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OT: Johnny Rotten on Jimmy Kimmel tonight


WornNeck

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I was working on an MTV thing several years ago and we were all standing in the food line at the caterer. Johnny Rotten came by with a small entourage, going to another stage but when he spotted our catering truck he broke from his people and came up and went to the front of the line and helped himself to a cup of Java. When he spotted me grinning at this antic he said to me "Oi snuck one in, didn't oi " It was downright hilarious,totally rock and roll copping the free stuff and all, but you had to have been there to hear that accent.
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I've been kinda undecided on what I make of him; I wanted to think highly of him in some ways, but other times I get an impression that he's another phony full-of-$4!+ no different from the types he's supposedly railing against. Maybe it's just that he's simply human, huh? Anybody got any ideas either way?

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Originally posted by guitarisawayoflife21:

... 'cause whats more anti establishment that product advertisement? :P

Depends. There is nothing punkrock about Pepsi using the Ramones' "Blitzkrieg Bop" in an advertisement featuring cute bouncing soda cans. I'm ambivalent about Pontiac using the Clash's "Should I Stay, Or Should I Go?" in their ad for the new G6 sports sedan. Using a Sex Pistols' song in an advertisement could be punk as f***, if it's the the right product. I'd love to see a Sex Pistols tune used in an ad for the new generation dual-core Macs. I think Johnny Rotten and Steve Jones also appreciate the possible irony of using a Sex Pistols' son in an ad. Imagine an ad for a Samsung flatscreen television featuring the Pistols' "Pretty Vacant"! The Sex Pistols' music is ugly, so who in their right mind would think a Sex Pistols' tune would encourage housewives and little old ladies to buy dishsoap (or tampons, etc.)?

 

What could be more punk rock than writing a catalogue of songs berating capitolists and mainstream consumers ... only to cash out 30 years later by selling the same capitolists and consumers those same songs. Why not let greedy fools pay you big bucks to tell them how greedy and ignorant they are? Reminds me of the scene in _Fight Club_ where Jack/Tyler says he's selling rich women their own fat asses back to them.

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So, yet another public flogging of John Lydon. History does indeed repeat itself - reminds me of the mockery of modern art in the Degenerates Exhibition of 1937....

 

Lydon did have a fairly good band for about 14 years, PiL. He was in the Sex Pistols for - what? Two years? I think he took full advantage of his hunched back and staring eyes caused by childhood spinal meningitis (sort of ruled out his chances of becoming the next Englebert Humperdink) - he used what otherwise would have been a disability to create, with the help of Malcolm McLaren, an image for himself, and became a success. That's show business for you.

 

 

Some get it, some don't.

This interview with John Lydon might surprise and even enlighten some of you:

"I\'m not a singer, I\'m telling you how I feel, there\'s a difference"

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Originally posted by Philemec:

So, yet another public flogging of John Lydon. History does indeed repeat itself - reminds me of the mockery of modern art in the Degenerates Exhibition of 1937....

Yes, precisely. :thu:

 

Here were are, something like 30 years after the event and people are still going on about it. **yawn**

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Originally posted by ellwood:

I think they where and are just as establishment as anyone else! It's just like all the anti gov. bull crap the MC5 used to rattle on about and then when you went to one of their rehearsals laugh about it and just want to talk about the possiable cash they where going to make, what a farce that was!

That's an informal logical fallacy called a "false dillema". There's no rule that says a person who hates the government and mainstream society can't also enjoy making a buck and being a celebrity. A punk rocker is only a hypocrite if they espouse revolution during their rise to fame, then embrace the status quo after they become millionaires. Even though punks seem united in their politics, there are actually two sides to the punk anti-establishment sentiment: the anarchist/libertarian perspective and the revolutionary/socialist perspective. Making a buck actually fits both perspectives. The anarchists want the government to step out of their way, so people are free to make a buck, while the revolutionaries believe they are on the losing side of the class struggle so making a buck is actually economic justice. The real hypocrites among musicians aren't the punk rockers.

 

Remember, Elwood, you're exactly the type of person the punks are trying to piss off. This is not an accident. Obviously, you have enough money to afford many nice things and you even seem to have the spare time to enjoy them. It makes sense that you would resent anyone who challenges the status quo and claims the system isn't fair. But not everyone has it as nice as you, dawg. The fact that you disagree with something doesn't mean it is stupid.

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i remember a couple years ago i saw something on MTV (yes i was stupid once too), it was an interview with him by Kurt loader? i think thats the dude, and kurt was getting really pissed because this guy was being a complete wanker. Like he was just acting so childish and Kurt was like "oh come on dude fuckin grow up"
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Originally posted by NaotaForHonesty:

i think thats the dude, and kurt was getting really pissed because this guy was being a complete wanker. Like he was just acting so childish and Kurt was like "oh come on dude fuckin grow up"

Yeah, dude, grow up. You're on MTV now!

 

Pass me a bucket. :rolleyes:

 

 

jrob: I'm not sure the Pistols ever really embraced the concept of revolution.

 

IIRC, by the mid 70s "revolution" was starting to sound like a bunch of hippie dribble. Most of the people that had burned stuff in 1968 had basically made their compromises with the State and were having a great old time telling everyone that came afterwards that they had been the true rebels and done it with much more style than ppl these days. Like old farts have always done. I think JR was pretty much aware that the revolution had gone nowhere and never would and that was part of the cynicism of the Pistols.

 

Anyway, seeing as the Pistols never said that they wanted "revolution", what's wrong with them making a few bucks? If the system has to come to them in order to sell Toyotas or whatever, rather than the other way around, that sounds pretty cool.

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"Remember, Elwood, you're exactly the type of person the punks are trying to piss off. This is not an accident. Obviously, you have enough money to afford many nice things and you even seem to have the spare time to enjoy them. It makes sense that you would resent anyone who challenges the status quo and claims the system isn't fair. But not everyone has it as nice as you, dawg. The fact that you disagree with something doesn't mean it is stupid"

 

Jrob, fair enough, but first I gotta say the Punks never really pissed me off, they had no impact on me one way or another, it's just that I think they are funny and predictable, what I thought about them in their day and now is the same. It's just that I have some close personal insight into some of this and have been very close to people like the MC5, Patti Smith and a few others, and got to hear how they really feel about things that allot of people would most likely not believe where possible from their public face or farce which ever fits the situation. I have lots of things because I have worked hard in school and in life to get and have made the time to enjoy them.

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Every time Johnny speaks... I just giggle.

He's just hilarious to me.

 

I take everything he says with a giant block of salt.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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Originally posted by Kramer Ferrington III.:

I'm not sure the Pistols ever really embraced the concept of revolution.

I never said they did. First of all, it doesn't make sense to act as if the Sex Pistols had a shared message. Johnny Rotten was the public face of the Sex Pistols, and Rotten is basically a nihilist. He would embrace either the cause of anarchy or economic injustice, if it made someone else look bad ... and he probably thinks both ideals are bullshit. Erik (CMDN) has the right idea about Johnny Rotten, don't take anything to seriously.

 

When I mentioned anarchist and revolutionary sentiments in punk rock, I was talking about punk music in general, since Elwood had brought up MC5 and Patti Smith as further examples of what he believes is hypocracy. Surely, no one would disagree that the Clash espoused revolutionary politics. Hell, within the Ramones the opposing ideals from Joey (revolutionary/socialist) and Johnny (anarchist/libertarian) were a major source of conflict. I was just trying to point out that neither of these two anti-establishment sentiments imply punk rockers shouldn't try to make money.

 

Originally posted by ellwood:

Jrob, fair enough, but first I gotta say the Punks never really pissed me off, they had no impact on me one way or another, it's just that I think they are funny and predictable, what I thought about them in their day and now is the same. It's just that I have some close personal insight into some of this and have been very close to people like the MC5, Patti Smith and a few others, and got to hear how they really feel about things that allot of people would most likely not believe where possible from their public face or farce which ever fits the situation.

If punk rock really "had no impact on you one way or another", then why do you go out of your way to let people know how stupid you think it is? To the contrary, I think punk rock is very important to you because you are constantly looking for external validation of your own ideals. Doesn't matter. The fact that you had negative experiences when you bumped into the MC5 and Patti Smith doesn't mean you have any deep insights about who they are as people. Honestly, your experiences with these artists would be very biased by your pre-existing musical and political ideals. You were already looking for negative things to say about these people before you met them. :wave:
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Jrob, Fred Smith (Sonic) is or was my first cousin, and Patti I know well even before Fred married her. Jrob, I have lots of insights, Fred was a good guy, I loved him and I miss him, I just wanted to bring a little light on the subject that's all. Oh and by the way the rich guy in the suburbs earned every penny of what he has, I know how to play the blues very well and for all you know maybe I didn't always live in the burbs, maybe I got these things honestly and through hard work.
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Originally posted by ellwood:

Oh and by the way the rich guy in the suburbs earned every penny of what he has, I know how to play the blues very well and for all you know maybe I didn't always live in the burbs, maybe I got these things honestly and through hard work.

:thu: Everybody gets the blues, even Jrob. everybody is a hypocrite, too on some level. Everyone has a sphincter, also
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Speaking of money, more words from Mr Lydon ..... "But that nervous energy and doubt and fear of your own capabilities is what makes it, and absolutely no conceit towards following a genre. And money was a serious problem too because of that Pistols court case. God, that was seriously on the ropes, but do you know what? The lack of money and backing from anybody is what made it work, it made us try harder... Knowing I could lose my house because of that Pistols case, I could lose it if it went wrong, I mean nobody had anywhere to stay. My name was taken off me, Malcolm claimed that he owned the rights to the name Johnny Rotten, he tried to stop us working, it was absurd. When things are like that, dont wallow in self-pity, get revengeful, and you get revenge by moving on."
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The Pistols made no bones of their interest in money, as long as it was on their own terms.

 

There's a relatively obscure Pistols album called "Some Product", which consists of outtakes and radio promos and that sort of thing.

 

They actually plugged their "The Great Rock 'n' Roll Swindle" LP on radio shows by saying stuff like "buy this record and make me a millionaire, I want a house in the country", which sounds pretty up front about money to me (and quite funny, while we're at it).

 

And their post breakup compilation LP? It was called "Flogging a Dead Horse" and had a cheesy picture of a blonde girl in hot pants on the cover. Now that is cynical.

 

As far as "kissing big business' ass" goes, I'm not sure that was the case either.

 

The Pistols were the band that had a #1 in sales ("God Save The Queen") without any BBC airplay and that was a very big deal in the 70s. They're the band who went through two record companies (EMI and A&M) without getting around to releasing anything. A&M fired them for trashing their offices but had to pay a hefty severance.

 

The #1 story is quite funny actually. From what I've read, Rod Stewart's single, which had started to dip, actually came back up the charts in the most disgusting coverup since Watergate :rolleyes: Mind you, it was essential to "save our kids from this sick filth" as one tabloid put it. :thu:;)

 

Then, when the "Never Mind The Bollocks" LP finally came out, Richard Branson, whose Virgin label had finally picked up the band, was forced to win a court battle in order to have the album displayed in stores. The charge was "obscenity" and brought up, IIRC, by people like Mary Whitehouse (read: the Brit version of the Moral Majority)

 

So there you go. Had they kissed big business' ass, I'm sure they would have had an easier time of things.

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I'm sure they'll all be on their best behaviour when they receive their Rock and Roll Hall of Fame gong.

 

Just wondering - who ended up with all that filthy lucre anyway? Someone somewhere must still be making a lot of bucks out of the Sex Pistols.

 

Btw Remember The Aunty Jack Show? Graham Bond and Rory O'Donohue are playing a lot of the old Aunty Jack songs live on the radio, as I speak (ok type).

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Originally posted by Philemec:

I'm sure they'll all be on their best behaviour when they receive their Rock and Roll Hall of Fame gong.

They've turned it down once already. IMHO, it's the best thing they could do. Though mind you, it'd be a hoot for the Pistols to be in the same HoF as everyone else.

 

Originally posted by Philemec:

Just wondering - who ended up with all that filthy lucre anyway? Someone somewhere must still be making a lot of bucks out of the Sex Pistols.

I really don't know. The songs are normally credited to the four of them, but they may have sold the rights, for all I know. I'd hazard a guess that Richard Branson's the one that's made the most money from the Sex Pistols. Maybe Malcolm McLaren too, but I doubt it.

 

 

Originally posted by Philemec:

Btw Remember The Aunty Jack Show? Graham Bond and Rory O'Donohue are playing a lot of the old Aunty Jack songs live on the radio, as I speak (ok type).

It was JUST before my time. I remember the character ("rip yer bloody arms off!" and all that), but I don't remember the songs. :(

 

Hey, will Sonics magazine ever come back?

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Apparently the Hall of Fame thing is happening real soon. There's a typical snarling rant rejecting the whole idea by Rotten on the front page of his website. A check on Jones' website confirms that it's going ahead. If Lydon's agreed to it, which it seems he has, it's probably out of fondness for his former band mates. Let's face it, he'd be a bastard to refuse - considering what a boost to their careers, and finances, this will result in.

I'm sure John will make an effort to make it a memorable event, and will be as Rotten as ever.

 

Re: Aunty Jack; They actually had a big hit with the Farewell Aunty Jack song, and let me tell you - these guys play great guitar.They're doing a reunion tour. Maybe you'll get to see them if they tour NZ.

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Originally posted by Philemec:

Apparently the Hall of Fame thing is happening real soon. ...

Nope, they turned it down.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060314/ap_en_mu/music_rock_hall

 

"Punk rockers the Sex Pistols had turned down the honor in a profane letter that compared the hall to "urine in wine." Rolling Stone magazine founder Jann Wenner read the letter, and invited the band to pick up their trophies at the rock hall in Cleveland.

 

"If they want to smash them into bits, they can do that, too," Wenner said.

"

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John - you bastard! :)

 

He was true to his word at least. Here's something you probably won't read on Yahoo news...........

 

Discussing the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, John told Steve: "Self-appointed sods...I don't mind getting something for nothing but I ain't gonna pay for the privilege ...I don't mind being paid to be told I'm famous but I ain't paying them...I've had a problem with the Hall of Fame for a long time. Years ago when I was running Rotten TV for VH-1 we were gonna shoot an episode there at the museum and they wouldn't give me permission to film, in particular the so-called alleged Sex Pistols exhibit they had ...in it was a set of lyrics they claimed was the original things...(they were) phony... & I told them so ...but they told me that their sources were irrefutable ...in other words my word isn't good enough but my words are,... that's wrong ...a museum that's based on selling you a lot of old cack, you can't be supporting ...why are we gonna hand ourselves on a platter to them now ...they were never interested in the truth in the first place."

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