the bottom strap button up about 4 inches really improves the balance and angle if you don't mind drilling another hole in your bass.

Rocky

[Juancarlin]

I had to move almost 5 inches the strap button of my neck-thru Hondo bass, since the horns end up close to the 15th fret, and thus it neck-dives a lot...

 

shame (and not) it is a neck-thru... I remember in the late eighties reading on Guitar Player Mag a small ad almost at the end of the mag, or was it at the new products section in the beginning of the mag, seeing some device called the "Bass Brace" (Not the double strap system with the same name that is currently being advertised), which was some kinf od metal plate extension that screwed on the plate itself and extended the strap pin further away from the upper horn tip, for neck heavy basses.

 

Thanks to the bigness of Internet, I've found a pic of a Modulus Graphite bass with a "original" Bass Brace installed:

http://67.163.159.168/bassmanbear/images/MFR-Backr.jpg

 

I've always thought it was curiously useful, although a little bit awkward..

 

 

[Davo-London]

My Bordwell ball bass horn extends to the 13th fret. This is also a very light bass and so this is an important part of the design. That is with a light body the neck weight will be a more significant percentage of the overall weight and thus unless the horn is extended neck dive I would deduce would be more likely.

 

http://www.heathette.com/photos/finished%20bass.jpg

 

As it is the ball bass has no neck dive and balances beautifully. My Jazz has a very slight neck dive tendancy and for that a wide strap is necessary. There again I love wide straps.

 

My ABG is naturally neck heavy, which is always going to be the case with hollow bodies.

 

Davo

[Davo-London]

I must retake some photos as this looks much darker than it really is.

 

Davo

[DavidMPires]

My Spector, has it's upper horn in line with the 14th fret and although the bass is heavy, it's not heavy neck at all. And it's really confortable in any position, I tend to favour a position where the bass neck is parallel to the floor and the bass sits against the side of my body.

[b5pilot]

My Warwick thumb 5-string bass has a really short horn somewhere around the 14th fret. Thumb basses are pretty notorious for being somewhat of a neck diver, especially the 6-string models. The Warwick site actually has a thread on the subject. My Guild is built more like a jazz bass and is better balanced.