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Is Your Music Any Good? Find Out Here!!


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>>1. Just let it keep on rollin' along (I do like the interaction that's happening...)<< ------------------ William F. Turner Guitarist, Composer, Songwriter
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by dadabobro@yahoo.com: [b]The other half of Kosmolith, Bernarda, is Slovenian, and I am a red-blooded American, which I assumed was obvious from my music [/b] Ahh, I stand corrected.. although I thought I saw on your web page you were from there. My mistake. [b]Burger King (that's the metaphor for commercialized music, not Craig) is not the only restaurent in town, regardless of how delicious and affordable their products sometimes are.[/b] Well, as some have suggested, it probably would be good if people specified if they wanted comments directed to their production, engineering, arranging and or writing... My music is obviously not fit for the Burger King Way of Music either, so... [b]in my mother tongue, which is American, dammit, not English.[/b] http://www.mp3.com/Kosmolith You know under "info" on your page it says under "location" "Vienna, Austria"...? [b]http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald[/b]

Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com

Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

 

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien

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a note about mp3 quality: do you guys honestly want to give out immaculate versions of your songs for free on the internet? my theory is that mp3 messes up the quality just enough so that any person who really likes the music can buy a CD if they dont wanna "suffer" with 128 kbps. diGitaLia

-=| i.make..sound... |=-

-=| www.digitalianation.com |=-

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Chip- yes, because we live in Vienna. Before that, Slovenia, before that, Los Angeles..etc. all the way back to somewhere near Solvang, CA, for me, but I have to take my parents' word on that one! [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/cool.gif[/img] (Edit- by "pissed off by people here..." I didnt mean the forum, I meant some people I meet) (Second edit- sent you an email, from your homepage, to avoid misunderstanding and boring other readers) Also, I don't mean to disrespect Austrians- not only are they our "hosts", but in spite of any stereotypes, they come in all shapes, sizes and flavors, just like everyone else. To get back to business, been taking a bit of time, converting "audio" to mp3 in different ways and here are some conclusions: MOST IMPORTANTLY: the low audio quality level to which music can sink and still be heard as music by someone listening for music rather than technical aspects is pretty damn low. Many high-freq artifacts seem to be actually masked by the poor response of cheap multimedia speakers, which, like it or not, are probably your most common "stage" when you have stuff up on the internet. A blessing in disguise. Streaming lo-fi a la mp3.com is NOT converted from your original .wav or .aiff file, but from the 128kbs mp3 file you upload, compounding any sonic deviations from the recording path of righteousness. It is irrational to directly compare the sound quality of a 128kbs stereo mp3 you have done from your .wav file to the 28kbs mono you hear streamed from someone's site, as if they were on the same playing field. Stuff that relies primarily or entirely on timbral effect and is not recorded with skill will be utterly screwed. Recordings with low overall levels are more likely to be aluminum-foiled and motorboated-but the advice I have heard, maximize before converting (which I obviously didn't take) is patently no law- Kind of Blue, the 20-bit remaster, isn't exactly a big maximized square wave, and it sounds amazingly good "all the way down". Classical chamber and recital music, opera, very sparse and dynamic stuff...well... it should be listened to either live or on a hi-fi system anyway. Surfing through mp3.com, there is not a universal direct relation between compositional/performance quality and audio quality. However, periodically revisiting sites, it is clear, some people continue to learn about sound and some don't. Zero percent rocket science here. Basically this whole trip about mp3 format was brought on by Curve Dominant's reaction to hearing his music on mp3.com lo-fi for the first time- it got me to investigate the phenomena a bit more. To be honest, it is no longer a matter of concern to us- my curiosity about the issue has been satisfied. Obviously, you always try to improve the sound, but once you reach a certain level of sound quality- and that's a pretty low level-your music will be loved or hated as music. Which is good. Some thoughts to encourage people with musical talent but poor or undeveloped recording skills not to be shy. http://www.mp3.com/Kosmolith This message has been edited by dadabobro@yahoo.com on 01-29-2001 at 05:05 PM
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Listened to ONOFFON's Mardi Gras. First off, nice to hear a sax that's not trying to sound like Kenny G. Good enough tune and execution, and fun to listen to, but there's a problem with the timing. I don't mind looseness, as long as the groove is solid .. but there are places where the timing for various players seem to be fighting. It's not off by a lot, just enough to keep the tune from being really solid, and enough to keep people from moving their butts. If you're willing to take the time with "cut and slide" in a digital audio editor, you could tighten things up. But that would take hours, unless the tune was cut to a click so you can line up the bits of audio. In the future, try cutting to a click track, or setting up a drum machine to play the tune - then drop out the machine during the mix, but keep the "real" drummer.
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Next up: Mike Petrick. Listened to Trampoline; was expecting a remake of the Julian Cope song, so maybe I wasn't in a suitably receptive mood. Let's move on to "Well I Hadn't Thought." I like the originality very much. It goes a lot of different places, doesn't follow the rules, keeps me guessing. Here's how to make it a lot more effective: 1. Double the lead vocal. Not electronically; just sing the part again, and mix it about 6 db under the main vocal to start. Pan them both to center. Vary the relationship in level at different parts of the song; for more intensity, bring up the second vocal to almost the same level as the main vocal. To pull things back, mix the second vocal further down. 2. Play effects in real time on the vocal. A little manual playing with delay feedback and pitch shifting would be way cool. 3. The drum sound needs help. The acoustics are terrible. You'd be better off having the drummer play an electronic kit if you can't find a good space to record them. Also, I think the drums maybe need to be tuned up a bit...drums are definitely the weakest link here.
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>>BTW, is this the same Translux Theater listed at the Garage in the Fringe 99 - Triphop/Acid Jazz? You guys must have changed your style a bit....or I need a refresher genre course.<< Yeah, Steve, and no. Translux Theater is the name of a sort of floating/shifting ensemble that I co-ordinate, and that was a more recent version that you saw listed for the Fringe Festival. I only posted "Green Tunnel," which was recorded 6 years ago (seems like a lifetime) to dispell an accusation that I'm "some kid living in his granma's basement who doesn't even play," or whatever that was, although that is pretty f*cking funny now that I look at it. But since I produced it, I appreciate all the compliments it recieved from y'all on the sound quality. The truth is, that in spite of the fact that that CD "Never Today" sold well and got a lot of great reviews, I'm doing things completely different now, using different tools and working with a new breed of musicians who are more groove-oriented, but there's no way I'm going to post MP3's of that stuff until it's all finished and brought to market - and even then, streaming-audio only. That's why I had no problem posting "Green Tunnel": it's old sh*t that's off the market, so I don't give a f*ck. I'll say one thing for that crew of players on "Green Tunnel," though: when we played that sh*t live in the Philly clubs, it was fierce - they could throw down some nasty live jams. We used to butcher those songs so hard, they had to scrape 'em off the walls at the end of the night. I think we should kill this thread, if only so Chip will spend less time posting those long-assed posts, and spend more time practicing. My new digs are chill. It's nice to be back. This message has been edited by Curve Dominant on 02-03-2001 at 12:15 AM

Eric Vincent (ASCAP)

www.curvedominant.com

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[quote]Originally posted by Anderton: [b]Question time: This thread is getting reallllly long. Do you think I should: 1. Just let it keep on rollin' along (I do like the interaction that's happening...) 2. Close this thread, and start another from scratch (sort of "Son of Is Your Music Any Good? Find Out Here"). 3. Start a few genre-specific threads ("Is your Rock Music any good," "Is your techno/dance music any good," etc.). Opinions, anyone?[/b][/quote] Craig, with respect to your suggestions and those that others have posted, I think the easiest thing would be to simply open a new thread every month or two, such as "Submit Your Music Here - March 2001". A very large thread will become unmanageable. Editing replies is a job for a small army. And categorizing by genre is tricky, because not all music falls into predefined categories. My two bits.
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[quote]Originally posted by Curve Dominant: [b]I think we should kill this thread, if only so Chip will spend less time posting those long-assed posts, and spend more time practicing.[/b][/quote] So now I need to practice do I? I've not heard that one before, interesting... Dansouth has a good compromise: a new Submit your music" thread every month. [b]http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald[/b]

Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com

Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

 

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien

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[quote]In the future, try cutting to a click track, or setting up a drum machine to play the tune - then drop out the machine during the mix, but keep the "real" drummer.[/quote] Just want to say I completely disagree with this, if anything needs a bit of fixin on that track the guitar could be tightened up. The drums have a very authentic and dance worthy feel to them, if you change the drums by adding a click or whatever you change the style of music. I wouldn't change a thing, it sounds live, the guitar player rushes a little here and there but is our goal as musicians to completely remove the human element? Am I supposed to be aspiring to play like a machine? I know, who the hell am I? [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img], Just my opinion but listen again and you might agree with me.
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Curve Dominant: Curve and Chip... >>>I think we should kill this thread, if only so Chip will spend less time posting those long-assed posts, and spend more time practicing. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So now I need to practice do I? I've not heard that one before, interesting... You guys crack me up. The Jack Lemmon and Walter Matthau of the board, definitely. You guys love to hate each other...hehe [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]
"Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine"
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Thanks Craig for taking the time to listen. 'Mardi Gras' spent 35 straight days at #1 on the Mp3.com Latin Jazz charts in November 2000, is currently #4 on the SoundClick.com jazz charts amongst songs by Bill Evans, Lee Ritenour, Greg Karukas and Eric Marienthal, and has been nominated for Best Song of 2000 by four different websites, even with our rhythmic imperfections. As entirely self produced musicians, we strive for the best we can do on the shoestring budget we have to work with. Perhaps next time we'll do better. Thanks again, Von
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[quote]Originally posted by Tedster: [b]You guys crack me up. The Jack Lemmon and Walter Matthau of the board, definitely. You guys love to hate each other...hehe [/b][/quote] Tedster: you will note I didn't start this. You'll also note I tried for a while to ignore it, and it didn't stop. Note as well I've suggested the non-music posts be deleted. Finally - note I only responded in kind to the "long assed posts" remark. Dare I say I doubt you would have sat around silent if the table was turned on you.... [b]http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald[/b]

Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com

Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

 

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien

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(STONE COLD STEVE AUSTIN VOICE) WELL, Y'KNOW, YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT I WOULDN'T HAVE SAT AROUND THIS LONG IF THE TABLES WERE TURNED ON ME...I WOULDA SMASHED A METAL CHAIR OVER SOMEONE'S HEAD... (Other voice): Ted..."Monday Night Raw" is over.... Uhh..oh, y'mean me? I'm better now... hehehe... I agree, Chip. I wasn't accusing you of starting it. I just see a certain element of humor in everything. Forgive me... Group hug...
"Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine"
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>>Tedster: you will note I didn't start this. You'll also note I tried for a while to ignore it, and it didn't stop. Note as well I've suggested the non-music posts be deleted. Finally - note I only responded in kind to the "long assed posts" remark. Dare I say I doubt you would have sat around silent if the table was turned on you.... http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald<< DAMNIT, SHUT UP, FELIX!!!

Eric Vincent (ASCAP)

www.curvedominant.com

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[quote][b]Originally posted by Curve Dominant: DAMNIT, SHUT UP, FELIX!!![/b][/quote] I wish there was less of a soap opera element here... wait a second... didn't someone else say that???? [b]http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald[/b]

Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com

Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

 

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien

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Chip A Particular Bandwidth of Emotion; Nice guitar solo on this one. The Spanish influence is very obvious. For the most part, strings don't do much for me. But they seem to fit this track quite nicely. Persistance; Love the guitar work on this one. Can't say I'd change a thing. Nice intro. Abrupt ending gives it an "unfinished" feel, which I've always liked. It left me needing to hear the song again. Languid Shell Beach; A very relaxing piece. I like this one. I'd like it even more if the solo guitar had a bit more of a "fat" tone. Seemed bright and overpowering in certain spots, considering how the rest of the song is mixed. I'm thinking in terms of the solo on "Michelle" by the Beatles. Maybe not to that extent, but something along that vibe. Loved the percussion though. Very well-suited to the mood of the song. My favorite song out of all of them. After hearing what you do, I understand your view on the guitar sound on my song "Nothing Wrong" & how it should be more up-front. Nice work, Chip. This message has been edited by mdpetrick@yahoo.com on 01-31-2001 at 04:45 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by mdpetrick@yahoo.com:[/quote] [b]A very relaxing piece. I like this one. I'd like it even more if the solo guitar had a bit more of a "fat" tone. Seemed bright and overpowering in certain spots, [/b] I agree. The problem I had was cheesy preamps cranked trying to get a decent S/N level; if I pulled back I lost any sense of detail, and the noise became too obvious. So - hyper close miced, which meant the low end dynamics were crazy/impossible to contain. Plus, the "mic preamps" that I used are very colored/weird across 2k... which makes an SM81 that much more "SM81"... Hopefully I'm in the process of an "upgrade" that will allow a more natural sound. Ahg. [b]mixed. I'm thinking in terms of the solo on "Michelle" by the Beatles. Maybe not to that extent, but something along that vibe.[/b] Yeah, that would be nice, although if I pulled the mic back that far it probably would have sounded pretty junky I think. [b]Nice work, Chip. [/b] Thanks and thanks for the review... [b]http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald[/b]

Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com

Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

 

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien

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hey guys, i just put up my brand new mix "I Can't Breath" i think it is my best tune EVER. i am sure you will enjoy it as much as i do. i really mean that. please listen. its not the mix that was up yesterday, that one was not as good. isn't it amazing how the MIX can make the TUNE? if the mix is off, the tune has no energy. the first mix left me empty, with no hope. i sat down the next morning at 4:00am and remixed until i had to work at 8:00am. it made all the difference in the world. [url=http://www.mp3.com/xtac]www.mp3.com/xtac[/url] "I Can't Breath" (with your arms around me)
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coaster: Well I didn't hear the mix before this one, but I must say, the guitars and vocals sound really excellent! I can see why you're so excited about it. Never a day goes by when I am not irritated by drum machines [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img], but that aside, I do think this part (like most drum machine parts) could be improved if you rolled the high end off the cymbals and then turned the whole thing up a bit. That is, without all that high end you COULD turn the drums up without it really hurting your ears. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] And there's not much on the very bottom end - a good strong bass part or bass keyboard part would be cool. That's so great that you're starting to get really excited by your work! That's what it's all about! Keep it up... --Lee
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[quote]Originally posted by coaster: [b]thanks Lee. i will certainly try those ideas. i am irritated by drum machines as well.[/b][/quote] dude, that's rocking pretty good. i'd like to hear Lee's suggestions also - but really, your should collaborate with a drummer. this tune deserves a drummer and a more ballsy bass guitar to stand up to those guitars. I remember listening to your other cuts before - this seem like a notch up for sure. keep at it - I think you're on to something.

Steve Powell - Bull Moon Digital

www.bullmoondigital.com

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[quote]Originally posted by stevepow: [b] - but really, you should collaborate with a drummer. this tune deserves a drummer...[/b][/quote] Ahhh... it's so nice when someone other than me says that. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] --Lee This message has been edited by Lee Flier on 01-31-2001 at 11:47 PM
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