First gig with the C1 Saturday. I'd been playing it pretty much in any spare moment for a week or so, set up some presets, getting the feel of it. The gig went well (2 1/2 hours for a wedding dance) and the other guys felt that it had a superior sound to the Electro. That had been my impression also, but it wasn't until Monday that I had everything unpacked and set up the two boards side by side.

In the meantime, I had received a message from a XK3 user who had gotten an Electro to minimize his schlepping. He has a better excuse than I, living in NYC. He wanted to know how I thought the C1 compared to the NE. Here is some email excerpts:

Had the first gig with the new C1 Saturday night. All agreed with my assessment that it was a step up from the the NE Hammond sound (that always gets rave reviews at our gigs and jams). I'm not an organ player, but got to love the sounds that I got from my Electro that I got interested in getting a B3/C3/A-100 primarily to play at home. After watching eBay and craigslist for a while, pricing Hammonds and Leslies, I figured I was better off with one of the two manual clones that I would actually use for gigging. I haven't played the XK or the Korg, and bought the C1 based on my extremely positive experience with the Electro. I had a 61 and moved up to the 73 as an "all-in-one" board for jams, etc. I'm mostly a piano player and the 61 key was too limiting. I'd play 99% of my solo jazz on the NE with 73 keys if the acoustic piano was better.

And now to your questions (finally):

"More than one guy has said the C1 is
superior to the Electro; do you feel the same?"

Yes. Not having a great deal of Hammond experience, I have a limited vocabulary for explaining why I like it better, but I think the percussion (esp in the lower registers- think "Green Eyed Lady") is better. I like the tweaks you can do in the Leslie sim.

"I have really enjoyed gigging the XK3, but I'm not
getting any younger and being able to take a double
manual that weighs under 40 Lbs to gigs sounds very
good right now."

At 33 lbs, the C1 certainly fits the bill. The fairly expensive case has nice size rollers and particleboard panels all around. Not a flight case, but more than enough of you're gently handling your own gear.

"I still take along either a modded 760
or modded 825 Leslie; having a lighter organ would be
a huge plus."

I haven't played it through a Leslie (or one of the neo-Leslies like Motion Sound or Speakeasy). I had a Motion Sound Pro 3Tm for a while that I used with a KP200S, but never though it added that much compared to the sim on the Electro. And it was one more piece of gear and several more cables. I know purists want real air-movin' stuff, but to me the sim sounds almost as good as a miked Leslie, but without the schlep factor.

"I found that even in a real Leslie the
NE2 is a little too muddy; even more so in a Roland KC
500 or PA system. Would you mind giving me your
review about your C1 and what you are playing it
through?"

For Saturday night and in my living room, I have only used the Motion Sound KP200S. I have a pair of Mackie SRM450s, but haven't hooked it up with them. I have to think the Leslie sim sounds better in stereo than mono. I think that certain sounds (mids and lows) on the Electro sound, as you accurately describe it, "muddy". I'm going to get my stuff unpacked and set up both NE and C1 and do an A-B comparison. I'll let you know.

Not having much of a vocabulary for Hammond sounds, I can't really describe very well what it is I like more about the C1 sound. I'll probably do better after comparing them side by side. I can say that I love the bass split feature for the bottom two octaves with its own drawbars to do LH bass. I've spent a lot of time playing blues and jazz standards all week. I'm almost ready to do the classic B3/guitar/drums trio.

The way I see it, the pros of the C1 vs the Hammond XK3 are 1) size and weight, 2) $1000 less than the two manual XK3. The cons are 1) pushbutton drawbars (a real deal breaker for most folks who grew up playing the real thing, 2) physical layout (location of drawbars, chorus/vibrato, percussion and presets) very different than a real Hammond.

Follow-up email:

Replying to your email was the impetus for me to get the 4Runner unloaded and set everything up in the living room.

No doubt. Side by side, into the same inputs (the Motion Sound has two pairs of inputs for each of two channels), same drawbar/percussion/vibrato/overdrive settings. There is a certain clarity (interesting that the word that came to mind can be an antonym to your term "muddy") and definition that's not there with the Electro. It's like the difference between my old Korg piano sample ("yeah, that's nice, it'll work") and that on my Yamaha S90 ("now that sounds like a piano!"). I tried the "Green Eyed Lady" left hand sound (888000000, vib off, loud/fast/3rd) and there's no comparison.

I am really a bit chagrined as the B3 sound on the Electro has always been such a highlight and invariably blows away musicians who play it or hear it in the mix. But now I'll want to haul the C1 out whenever I play. Of course, it's not that big a deal at 33 lbs, but a bigger problem (ha- the best puns are the unintentional ones) is a dramatically larger footprint. With the height of the C1, if I put it on a second tier, it'll be way too high or the S90 will be too low. At our age, you gotta watch ergonomics. The fastest way to a bout of tendonitis is to have a keyboard at an un-natural playing angle.

I didn't take the Electro the other night and missed some of the EPs. The Rhodes and clavi sounds on the S90 are nice, but the Wurli patches s***. I had to shut off the effects on "Tell Me What I Say" because the rhythm of the tremolo (present on both patches) I think was preventing the drummer and I from getting the groove going. I use a moderately over-driven Wurli on the NE and it's perfect.

Ah well, back to the toys.

Anyone else with a A-B comparison the the two?

Dregs, nice review. Maybe you should consider turning your Electro into an Electro Rack and control it from the bottom manual of the C1 - ergonomics problem solved.

Sorry, but I think this is pretty funny.

Interesting idea. I'm one of the few who doesn't hate playing piano and EPs on the Electro keybed. I know it's not ideal and I wouldn't want to play solo jazz piano on it, but for a lot of gigs, that could work. (You guys are way overestimating the level of artistry for this band and this piano player if you think it would make that much difference. )

To be fair, we also discussed the advantage of carrying only the C1 vs the two manual XK. Think of traveling in NYC to a gig with the C1 rather than the XK. Hell, if I lived in the city, you'd be hard pressed to get me to bring anything more than the Electro 73 anywhere.

Is it possible to split the MIDI with the C1? I thought people were complaining that this wasnt a possibility before... or maybe that's just my faulty recollection. Certainly seem like a nice idea to have bottom manual going to a rack for piano (and switchable back to organ at any time) and top manual always prepared for organ.

Also... I'm one person who hates overlap, and having the Electro rack + C1 means you've got a redundant organ feature on the Electro which you'd never use... what just occurred to me though was the possibility of getting a Kurzweil PC2r with Classic Keys installed, and have that bolted to the bottom of the C1. That'd give you one dual manual super-rig with great acoustic piano, wurly/rhodes, and even strings.

Every Nord I know of works by doing dual manual organ engine thingies with the 2 manuals on separate midi channels - it should be possible to transmit on channel 2 from the lower manual, and just turn all the lower manual dbs to 0. I don't know about splits or anything more complex than that.

After playing one in a band I was in (the leader owns all the latest Nord gear...sigh), I'm saving my pennies to gets one of my own.

And yes, it definitely kills the Electro's sound.
And yes, while the Leslie sim sounds great in stereo, after hearing it through a real Leslie there's STILL no comparison.
And don't forget, it can take pedals (which you can also split to the LH, which is handy).
And the Voxx & Farfisa sounds are always a plus.
And it can take a half-moon switch (which I haven't tried).
And the feel of the keys is way better for organ-esque tricks (smearing, trills, glisses etc.).

Anyone that bitches at carrying 12 more pounds of a clone has a problem living in NYC or not.

I guess at my age my hearing is not as good as others', but I can A/B my xk3 and electro and the xk3 still wins. I can't justify a C1, but I would not buy it to lose 7-8 lbs. Frankly, I like the mass of the xk system. Still, that's why they make them all - to each his own.

I decided awhile back to try the Electro (I was offered a deal on a used one I couldn't pass up) and it's not bad. The XK-3 (which I have played) is better, and the C1 (which I've only heard recorded) sounds better, but for what I paid it's tiding me over nicely. Originally I figured I could flip it when the time came to upgrade (making a tidy profit), but I like its Clav and Wurlitzer sounds so much I don't want to part with it. I always gig it with my Leslie. And it does sound really good in a band mix with the Leslie, but it's missing that extra something the XK system and C1 have. The XK's a lovely instrument, and the C1 had its appeal as well. I do tend to prefer the real slidy bars (especially in the sun...the drawblinkies are easily washed-out.) A C1 would be easier to squeeze in my car with the Leslie than an XK+lower manual...though I think I could make it fly. I have to say, despite the "wrong" user interface the C1 is an appealing instrument...I've always wanted to have a Vox and Farfisa around, and that would give me those tones to play with. Not too worried right now, upgrading's a long ways off. The little Electro did help me land my newest gig, which has turned out to be the best band I've ever played in, I haven't enjoyed myself this much in years.

Might I just add that apparantly the Nord C1 isn't velocity sensitive when playing midi sounds. Shame as that would save taking that extra keyboard for certain gigs.

Not true, the C1 transmits velocity. John

Ok, I stand corrected. It's just what a guy who works for their uk distributor told me but i guess he got it wrong.

According to the manual you have the choice whether or not to transmit velocity so I guess you're both kinda right

I have sold my beloved Voce V5/ Dynachord CLS-222 for a Nord Electro 2 rack replacement. I had to think long and hard about it after many trips to GC to check out the Nord. The weak link live for me was the Dynachord first off in my old rig with level issues. The Voce, well that was the hardest decision. They really are a ballsy unit, my trouble with that was the transparency of the upper drawbars sonically not the low end which I loved on the V5, they could get thin sounding in the upper drawbars with the CLS. Both issues had gone on for many years and I thought it might be time to sell them for good $.

The sales on EBAY against the Nord E2R in total were only short by about $180.

For my 2 tier larger gigs I use (and record with) an XK-3/ Leslie 145. I've had great results with the XK-3/145 combo recording and gigging.

My thoughts on the NE2 Rack are this:

Sonically (organ sound) it's better that I expected and the Leslie sim is very very good. It sounded very good w/the band. It holds up in a live band mix, especially in the upper mid range and high end. It's sound has a certain presence that's hard to describe in words that none of the other clones I have played have exactly. The Rhodes, Wurly and Clav are great as are the effects which are excellant. The percussion is very good also. The Piano I've had bad luck with. I may load the Mono Steinway as per Kanker's suggestion.

I do think that the C/V is better on the XK-3 and the XK-3 is slightly less grainy sounding.

I'd like to try a C1 but I'm not looking for a 2 manual organ piece really. I like the way the Nord stuff is made and sounds, it feels well made and sonically the organ really sat well in the mix, better than I expected. I'm still getting comfortable with it. Using it on tonight's gig again for the 2nd time!
lb

Welcome to the RED world, Tony! There's a reason so many of us are buying these things, as you're finding out.

As far as the piano, the mono Steinway works pretty well, it helps if you tweak the EQ, and use a good board to control it. You might have to adjust that too. I had better luck with my DP4073/CDP-100 than I'm having with the RD-700GX at their defaults. I still need to see if I can tweak it to my satisfaction.

Joe,

The 700 are very tweakable that way, almost too!

Red, yes! they have character! hauled arse in the mix. very nice! playing red sails in the sunset tonight. see how it works!
i'm playing by the airport tonight at a rib place in farmingdale! the distortion effect sounds good on hit! not warm but it crunches right!
lb