tennis elbow

[Gifthorse]

I have this. I believe I either got it at work or from the gym.

 

Anyways, it won't go away it has been 3 months. I am a laborer so it is tough for it to heal up.

 

I am making the diagnosis based on my research on the internet and the fact that my Dad has had it off and on his whole life.

 

It doesn't effect my guitar playing (thank God I play like 3-5 hours a day), but it does make it so when I am done my arm aches with certain movements. I am hoping it isn't tendonitis. I play 12 string and I play hard always.

 

I picked up something heavy at work last week and it really worsened again.

[JoeWalsh21]

I'd say go to the doctor anyway, you never know and maybe he can even give u something to ease that pain. Don't worry man, just keep a close watch on that arm and don't over do it. But still go check it out, hope it gets better!

 

Steve

[Tedster]

Tendinitis (actually it is spelled that way) is the same thing as tennis elbow. I have it too...occasionally. Mainly from working out. One thing that you can do to alleviate it a bit...and you have to start slowly and very light...is do wrist (forearm) curls...both forward and reverse. Lay your forearms on your knees, palms up, so your wrists are hanging down over your knees. Using a light weight (light dumbbells or a very light...not an Olympic...bar), and no more that wrist movements, curl the weights up, say 15 reps or so. Then flip your forearms over...palms down, hanging over your knees, and repeat the movement but in reverse. I think this latter one is actually even better than the first for strengthening that tendon. Again, go really, really light. You don't want any further strain on the tendon.

[Bejeeber]

From what I've seen and experienced, you'll have a much better chance at recovery with an accupuncturist than with an M.D.

[Rhino Madness]

Wearing a brace on your forearm close to your elbow can help alleviate the pain/discomfort. like others, I really encourage you to see your doctor about it.

 

I got tennis elbow from repeatedly using the mouse on a less than optimal computer setup at work. Learning to switch the mouse on either side (left or right handed), getting a better setup and wearing the brace for a few months really helped.

 

Tendinitis is insidious and can flare up again so I learned to recognize its early symptoms and try to stop whatever causes the extra strain whenever it shows up.

 

Good luck and make sure you deal with it sooner than later.

[picker]

A freind of mine got some stuff at the health food store, and it took care of his tennis elbow. I'll ask him what it was.

[Fumblyfingers]

Yeah it will bother you for a while and then one day it will just be gone....I have had several run in's with this injury. My job has a lot of lifting and stuff that aggravates it...it sucks.

 

That brace that goes on the forearm helps a bit, you set the pressure of it with a velcro strap. If you have the pain in the soft tissue/muscle near the elbow ( tracing a line on the top of your hand by the middle finger knuckle back to about 6" from the elbow joint ) use ice packs on it to help get the inflammation down.

 

This is just one of those injuries that seems to take a long time to go away.

[revolead]

Like any sports injury: stretch, ice, massage, and eventually, exercise. It is really that simple.

[musicalhair]

As Tedster says, that has been my experience. I detail a regimine I worked out with physical therapists in old posts ... in some threads here. Ice after a heavy work out or after playing if it feels aggravated. Stretching, slow steady no bouncing, is very important. I have a tendency to stretch for far less time than I should. Too little stretching out hinders recovery from this. There is really no such thing as too much stretching-- I'm not saying "too far", but I mean the amount of time.

[Tone Taster]

weights give you tendonitis. You can get stronger and more toned doing bodyweight calisthenics and not get the tendinitis

 

go to mattfurey.com and get the combat conditioning and combat abs course

 

I challenge any of you "benchers" to do 20 overhand pull ups or 30 Hindu-Push ups

 

I challenge you pavement pounders who think jogging is good for you to do 500 Hindu squats

 

Herschel Walker and Ray lewis (two of some of the most in shape athletes in history) do about 90 % calisthenics and 10% weights

 

The weights are what's giving y'all the tendinitis. Use your natural body weight and work with that doing exercises which involve your whole body as a unit rather than isolating muscle groups.

 

I had tendinitis and had to quit playing for almost 2 years from 90-92. I did yoga, Chi Kung (qui gong- hard style Tai Chi), swimming, and martial arts to get rid of it.

 

Look, for the dudes benching 250 and way up, there are farm boys slinging hay who have 10 times the functional strength as the "benchers"

[Tedster]

When I said "weights" I said "light". No more than a 5 lb dumbell...actually, with that weight for a wrist curl, it's more of a stretch than a free weight thing. Stretching is a good thing.

[Tone Taster]

Originally posted by Tedster:

When I said "weights" I said "light". No more than a 5 lb dumbell...actually, with that weight for a wrist curl, it's more of a stretch than a free weight thing. Stretching is a good thing.

Right On - Work smarter not harder !! That's the only way to go

[Gifthorse]

Thanks for the workout tip Tedster you rock I will save it and use it,

 

and all the support. I agree 100 % Yze on what you said. I think you can do everything at home if you can also do cardio. Before all I used was a pull up bar, this thing that elevated pushups, and free wieghts. I used to use my acoustic guitar case as a bench for these free wieghts. Now it has a bunch of duct tape on it. Not a good idea..

 

I am compulsively addicted to playing guitar. It is funny I quit for 3 years or so and didn't play at all. I just wanted to play Unreal. We all go through changes.

 

I am going to stop playing for a few days and take some advil. It is tough not to play cuz I just put on new strings on my 12.

 

I am just going to stop lifting anything with my left arm. I want to avoid going to the doctor cuz frankly you never know who you are dealing with. There are some retards out there. My Mom had one that made her almost never walk again. He said he was sorry and she didn't sue him. I always think, she could have been rich!! He knew how nice she was. I wanted to beat his head in with his leg.

[D_dup3]

While I agree with much of what's been written above I don't think any of them hit the target point 100% (& maybe I won't either ).

 

The body is made to do work, often more strenuous than what we engage in today. The problem is that people ofen try to accelerate their progress both in activity & healing beyond what they are prepared for.

The main thing that will prevent these problems is to understand how your musclature is designed & to work in ways that are compatible with it, rather than what's habitual or seems "cool" (sorry but all that chatter you heard as a kid about don't slouch & sit up straight, etc., was really good advice!).

Another thing, as has been mentioned, is to counterbalance activities with a concerted set of muscular relaxation activities.

 

It's hard for anyone to say why you developed this at this time without knowing exactly how you do things but I'd suggest that you get some advice from a variety of sources , especially some who can actually examine you, rather than depend on Net research or even the opinion of a single live medico, no matter what their specialty.

One thing I've learned is that doctors are as variable in many matters as those in other fields; some are up-to-date, some not; some stick with what they learn from mainstream teaching; some explore a wider range of learning. As in any area you explore,

never just go with one source for all your info.

 

Also I note that you mention that you play a lot & that you play "hard".

Many players play a lot harder than necessary. If you play electric guitar you generally can lighten up a lot (that's what the electronics are for!) & sometimes that even improves your sound & projection; the same can be true for acoustic players.

It's a fact of acoustics that over-playing can actually begin to limit the projection of sounds. Explore your dynamic range & listen for when you reach the limits of what is actually being achieved compared to just trying to physically overpower the instrument.

 

Also make sure that you break up your playing sessions with some stretching & relaxing of, variously, your fingers, your wrists, forarms, elbows & shoulders[*]...& consider the way you hold tools, including your guitar, & whether other methods may be more ergonomically beneficial.

 

[*]None of these areas function independently of each other. Did you know, for instance, that the tendons that pull your fingers open are all a single unit that extends from your forearm to just behind your fingernail? Or that a poorly balanced guitar strap could cause you pain anywhere in your arm or hand?

[Big Red 67]

Alfalfa can help with joint and tendon pain.

[mdrs]

flag....Do you know how you first "injured" it, or did it just start hurting? What kind of work do you actually do? Which arm is it? Do you play guitar righty?

 

If I followed you correctly, you said that it did not hurt while you played, but it was achey and sore after you played. Is that correct?

 

With a bit more info, I might be able to give you a couple of ideas about getting better.

 

Don

[picker]

My friend told me that his wife got some pills that combine 500 mg of Gloucosamine and 400mg of Chondroitin at a health food store. He says that when he started taking it, it killed his tennis elbow pain. Gonna give it a shot myself.

[mdrs]

Glucosamine and Chondroitin Sulfate are components of cartilage.....the structures that form a cushion between the bones in any of your joints. Some studies seem to show that taking Glucosamine and chondroitin, in conjunction with anti inflammatory medicines (ibuprophen, motrin, aleve, etc.) can help make the cartilage "healthier", and thereby lessen the pain of osteoarthritis. So, Glucosamine and Chondroitin suppliments may help people suffering from arthritis. For some arthritis sufferers, these do not work.

 

Tennis elbow is a tendonitis, not arthritis. Tendonitis is an inflammation of a tendon (the structures that connect muscles to bones). So, I'm not sure that taking chondroitin and glucosamine would actually help with a tendonitis.

 

There are several common sense things you can do to help get rid of any tendonitis.

 

The first thing is to stop doing whatever it is that is causing the injury and subsequent inflammation of the tendon. This is sort of like putting your hand in a fire. The way to cure this problem, is to take you hand out of the fire!! So, for instance, if after flag plays, he notices that the tennis elbow pain is worse, then he should consider not playing for a while. He might have to stop for a couple of days, or possibly longer. Or, at the very least, consider playing easier, and paying attention to his body position, where he's holding the guitar, etc.. Once you have an inflammed tendon, even seemingly minor activity using that tendon can perpetuate the problem. He should also think about what activities he does at work that might be making it worse, and if possible avoid these activities.

 

Secondly, consider taking an anti imflammatory, such as over the counter motrin, or aleve. Make sure you are not allergic to it. And, watch out for stomach irritation from the anti inflammatory. Try taking them after meals.

 

Thirdly, I'd try that "tennis elbow" velcro device, that you can usually get in any drug store. It wraps around your arm, just below the elbow. If you can't find it at your drug store, ask at your local physical therapy center....they'll have one. Wearing it helps with the pain. It also functions as a reminder to you to watch what you are doing. Often times a tendonitis is healing, and the pain is going away. That's when you are likely to do something that re-injures the tendon, and the pain starts all over again!

 

Let us know how you do, flagshipmile!

 

Don

[Gruupi]

I had a bit of tennis elbow back when I tried lifting. It got to the point I had a hard time picking up a phone with my arm outstretched. I bought this little velcro wrap thing that you put on your forearm real close to your elbow when lifting. I did take a couple weeks off doing the movement that was causing the problem (which I forgot now what it was), when I startedusing the wrap the pain never really came back much. I was carefull if I felt anything at all after that I would slow down on that movement for a bit.

 

Doh, I just read Mdrs's post basicly saying to get the same thing I had, but it works.

[Ricochet]

This malady can be part of a syndrome including deteriorating vision and hair sprouting from the palms. Be careful.

[Gifthorse]

Cool thanks guys. I will walk over and check that out Picker, there is a health store near me thanks brother.

 

Don, I landscape and cut grass. I know I strained it at the gym or other activities.. Work may exacerbate the problem.

It is fine when I play guitar. I think the angle lets my tendons rest. I am a righty. When I get done playing if I extend my left arm completely it has some pain. Not tons, but enough for me to be like "this isn't what it was."

I am quite sure it isn't from my guitar playing. I was working out with too much wieght for curls or dips with no help or something else with my girlfriend.

 

 

As for D's comments also true. Working out is really begging for something to go wrong. As for attack, I wasn't referring to right hand technique. My left arm. I have always strived to be able to make my picked notes sound hammered on, and my hammered on notes sound picked. I know that doesn't make much sense, but it is true. I believe that is where technique meets in the middle and makes you have less limitation. I have a good ear and I am aware of dynamics and how hard I need to play to achieve my vision.

 

Steve Yzerman just retired.

[mdrs]

flag....tennis elbow involves the griping muscles. When you are playing, your left hand is of course gripping the neck of the guitar. So, while it does not hurt while you are playing, the fact that it has some pain after playing when you straighten your left arm may mean that grabbing the neck and playing is causing just enough slight additional injury to the tendonitis that it will not go away as quickly.

 

Also, all that stuff I said in my long post above, basically, was saying that chondroitin and glucosamine will likely not help you, since you seem to have tennis elbow tendonitis, not arthritis. Those thing are really meant more for arthritis sufferers.

 

Good Luck

 

Don

[fesquell]

Hey Bruce, Malmsteen was practicly dead and look at him now! Go ahead with your band. You have the gift... nurture it well!

[Gifthorse]

Im sorry Don, I thought I read every post.. Sorry I am a space case. Thanks for that advice-- very good.

 

I will try and get the arm brace this week. My other guitarist's dad is a big tennis player and his buddy uses one of those and can play perfect with it on. I read it also cuts off circulation, but I would only use it some of the time.

[mdrs]

no problem, flag....make sure you don't put it on so tight that it does cut off circulation. The velcro on the "band" will allow you to adjust how tight it is.

 

Don

[Gifthorse]

Thanks Don. By the way Don is a cool name to have. My other guitarist was going sick about those arm braces saying they solve alot of the problem. You rock.

 

 

Hey fesquell did you get my email?

 

Excellent CD. I have it in my MP3 player. You rule dude. By the way, you still didn't tell me what you did to get that great recorded tone.

 

http://www.myspace.com/tomothysillytons

 

is my Myspace. You should have a myspace too. I await your Myspace invite. Your music deserves Myspace to give it a broader audience. Kickass dude, you rock!! Hey if you already do, add me.

 

By the way guys, check out Fesquell he is a really cool solo acoustic player.

[Gruupi]

Your right about lifting weights and asking for something to go wrong. A bass player buddy of mine was doing chins and pulled his bicep, I mean really pulled it. The muscle completly detached. His wife said the first thing he did was run and grab his bass to see if he could play as he had a gig that night. I guess he didn't really know how bad he was injured but I think he did the gig anyway.

[mdrs]

OUCH! That ain't good.

 

Don

[Eric VB]

Bruce, man, I feel your pain. Really. I have tendonitis in my left arm as well. Previously, I had gotten it in my right arm from -- amazingly -- playing tennis! I went in to see my doc last time and he gave me a "so sad, too bad" story about there's really nothing that's going to make it go away other than time. Like 6 months to a year.

 

I did my left arm after I sliced my thumb open over Thanksgiving trying to carve a turkey. I didn't want to put any pressure on that thumb, so like a dolt I started grasping and lifting things with just my fingers.

 

I've never tried the brace because although it makes the pain less, it doesn't prevent further injury. I'd rather have the pain there to remind me not to screw it up any more.

[Gifthorse]

Good point Eric, I am going to get the brace anyways and use it for work, I know pain sometimes is good if it tells you not to do something. Right now I have been doing most of it with my right arm when I need to lift anything.

 

Hey did you get my phone message?