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neck joint structural differences: bolt-on vs. set-neck construction


MILLO

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So, I've asked this before in threads w/ other topics and it has been answered partially, I believe.

 

So, are there any actual difference between the neck pockets of a bolt-on design and a set-neck design? IS a set-neck electric guitar at an angle usually just because regardless of whether it's glued or bolted, the design on the specific instrument requires it to be angled? Are glued-in neck pockets cut/carved deeper into the wood?

 

I was wondering if I could order, for example, body/neck set from one of those electric-guitar-parts-manufacturing companies but WITHOUT any holes for neck joint and have [maybe?] a luthier [or me? gasp!] glue them together.

 

Please answer and/or discuss and/or speculate to your heart's content.

 

Thanks! :thu:

"Without music, life would be a mistake."

--from 'Beyond Good and Evil', by Friedrich Nietzsche

 

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the angle of a set neck ala LP is more due to the arched top and bridge design. to keep the strings at a sensible height.

the original LP had a trapeze and since the neck angle wasn't right they had to feed the strings under instead of over, this was corrected.

the design of a stoptail and tuneomatic require more of an angle in the neck unless it is routed into the body like Godin does.

a set neck has a smaller "tongue" than the heel of a bolt on. there are more contact areas on a set neck for glueing because of the way the "heel" is routed to make the tongue. part of the finger board is a contact area for glueing.

i would think you could glue a bolt on neck on if the tolerances were tight enough.

but i doublt it would be as solid as a set neck that was designed that way.

i have pondered that if you glued the neck in on a bolt on and then drilled holes like you would for screws and glued in dowels it would be solid.

the dowels would act as the screws.

there is nothing wrong with bolt on necks as long as they are free of all finish and tight and flat.

Godin has mastered this in spades.

the LGsp90 is solid mahgnay and sustains like a LP.

i do believe something changes when glueing a neck in, the twang factor softens. certain frequencies are dampened.

the angle of a neck has a play in tone as well. go to Godins website for an explaination.

neck angle and pitch

here is a pic of a set neck tenon, and the extra surfaces to glue.

neck tenon

that picture show a much larger tenon than a bolt on would have, but most setneck guitars do not have that size normally, that is more of a vintage size.

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This might be absofirkinlutelyobvious and then perhaps not:

 

If you haven't carved out a neck pocket before I'd suggest you try the bolt on first.

 

When you do feel comfortable attempting a set neck be sure to use animal based glue or an alternative that can be softened and released without too much damage being inflicted on the neck or body.

 

There's a beautiful bookmatched maple LP hangin' from the rafters of my shop just to remind me of the perils of poor routing and epoxy glue.

 

Good luck with that.

I still think guitars are like shoes, but louder.

 

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Originally posted by Guitars are like shoes. But louder.:

...When you do feel comfortable attempting a set neck be sure to use animal based glue or an alternative that can be softened and released without too much damage being inflicted on the neck or body.

 

There's a beautiful bookmatched maple LP hangin' from the rafters of my shop just to remind me of the perils of poor routing and epoxy glue.

 

Good luck with that.

:mad: Someone should tell the schmucks at Takamine about this. :rolleyes:

 

When my Tak FP-360SC's headstock broke off in an accident I couldn't get any information from them about how to go about buying a new neck. Not even when I was a salesman at MARS. Several years later I found out why.

 

The luthier I'd brought it to, who had recently set up QC for Kaman at their new Goodlettsville, TN distribution center and was a Takamine authorized repair center was not told they used epoxy to secure the neck and bridge. he couldn't understand why they wouldn't sell him a new neck for the instrument.

 

It took several phone calls and favors from his friends at Tak before they sold him a damaged FP-360SC for the neck, again without a word about the epoxy.

 

He steamed that guitar for two days before calling his contacts about why the neck wouldn't release! THEN they informed him of the epoxy, rendering the damaged guitar useless for repairing my guitar. That's when he hooked me up with a Blueridge that, for more than $100 less than I'd paid for the Tak, (At cost when I worked at GC 8 years earlier!) I received a much better instrument, professionally setup with an L.R. Baggs Ribbon p'up and preamp installed. It sounded a lot better, too.

 

I wouldn't ever have had the Tak repaired had it not been for my friendship with the luthier at MARS. He fixed it for a pittance. I'll never buy another Tak again. Their use of epoxy, then crappy customer service in dealing with my issue ensured that.

It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman

 

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I don't understand why getting the neck pocket back to original size should be such a problem? Tell me where the problem is? if the neck is set in epoxy and it won't release why wouldn't you cut the neck off flush or near flush with the body and route out the remaining neck sectiion untill you had removed everything including the epoxy joint? If you have a router template in aluminum and it is laid out with precision there is NO reason why you cannot duplicate the neck pocket within .005 of it's original size.
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Originally posted by Xplorer:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g30/scmcfaul/itwar_4.jpg

BC Rich's new Invisibot Technology!

Yamaha has been using a rear mounted neck on the Frank Gambale AESFG model for several years.

the trem springs mount right on the end of the neck for extra energy transfer.

all pickups are rear mounted for a super clean look.

 

maybe it is catching on.

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The area of the neck that glues into the body on a setneck guitar is called the tenon, and is huge compared to the neck heel of a bolt-on neck. Glueing a bolt-on neck in place will not make it sound like a setneck, but it might be interesting--I've heard of guys doing it before, but as in the case of the story of the Takamine, replacing the neck could be impossible, or at the very least, expensive, as could the refretting process.
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