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keyboardologist

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About keyboardologist

  • Birthday 01/19/2022
  1. If you do like CP4's action and you can carry it without a problem, stick with it or wait for the P515 and skip the CP88, otherwise you will regret it again and again. Has anyone demoed the Viscount Legend '70, artist, w or compact? Is it a fatar action? How good is compared to the CPs? Although all models are heavier and more expensive than CPs...
  2. Although YC and CP might advertised having the same actions, I believe they don't. I feel that there might be basic changes on velocity curves engine, chassis and maybe some more details (like the key weights, etc). The weird thing is that on the thomann e-store, they are listed with different keyboard variations and I'm not sure if these are just site typos or the actions are common but they are somehow configured in a different way: Yamaha YC73: BHS (Balanced Hammer Standard) keyboard with 73 keys and 3 split zones Yamaha CP73: BH5 Keyboard (Balanced Hammer Action) Yamaha YC88: 88-Key NW-GH3 (Natural Wood Graded Hammer) keyboard with synthetic ebony and ivory key tops Yamaha CP88: NW-GH3 Keyboard (weighted, wood with synthetic ivory top layer) The first is BHS (with an s) with 'Standard' word, the second BH5 (with a five number) with the 'Action' word, the third and fourth are stating the same type, but YC88 is listed as Graded and CP88 just as Weighted. YC73/CP73 might be a typo thing, but YC88/CP88 might actually not. Maybe weights are really graded on the YC88 and not on the CP88, although based on the target market needs.... they should have been the opposite way around!!!!
  3. I found this photo of the GH3, which shows that the sensors are on the hammer: Thank tou AnotherScott for the info of the velocity curve which is also important for the rhodes' bark for me. The CP73 is portable enough as a stage piano, so if feel/action is average or above, it's a good deal for its price and features. Since it's the board that I'm mostly interested, I might give it a try after the lockdown period, although I can only find CP88 as a demo.
  4. Hello to all. On the quick/slow action conversation, there are many key points apart from the actual key's weight (counterweight). In detail: - Key's weight (Counterweight as it called) - Hammer weight - Hammer pivot - The let-off mechanism (key escapement) as a mechanical point - Key length (up to the pivot/fulcrum/balance pin) - The key pivot/fulcrum/balance pin point. In cheap actions, it is at the end of the key, so the key does not extend further after the pivot and there is no other weight to compensate key's actual weigh (counterweight) or hammer weight. - Sensor type: douple (down/up) or triple (down/midway up/full up release) - The sensor/contact placement (in relation to the key pivot, hammer, etc) You can check this: https://kawaius.com/technology/wooden-key-actions/ As you can see, in the cheap/budget actions, hammer and/or let-off might not exist. Both P515 (NWX) and CP88 (NW-GH) are having 3 sensors but the CP88 lacks escapement/let-off. CP73, S90XS and Montage 8 are having BHS action, which differs the weight of the keys (or counterweigh, or hammer weigh, not really sure) across the keybed (mostly in 3 or 4 group areas) but I found no more specs about other aspects of the action. I also know that on older/cheaper Yamaha Actions like GH/GHE/GHS on my Motif 8, the main sensor is triggered by the key and not by the hammer. The hammer exists for its weight and probably only for the release sensor (not sure on that). And also if I'm not wrong, on the GH3 (three sensors) all sensors are on the hammer. In conclusion there are a lot of parameters defining the feel and/or the quickness of the key/action. I had personally tried several actions and Î do separate the feel of the actual (mechanical) move of the key (it can be tested on any switched-off keyboard) and the sensor responsiveness (sensor type, sensor placement) along with the software velocity curve. On my preference, I really don't like heavy actions because I have used to practice for many years on the very light action of my acoustic piano and I am now mostly playing on synth/semi keybeds. In relation to this, I don't like keybeds with short key length (measuring from the far end of the key up to the pivot/fulcrum/balance pin, not the whole key length), either synth/semi/hammeraction, because they also tend to feel heavy, especially when a key is pressed closer to it's pivot/fulcrum and even more if this occurs on a black key. Think of playing Eb half-diminished and focus on Gb [black] and Bbb[=A white] keys and where the fingers are touching/pressing. On topic, my questions are: 1. Does CP73 feels lighter than CP88? I personally hope so. 2. What is the key's length? Let's say in relation to the CP88, but mostly to my Motif's GHS or my Kawai's ES100/110 which are acceptable for me. 3. Is it quick on the sensor side so that you can play fast repeated notes, after a while where you will get used of the action and key responsiveness? 4. Does 'soft' velocity setting needs relatively higher finger pressure (it's hard) to generate the same velocity value than other keybeds (CP88, etc) or is it the velocity curve's progression which you don't like? 5. How would you rate the velocity curve in the below types? Keep in mind that on the CP, soft might mean the player's feel which is the opposite of this diagram's curve labeling:
  5. Makes sense, although it requires a module that can respond to a particular key range. No. You can have any external module with split functionality. The external module will get all midi notes from CP's channel 1, but it will produce sound only on the one sound of it's split. The other one will be muted (volume set to zero) by the external sound module itself. Done this with Roland XV-5080 and Kurzweil PC2R and only one midi controller on midi channel 1. I configured Roland on split and used only the lower end (the upper end had another muted sound) and then Kurzweil also set on split, same split point on both modules and on Kurzweil using only the upper end keys (lower keys split sound muted). The overhead is that if you want to change the split key... you have to re-program this twice in both modules. Yes, this is not applicable, since I think the CP can play up to 2 sounds simultaneously (either with split or layer), so using a controller for managing a third or fourth sound isn't feasible. But you can use CP as a controller with one sound and then find a good module with more sounds (like the Roland XV5080 which is capable of layering/spliting 4 sounds in the same preset) and do all the rest from the external module. I also believe motif or fantom/integra and all big 'workstation' modules can handle 4 sounds simultaneously. Finally, I believe CP is not intended for such a complex use. It's mostly designed for quick access and session live with up to 2 sounds. You can add a second keyboard, but I propose not to mess with CP and a sound module, you will get bore after a while and you will end up needing another 'better' machine for handling complex sounds.
  6. Although I don't own a CP73/88, I think you can make this work as a duo/three split, by a little cheating, which is: Do a split the CP, keeping the piano as the one sound. Let's say it's the lower keys, from A1or C1 to C4 and do a two octave up to have them sound like C3 to C6. The second upper sound, from C#4 up to C8 will have an internal split sound, which you will set it's volume to zero, not to produce sound from the CP. Then on the external sound module you do a split, with the same split point, but this time you set the lower's volume sound to zero. You will use only midi channel 1 from both modules, but strict sounds by doing a split/mute. You can also do a three split, or a layer in the center area, as long as the CP's own sound is always used as one in the lower end or in the upper end of the keyboard, and not in the middle of two. Already done this with a Roland/Kurzweil setup in the past, it's a little bit overhead on the configuration but it's working. Do you get the trick?
  7. Why don't you buy a Kenton Midi USB Host, to connect the P121's usb to any Nord, Casio, etc.? And also there is a cheaper Miditech USB MIDI Host or the pricier Bome BomeBox with WiFi, network for also connecting to PCs/MACs.
  8. I see your point, but I am thinking out loud and don't get me wrong: Yamaha CP was always the stage piano series, first electric, then analog and digital. The are actually making a wider range of sounds available nowadays but then main purpose is the piano. Also P series is for the home, or very limited live purpose. MODX is like the medium synth category. A lot more than the MX but not the do-it-all machine, that's what the price is related to. So you got the Montage, everything is top notch in here. 1. Why don't you buy Montage? 2. Why Yamaha release Montage if CP does it all? All brands have series, check Nord. Electro, Piano, Stage. Why won't you compare Nord Piano with CP and say that the CP is more flexible and also has some organ sounds? Also check prices and get back with an alternative of CP in the same category and price range which does more that the CP in most of the aspects... And another thing. If BHS in the CP73 is the same as the one in the Montage 88, I can't figure out what's wrong. Maybe Velocity curve's settings? I didn't here something similar for Mintage action.
  9. Hello, I am also interested on the CP73 which is compact with hammer action, mostly for my aps and eps , but since I play mostly soul/r&b/funk/rock covers on a band without guitar, I use some all-around synth sounds for splits, like synth lead for melody/solo, brass for kicks/melody/tuttis, horns for backing, etc. One or two good Hammond sounds with Leslie are always enough for me, so no problem here I think. Although I know CP73 is limited on those sounds, would it be possible to tweak some of its sounds via eq/time filters or effects to come close to other ones? I'm not really in need of acoustic sounds like sax, trumpet, etc, but something close to the feel and sound, even if it's "fake". I really like layering Rhodes or wurlies with brass, for doing guitar riffs and clavs with softer leads for funk grooves/solos because either way you have strong attach, with power and heavyweight notes with infinite sustain if required!
  10. I bought a used (just 180euro) Studiologic VMK-188 plus with Fatar TP40GH action (Grand Touch, Four Zones Graded Hammer Action) for my private rehearsal studio, so I can constantly play with hammer action keys on rehearsals along with my MX61 sounds. If I get used to play on hammer action every week, I will consider buying the CP73 as the all-in-one portable live keyboard.
  11. Today I went to the official Yamaha Distributor/Demo/Showroom/Store in Athnes, Greece. No CP73 or CP88 available for demo or stock in warehouse and no P121 available for demo or stock either. Yamaha did a great job with portable 73keys this year but local distributor isn't interested enough, only available for orders. Kurzweil dealer opened a brand new Artis 7 for demo, I got the chance to mess around for more than 2 hours, but I didn't get in touch with the action and some of my daily sounds, EPs and Hams were not really my taste, because of their gain/tube amp sound which sounded good for distorted rock sound but not for jazz/soul sweet sounding. So, back to my problem, how am I going to invest on a Yamaha CP73, which has 1800euro here, without physical playing with a demo unit? I don't get it. How they are going to sell that thing if they don't advertise it by the official distributor/saler? I could only order the P121, by playing the P125 which is available for demo and I know it's the same machine so the action is fine by me, but how can I A/B the P125 keyboard action with the CP73? OK, let's see, CP73 has similar action with the Montage 8. So if I like Montage action I will be ok with CP73? What does similar means? What about the sounds and interface? Youtube and reviews? No. Not to mention localstore installment plan (up to 36 without extra interent rate) which I can not take advantage. I can only find one possible solution, order it online through an International music e-shop, test it and return it on 30-day money back warranty and if it's ok, order it from local distributor via installments and wait a month or two to arrive. Is that ok with Yamaha and shopping policies because I'm not feeling really ok with that... Sorry for my bad English people!
  12. Light-weight hammer action sounds good to me for the CP73. I like that. I got used to semis and synths but most of the time I play Rhodes, so I feel that's what the CP73 is about. I don't like heavy-weight like TP100. Although GHS on the new P121 73keys is good, not so heavy. I have to visit the local demo store soon! Also, got to change page!
  13. Any reviews from the CP73 owners? I'm mostly insterested in the keyboard action. Should I wait for some savings or go ahead with a cheap P121 along with my MX49 and a usb-to-host/midi converter?
  14. 88keys yes, as also the P125, but synth type MX/MODX (49/61/76) I think no. Also there is the cheap NP series, with light chassis, MXs keys, a few sounds, speakers and batteries. If Electro has A1, the price would be way up. Sure there are differences, but as I said, really close. If you want a good ap/ep/organ and a good va, you usually end up on two keyboards or an all-around, I don't see a lot of interested in-between electro/stage, cause Electro is already overpriced for the features.
  15. Also, I see only two lightweight 73s with decent hammer action and they are both from Yamaha. P121 and CP73. I'm gonna buy both and celebrate the evolution!
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