Iconoclast

I need the two synth bleeps at:03, :06, :09 and :12 seconds into this song. I'm not getting anywhere...Seems like they'd be a pretty std thing, but I'm not getting there. Anyone have that one piece of information that I'm missing here?

IMHO Kurzweil needs to fix the GUI on their instruments before they spend another penny on how they sound. Their keyboards sound and feel great and although I have better alternatives to KB3 in my studio, I'd happily use KB3 at a gig. I doubt the audience would notice a thing. I absolutely love their pianos and EPs, but if I can't get the sound I need out of one of the standard programs, I don't even try. Since editing programs in VAST is so difficult, I only edit in multi-mode (which I find to be pretty easy and very powerful). For everything else you basically need a Phd in VAST for and I'm unwilling to commit that time when I can get much faster results from other VST's and instruments. Right now I only use my Forte for one of my acts. Everything else I've switched to Mainstage/Nord. It's a shame because I think the Forte is in most ways a better sounding and more powerful instrument. The one thing I find silly is that you can't run 2 instances of KB3 in a multi. I know you can run a VAST organ and KB3 simultaneously, but it's a waste of time. I can program the same thing on the Nord or a VST in literally no time, and as others have noted above, the VST B3's sound excellent.

I used to own the original. I actually GAVE IT AWAY FOR FREE back in the mid 80s. I currently own no shortage of software that does a pretty credible job of filling the same musical space. That being said, if the price was right, given that it's so small, I might consider it for the studio and fun.

I'll admit, it sounds better recorded than it does in the room. I actually think the Nord sounds a little better which surprised me. I was really disappointed in how the Hydra sounded and then also disappointed in the Arturia OBX, especially as that's their opening patch in that software. It's really not that close for a signature patch. So I tried it with Pigments and I think that's superior, although I'm cheating a little with some of the options that Pigments gives you; I think I have the voices stacked at 1.2. The Polybrute Patch is pretty low in volume in my demo, but sounds pretty awesome in the room and I think is one of the best. Obviously I think the OB-6 is the gold standard for this.

After recording it, I have to agree with you. The fault might be with my programming; I have it panned too hard and the effects aren't quite right. But my Hydra is a 49 key version that makes it so you can't get the low C without transposing after you hit the first low C octave. Also, one of my main problems with the hydra is that the "analog" control on it seems to put it out of tune more than effect the envelopes and filters, so that by the time you get those as sloppy as you want, the synth is more out of tune than you want. I think this is one of the reasons that people say you can't get the "digital ness" out of it; a complaint that is somewhat justified...don't worry I'm not selling it. One thing with the Hydra is you have so many modulation possibilities that, if you have the time, you could assign LFO's and envelopes galore to nudge parameters and get it to breathe a little more, in the manner that Tusker described above. However, who has time to do that for a simple Jump patch when there's other platforms that give you that live/vintage feeling with the adjustment of 1 or two settings? This is something that, by the way, the OB-6 and the Polybrute seem to nail. The Polybrute has discrete controls for pitch vs envelope accuracy, and the OB just seems to do it right with a single knob...set it at around 30-40% and it's just wonderfully sloppy without sounding broken. I understand the patch being cliche, but it's so simple that you'd think you could do it with any board...yet they all sound different.

If you made it through all 7, congrats: in order they are: Kurze Forte, Nord Stage, Polybrute, Hydrasynth, Arturia OBxa (arturia's dry Jump Patch with my effects), Arturia Pigments (my patch), OB-6.

Sounds pretty close. You got the growl/buzz and the reverb right. I can hear a tightness to the tuning and envelopes that makes me think it's digital. The crowd would go wild and no one in your band would look at you sideways. That's a way better Jump than what I have on my Forte or Nord Stage 3. I tried to re-create it on my boards so here's a bunch of clips of a song we all hate. But the interesting thing is it's a terribly simple patch. Two saws slightly detuned. On some of my boards I blended in a little sub if it sounded thin and it didn't start sounding organ-like in the R hand. There's a bit of envelope on the attack of amplitude and filter (though the filter is almost wide open depending on the board/program). The lineup is OB-6, Polybrute, Pigments, Arturia OBXa, Hydrasynth, Stage 3, Forte. The Forte I did not program. The others...well, I'm sure I could do better if all I wanted to do all day was program Jump. I think I got close with a couple, but the two analog machines just do it without much work. The point being, not to hang yourself after listening to the Jump intro 7 times, but that even though these parameters are pretty simple, you can definitely hear the difference. Would anyone care? eh, I dont know. But I know that once you get used to hearing the OB-6 do it, you can't unhear the difference. Super Jump Off All.mp3

When the OB-6 came out with it's "analog" mode in the last OS, I was amazed at how much better it sounded. Considering that it was already a copy of a vintage machine, I was a bit surprised at how much better it sounded. What's really cool is it has put it into a single knob so you can go from pristine tightness to being able to hear each individual envelope/filter in a sweep. Things like Rush's Tom Sawyer filter sweep sound completely different when you are able to recreate this loosness. Try the same sound on a Kurzweil or Nord and you'll see how it quickly looses it's magic. Using VAST, if you're a genius and have a ton of time, you might be able to program in varying curves etc. but on most true VA machines these days, this can be done with a single control that has a macro effect. This has probably been shared before and it's in relation to the Prophet 6, but it's basically the same control by the same company demo'ed by a dude who really knows what he's doing.

I think we could debate what "vintage" actually means for a while. My opinion is that vintage, in terms of synthesizers, means capturing the inherent innacuracies that made these older instruments seem more alive than modern, more precise, instruments. In my stable of instruments, if I really want something that sounds legit analog and vintage, in order of preference: 1. An actual analog machine, preferably a modern one with a vintage mode that adjusts not just the tuning, but also the looseness of envelopes and filters. This is noticeably better than anything I've heard from Nord, Kurz, Yamaha (the only romplers I have a lot of experience with) 2. Some of the more recent VSTs are doing a great job of this. I'm thinking specifically of the new Arturia synth models. Their recent OBX, Jupiter, Juno, Prophet models are very alive. In a blind test, some of these are too close to confidently call on a regular basis. 3. ASM Hydrasynth has a couple macro controls that make multiple parameters more/less tight. But placed right next to the real analog machines, you'll hear the difference. 4. I'd probably put Kurzweil before any of my other Romplers I'm familiar with (Nord and Yamaha...but I have no experience with Korg or Roland) but honestly they're all a distant 4th and could probably be picked out in a blind test by a lot of us here. I will sometimes try to get a typical well known sound out of several machines side to side just for fun and I've always found that the romplers come up with passible but kind of blase sounds. Try the standard Jump patch across platforms that all purport to put out the same waveform through the same modelled or actual filter controlled by similar envelopes, yet the difference across a couple of synth engines can be really telling.

I own too many Poly's yet haven't tried enough of them! OB-6, Hydrasynth and Polybrute. I can seriously just loose myself in blee-bloops for hours with these things; so fun! The OB-6 really sounds best in a band but it's short on depth. That being said, I'm constantly amazed at how deep you can get with how simple it is. The keybed is perfect. It really is THAT sound you need. For my prog and classic rock stuff, it is exactly the sound, and yes, even my guitar playing band-mates can tell the difference. Just a normal filter sweep through a great PA will make you tingle. Hydrasynth is really a different beast, but WAY deeper. Yet they somehow manage to keep it easy to program. Seriously fun to tweak even though it's digital and menu driven. The interface is brilliant. To the super critical ear, or sitting right next to my OB-6, yes, there is a certain digital-ness to it. But it will go tons of places the OB-6 can't get near. I only wish it had an easy to use sequencer (and no, the step LFO is not what I would call easy to use as a sequencer). Some of the super lush stuff doesn't compete in a mix the way the OB-6 does. The poly AT is the real deal and the keyboard is specifically tailored to it. I have the 49 key version but if I was to buy today I'd get the bigger one. Value for the buck...what a board. Polybrute is incredibly deep and the free editor/librarian is effortless genius. It's prettier sounding than the OB-6. Very powerful sequencer. I haven't had a chance to use it live. Arturia provides an enormous amount of free programs that are so easy to download and catagorize with their software. I can't seem to get it to sing like the OB yet, but I've found some killer programs from Arturia that I'm dieing to use live.

I've run organ through pedal boards. For a long time I used to run my XK3c through a Line6 PodXT floor on it's way to the motionsound KBR3d. I used it a lot for delays, chorus and flanger and usually tried to fit in one solo a night with the wah pedal, and the volume pedal on the PodXT worked as the organ's volume pedal. I've kind of gone the virtual direction and run more VST's in the post signal chain now. I do this by running everything in the rig back through an I/O device and then through mainstage, so I can use any of my VST effects on the output of my real instruments. Now you're in virtually unlimited territory. Honestly, just having a really good EQ makes a huge difference. Much smaller footprint, quicker setup at the gig, and more flexible...and less 9v's.

The Studio Logic Shelf is very sturdy. Like Al Coda said, when the 73 gets a better keybed, my SL88 grand is going up for sale.

I've been covering more songs that need some kind of horn section. Think Lido Shuffle, Long Long Way From Home (foreigner), 25 or 6 to 4, Vehicle, Into the Mystic etc. I normally hate the inherent cheesiness of covering horns on keys but it I've just been asked to a lot more lately. I think I draw the line at doing a sax solo or something like that. For example, Billy Joel's "You May Be Right", it's just as relevant to let some other legit instrument cover the solo as fake a sax on the keys. But if I can lay back and add some appropriate layers I like to do that. One of my main problems is the Logic/Mainstage horns program. It's terrible. Doesn't sound too bad but for some reason it will have an enormous amount of midi hangs that require the midi-panic button, like no kidding all the time. I have no other VSTs that cause this problem so I don't think it's some other part of my rig. Depending on my rig, I can get horns with one of my other keys but I like to have a Mainstage Only version of everything I play. So Hive Mind, help me: what VST's would be better than the Mainstage Horns for filling space.

With manufacturing and supply chains being what they are, there could be any number of reasons that they would discontinue or run short on a product. But if they're getting rid of these at $329 per, that's kind of tempting. It actually looks pretty cool and probably way easier to program than any other FM synth I've seen.

Sorry, I have nothing that can help you out except to say that I've done this exact part on keys and it works out pretty good. T The 12 string intro part on keys sounds surprisingly natural and is actually kind of fun to play. The guitar solo harmonies are OK but if your guitar player bends at all you sound out of place. Unless you have them perfect I'd consider just leaving them out. I think few listeners will find their absence disagreeable. If you search youtube for the guitar solo tutorial there will be a million of them, only on guitar, but that should be enough to get you there.

I saw him open for Al DiMeoa a while back and I found his solo show at that time to great. His performance covers a lot of territory...and I honestly find his solo show connects with me more than his DT performances. You should not be disappointed. The GeoShred stuff is kind of incomprehensible . His piano chops really shine when he's solo. He gets to talk a little more and explain what's going on. My non-muso wife liked it way better than she expected. She thought I was dragging her to a musical torture chamber.

I don't know how you set split points in the CP so I can't really help you there. I do a similar thing with the Nord but I rarely use both the Nord and MS in the same patch, primarily because the Nord has fixed split points. Patch changing is so fast and seamless with MS and Nord that I find it really easy to just tap a foot switch and viola, I'm suddenly playing the next instrument and the reverb/delay/sustains from the previous patch remain active. MS has truly the best patch switching methodology that I've ever run into (that's why it's so resource heavy, it basically keeps all programs open simultaneously to do this). I know that if you use Camelot pro the way it's supposed to, where you turn local off on your CP, you can set split points where ever you want and still use the CP's internal sounds. Camelot only sends notes to your CP that meet it's split criteria. I've only dabbled with Camelot pro and never gigged with it, but you might want to take a look at it.

I painted a shelf liberated from a renovation project and put it on an X stand...that I back up to my X stand. Holds all my peripherals and a couple drinks. There's more elegant stands and solutions, but a shelf is pretty easy to make and put on any stand. You can see the Morningstar pedal in the middle of my pedals. It does prgrm +/- and anything else you could possible send a midi message for. It connects only to the USB hub, not to the keyboard, so you can use it with any keyboard that you integrate MS with. (I realize this pic is kind of a mess but it was taken during setup before I'd cleaned up my cable runs) This is an incredibly versatile rig. I retain the great pianos and Organs the Nord has, and gain the synth/sample/sequence stuff that I can run from Mainstage all simultaneously with program changes for the entire rig with a single footswitch.

I don't mean to trivialize your loss, but of course you carry on. My time is coming and I can't stop it; and in truth we are ALL ticking time bombs, and I would hate to think that my passing might take something else important away from the people I love.

I know a lot of people worry about having a computer on stage, but I only glance at mine and only touch between songs, or when we deviate from the setlist, or if one of my program changes go awry. I don't think it effects stage presence any more than searching for a program on your hardware keyboard. I play with other dudes who use them and if you keep it on a low stand or something, you'd never know. I keep mine in plain sight. As far as managing your plug-ins: I think you could run it the way you want, but as a long-time MS user, I guess I don't understand the utility of it. If you already have your plug in pre-sets that you like, it's dead simple and fast to make a mainstage program out of each of them and then arrange them in their own folders. You can also buy a simple programmable USB MIDI footswitch, connect it directly to the computer, and teach it to sequence through your MS patches. It doesn't need to connect to your CP at all. Look at something like the One Control Gecko or Morningstar MC3 although there's quite a few of these type of things. I use the footpedal to command prgrm changes in Mainstage and then that MS program commands the proper program in my Nord Stage, even if I'm using NO VSTs in that particular program. Otherwise, I'm not really familiar with the CP's controls and I don't really understand what you mean by "sub-section" so I can't help you there. Suffice to say that Mainstage is pretty powerful and can...in theory...probably do whatever you need it to do. But there is definitely a steep hump early in the learning curve.

Coming at this from the wrong direction...88 for my purposes is too many. If playing multiple parts, I'd rather have my hands close together at different levels than reaching to the distant upper/lower octaves just to get that one sound you need for the song. For piano piano, my Forte 7 does everything I need. I've only ran into 1 song where I needed to re-map the lowest note to get the lowest C note. My 49 key poly's seem a little small but my 61's seem plenty big. I've never tried to use a 61 as my "piano" board. I think my perfect rig would have 76 keys on the lower for pianos/eps, and 61 keys on top, but I could probably get away with 49 on top.

Drums, vox and acoustic guitars, but direct for pretty much anything else. You could write a book about how to mike a drumset, and then someone else will write a book about how much your book sucks.

Very normal to give girls flowers at the end of a drama or dance performance. Take if from the dad of a 19 year old drama kid. Don't really know about recitals! Love the picture idea though.

But on the original topic of guitar center...I haven't gone their since the incident with Pedal Guy and I wrote them a letter to that effect. I added them to the pyre of companies I used to almost exclusively support but have now vowed a life long vendatta against. I don't want to get into a political discussion...but neither should they. I've only gone there on gig days when I needed something very specific within the hour; usually a cord or stand that broke at the last second. I have very little evidence that incident hurt them, but I know a lot of guys like me who are in the part of their life where they can afford expensive musical toys who feel similar to me. I used to be considered a whale at that place and knew all the managers. https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/guitar-center-has-bigger-problems-than-the-pedal-guy/

Here in AZ I think a lot of the more modern and successful malls are more indoor/outdoor arrangments that seem to lean more heavily on restaurants and entertainment draws and less on retail, although retail certainly still exists. They near always have live outdoor music on the weekends. https://www.forbes.com/sites/gregpetro/2019/04/05/shopping-malls-arent-dying-theyre-evolving/?sh=3530e3d72210