cdkey Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 Any suggestions for a second manual for a Nord stage compact (same as electro) I am trying to make a dual manual and was looking at maybe getting a second hand vk8 / cx3 / xk1 type of board to use with it. (korg cx3 seems good option size wise) although they have recently been cancelled by Korg over here. I have been using various different synth action boards with it but would like to improve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayvon Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 How about the Doepfer d3m? (sorry can't link direct to the page) It'd be cheaper than getting another clone although not quite so gas quenching. Just out of interest, I wonder if all the clonewheels out on the market use the same Fatar action? I gather that the stiffness of the springs can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer and that also some actions can be programmed to respond quicker than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 Just had a look a the doepfer d3 it appears to be a dual manual device already. I was after using another single manual board with similar type action to the nord either placed above it closely(cx3 may be good for this) or below maybe xk1 for this as it's a bit wider but this would put the keyboards out of alignment. It's a shame Clavia dont do a system setup like the Hammond xk system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jook Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Getting another clone is clearly the most expensive option. But y'know, as with most expensive options, it's certain to be fun if you can afford it For example, you can switch between the Electro and the CX-3's organ sounds as desired, or even combine them together! You'd also have real drawbars to grab. But the more practical option ... would be to get a MIDI controller like the Doepfer. The D3m is not dual manual... you're looking at the D3. This is the D3m: http://www.doepfer.de/d3m_angle.jpg More info by scrolling down on this page: http://www.doepfer.de/D3.htm You can even get wooden end blocks for it! :grin: And another option would be to get the StudioLogic VMK-161: http://www.studiologic.net/BOBimages/WMK161plus_Organ01.jpg More info here: http://www.studiologic.net/VMK-161org.html Both are waterfall organ keys, and are similar if not identical to the Electro's keybed (Fatar made) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 This looks like a good idea(both of them) I need to check the doepfer site more indepth. I only saw the dual manual one before. wonder if it would be possible to get drawbars for the d3m and link it to the stage compact? I have just come across a vk8 at a low price over here so may still go that route yet with the nord on top of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zahush76 Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 but you have a dual kb option on the nord stage! you can connect a simple midi kb - and then use the panel a/panel b function in order to program two different setting for both of the keyboards. why buy another one? Vermona Perfourmer mkii, Nord Stage 3 76 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 zahush: I am looking for a organ type lower/upper manual board to use with the stage, I already use synth action boards and a light weighted piano as the other board but I am looking for a similar action for a second board, the nearest one I have got at the moment is my old D-50 or pc2 but I am looking for similar size (physical width) and organ type keybed. so I was thinking of a second hand (used)clone for good price would seem to be a good idea or maybe one of the controllers listed above but these may actually be more expensive than a used clone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayvon Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Hey cdkey re the VK8 I demoed one today (In sound control Birmingham) I'm pretty sure it had different sized keys to the Nord Electro. The black keys seemed thinner and maybe also the white keys were shorter in length. The action was lighter than the Nord and I kept on experiencing double triggering when the keys bounced back. I'm not sure if you'd get used to it and adjust your style but it kept on happening when i'd do staccato slaps. I was impressed by the sound though, sounded more warm (smoother rolled off top end) and fuzzy than the Nord Electro 2 when used with the right amp models. One thing about the one I demoed today though, when I'd engage the percussion, the 1' drawbar sound would dissappear, very strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 I have read about this type of thing with the cx3 as well but they may have had some software change on it to stop it. I did have a VK8 last year for a short period but it got returned pronto due to cosmetic damage when it was being delivered.I had forgot that there was a key size difference between them, (good point). Is the Electro/stage compact some kind of one off hybrid keybed? does anybody know what else uses this particular key setup? what did you run the the VK8 with when you tried amp wise in the store to notice the percussion V drawbar dropout? I had heard other people mention the percussion thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayvon Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I just read an SOS review of the VK8 and apparently the 1' drawbar dissappearing when you select perc happens on some real Hammonds. Quite why they chose to implement this instead of just letting users push the 1' drawbar in I don't know. I was monitoring with some nice closed back headphones just so you know. Re the double triggering, it didn't happen on the other keyboard/synth sounds, just the organ. I know on the VR760 you can choose when the sound is triggered to try and stop double triggering. Again from an SOS review, apparently you can choose from the sound getting triggered 3mm or 6mm down. I'm a complete newbie when it comes to organs so take what I say about clonewheels with a pinch of salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I just read an SOS review of the VK8 and apparently the 1' drawbar dissappearing when you select perc happens on some real Hammonds. Quite why they chose to implement this instead of just letting users push the 1' drawbar in I don't know. I was monitoring with some nice closed back headphones just so you know. Re the double triggering, it didn't happen on the other keyboard/synth sounds, just the organ. I know on the VR760 you can choose when the sound is triggered to try and stop double triggering. Again from an SOS review, apparently you can choose from the sound getting triggered 3mm or 6mm down. I'm a complete newbie when it comes to organs so take what I say about clonewheels with a pinch of salt. Losing the top drawbar when you engage percussion is TOTALLY authentic to a real Hammond. In fact, that is where a real Hammond gets its percussion tone. There are certain vintage recordings (cannot recall which Santana song...maybe Evil Ways) when the player is doing something like 888000000 with percussion and then they toggle the percussion off and it goes back to 888000008. That is a totally cool effect. The Hammond XK organs have the ability to do this or not do it. Some others, like the Electro, do not follow the original paradigm and give you 888000008 even with percussion...not authentic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matted stump Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I just read an SOS review of the VK8 and apparently the 1' drawbar dissappearing when you select perc happens on some real Hammonds. Quite why they chose to implement this instead of just letting users push the 1' drawbar in I don't know. I was monitoring with some nice closed back headphones just so you know. Yes, this is a feature of every console Hammond. Real Hammond players often want this same behavior on a clonewheel, because a common organ technique is to use the 888000008 setting, then obtain 888000000 with percussion simply by toggling on the percussion switch. Moe --- "I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker http://www.hotrodmotm.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayvon Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 Seems like the XK system has got the ideal setup with the choice of having this effect on or off. It's funny how players will pick up on shortcomings and use them to effect. Stuff like turning the off switch to get pitch bend. I'm guessing they didn't mention that one in the B3 manual... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 24, 2007 Author Share Posted March 24, 2007 Kayvon: have you tried the VR760 if yes what type of keys did that have (I looked at this previously and nearly got one from e-bay a while back but thought it had normal fantom type keys)Does anyone make 73 note control boards like the doepfer studio logic type listed above or is it possible to diminish a 76 by a few keys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b3_john Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I just read an SOS review of the VK8 and apparently the 1' drawbar dissappearing when you select perc happens on some real Hammonds. Quite why they chose to implement this instead of just letting users push the 1' drawbar in I don't know. I was monitoring with some nice closed back headphones just so you know. Yes, this is a feature of every console Hammond. Real Hammond players often want this same behavior on a clonewheel, because a common organ technique is to use the 888000008 setting, then obtain 888000000 with percussion simply by toggling on the percussion switch. +1 Its not just that you can do it, its that is works so well. Its nice that some manufacturers like H/S that have a "fix" for this also allow you to "unfix" it. :grin: Slight threadjack, but of all the things that clonewheel manufacturers decide to "fix" about the original, they always seem to do everything but add percussion to the lower manual. Huh, go figure... John GP sacred cow of the year: Jimmy Vaughan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayvon Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 Hey cdkey, I can't remember what type of keys the VR-760 has beyond being waterfall. b3_john: I thought the percussion was quiet on the lower manual when I did splits on my friends Electro! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 VR-760 is a special waterfall keyboard. It be VERY VERY nice. Not sure if the VK8 shares the same action, but it is a good one. On a separate topic, none of the clonewheels have offered percussion on the lower manual. :-o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matted stump Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Sure about that? When I split my Stage, I can get percussion on both sides of the split (with different settings). Would it work with a second keyboard plugged in? I dunno. Moe --- "I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker http://www.hotrodmotm.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Sure about that? When I split my Stage, I can get percussion on both sides of the split (with different settings). Would it work with a second keyboard plugged in? I dunno. Dave, the Stage may be special due to the way they handle the dual manuals. Cannot remember from my brief stint with the Stage Compact. All the others only have percussion on the upper manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Eric; how close in feel is the VR760 to the stage compact / electro keys? do you happen to know any other clones that have very similar key feel? appart from the 61 controllers above?Is the vr760 by any chance the same as the G70 keybed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matted stump Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I played a V-Combo once (isn't that the same as the VR760?) I thought the waterfall action was great - actually better by a noticeable bit than the Electro. Moe --- "I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker http://www.hotrodmotm.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdkey Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Yes, I think it is the same board (VR760 / V-combo) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Eric; how close in feel is the VR760 to the stage compact / electro keys? do you happen to know any other clones that have very similar key feel? appart from the 61 controllers above? Is the vr760 by any chance the same as the G70 keybed? The VR760 and the V-Combo are the same instrument. The VR760 is the best-feeling waterfall keyboard I have played on a digital instrument. Very smooth, tight and robust. Not far from the Electro, but slicker and more solid feeling. It is NOT the same as the G70 keybed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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