Edgar Summers Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Hey Guys! As much time as I spend reading stuff on this forum it just occurred to me that this is a good place to ask a question about my Fantom....duh! I have a Fantom S88 which is about three years old. I don't play out with it too much, mostly at church and occasional gigs. Lately I've noticed one of my one of my layered patches (#1) is acting a little funky. It has piano, bass, synth(kinda squarewave thing going) layers going along with a rather busy drum pattern(s) on the buttons. For those who haven't played the Fantom, the buttons trigger drum patterns which are usually variations of each other, although anything's possible. When I get the drums going the piano seems to lose notes like it's running out of polyphony or available notes. Also the piano seems a little distorted. It even happens with two or three note chords. So it dosen't seem like I should be running out of polyphony, plus the distortion thing is kind of odd. I called Roland a few weeks ago. The tech's answer confused me. He said by editing a factory patch I might have thrown an error into the patch. I'm wondering if I didn't hear him right and was thinking of calling back for another tech. The other patches and sounds seem fine. So any ideas? Thanx "Music should never be harmless." Robbie Robertson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicWorkz Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Try backing up your board with your current set-up and reinitializing the whole thing. See if the issue persists. It might just be an anomaly. Yamaha (Motif XS7, Motif 6, TX81Z), Korg (R3, Triton-R), Roland (XP-30, D-50, Juno 6, P-330). Novation A Station, Arturia Analog Experience Factory 32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Golly Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 One thing to bear in mind is that the polyphony of the instrument isn't the number of simultaneous notes that you can play, but the number of simultaneous tones that can be active; a stereo piano patch will play two tones per note, so immediately your perceived polyphony is half of what the spec sheet says (sorry, don't recall the published polyphony of the S series at the moment). Add to that the drums (1 or 2 tones per drum sound, if the samples are stereo), and everything else you've got going on, and it's pretty easy to run out of polyphony. I'm grabbing the S-88 manual now to check on the polyphony issue, but that would be my guess. As for the distortion, are you hearing it when using headphones? You might just be saturating the channel that you're plugging the Fantom into (i.e. a mixer or an amp) with the percussive content of the drums causing some clipping. If you're hearing it with headphones, try reducing the level of the tones within the patch. Having everything cranked to 100% is a sure way to lose dynamic range and to introduce unwanted distortion down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Summers Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 I think the polyphony is 64 notes, could be 128, but I'm not at home. i remember being surprised when i brought it that it didn't have more. I'm hearing the distortion thru my amp, didn't try headphones. Maybe the internal levels are too high too high. Thanx for the ideas! "Music should never be harmless." Robbie Robertson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Golly Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Edgar, just checked... the S-88 has a published polyphony of 64 (or 32 stereo tones). You should check the patch that you're working with to see how many tones are being triggered. I'm pretty confident that since it's only happening to the one patch that you've got maybe an extra layer being triggered that isn't needed (perhaps the piano is active twice? have you noticed any flanging on the sounds?). Let us know how it turns out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverDragonSoun Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Edgar, One of the biggest gripes people had with the S series was notes cutting out due to the way the polyphony was distributed. I experienced it while I used one on a gig years ago on a a few of the sounds I used. It was pretty bad as the guitarist was laying into our soundguy and blaming him. I had to calmly explain it was the keyboard he wanted me to use for the show. It was his cousins keyboard and he wanted to see how it sounded live. Needless to say we never used the Fantom S again. I think the idea of reinitializing will help solve your issue if what the Roland tech told you turns out to be true. I would also be curious to see how this turns out. Begin the day with a friendly voice A companion, unobtrusive - Rush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthoid Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 I called Roland a few weeks ago. The tech's answer confused me. He said by editing a factory patch I might have thrown an error into the patch. I'm wondering if I didn't hear him right and was thinking of calling back for another tech. Thrown an error in the patch? I've never heard that one before....I'd call them back. When an eel hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's a Moray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Summers Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 Edgar, just checked... the S-88 has a published polyphony of 64 (or 32 stereo tones). You should check the patch that you're working with to see how many tones are being triggered. I'm pretty confident that since it's only happening to the one patch that you've got maybe an extra layer being triggered that isn't needed (perhaps the piano is active twice? have you noticed any flanging on the sounds?). Let us know how it turns out. Sounds like a good idea. I guess I haven't dug too deep into this keyboard or some of these ideas would've occured to me before. Thanks again for your help. "Music should never be harmless." Robbie Robertson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Summers Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 I called Roland a few weeks ago. The tech's answer confused me. He said by editing a factory patch I might have thrown an error into the patch. I'm wondering if I didn't hear him right and was thinking of calling back for another tech. Thrown an error in the patch? I've never heard that one before....I'd call them back. Frankly, I think it was me, but that was what I came away with after talking with him. The ideas you guys have suggested here makes a lot of sense to me, so either my ears are working better today, or... perhaps I should stop drinking. "Music should never be harmless." Robbie Robertson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill H. Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 First suspect in a malfunctioning Fantom S is the knobs because it's very common for them to go screwy on these boards. So eliminate that possibility by turning them off. Make sure that the knob assignments on the screen have nothing but blanks after them. I don't know what kind of self-editing they could be doing to your patch, and they may not be the problem. But turn them off and see what you've got then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Winger Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 Edgar, Just ran across this thread and can virtually guarantee that Sven's nailed this one. The note dropping is a polyphony thing. I've had similar experience when I used to gig with my S88 (I now use my Nord Stage, just to save a few pounds). Polyphony of 64 sounds great, until you start layering patches. Edit the piano patch to mono (probably won't be an issue for most gigs). Check the synth patch to make sure it's not got multiple voices going. Watch the efx routings on the various patches. You might have accidentally imposed an efx routing on the piano patch. Also, check the mix you're using on the overall performance. Sometimes you accidentally boost one patch to the point where it's driving to distortion levels. Hopefully this helps. Cheers, Mark "I don't know anything about music. In my line, you don't have to." -Elvis Presley (1935-1977) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.