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#3091535 04/04/21 10:25 PM
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My XK1 has seen better days! Thinking of replacing with an SK1. Any reason why I wouldn't want to do that?


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
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StanC #3091536 04/04/21 10:34 PM
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SK1 is still a nice step up from XK1, if you can't afford/justify the cost of the new SK Pro. If you don't need all those other non-organ sounds, though, the XK1c is an even cheaper possibility. At that point, you could also consider the Numa Organ 2, Crumar Mojo 61, or Viscount Legend Solo. Each has its fans.


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Sound-wise, it’s a lateral move since they are both powered by the older VASE III technology. The SK Pro, Mojo and Legend will all give you better and more customizable organ tones.


"I would, but I don't want to."
StanC #3091545 04/04/21 11:54 PM
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Probably depends on how you will use it. I have a SKX in the rig. I thought the extra voices would be handy but heck ... I don’t use them. I just use the thing as an organ.

Last edited by CEB; 04/04/21 11:54 PM.

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StanC #3091546 04/04/21 11:57 PM
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Heck I accidentally put the thing on extravoices one night and in the heat of the moment I momentarily forgot how to make the damn thing an organ again.


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StanC #3091554 04/05/21 01:05 AM
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I've been using my bass player's SK1 at practice the past couple of months. The shrill of the high end reminds me a lot of the XM2 (XK1 in a rack) that I owned and sold. The Leslie is improved over the the XM2 but I just don't like the sound at all. The first time I played the Roll With The Changes organ lead I thought that there was something wrong with the unit. It sounds horrible in the upper end. Personally I wouldn't recommend it; there are better choices and if you are going to make a change then spend the extra jingle and get yourself a better sounding organ. My two cents.


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Thanks for all the insight! I had considered other models, but I guess I am like the die hard Ford or Chevy drivers that won't have anything else. I'm a Hammond guy (irrationally perhaps). Weight being another factor in the decision process, I had not considered the XK-1c, because I erroneously assumed the weight was similar to the XK1 (~25#s). It's actually only about 16# much like the SK1. So now it's down to just a couple things. First the extra voices. I don't necessarily need them, but it might be nice to have the option of extra pianos while playing strings, brass, etc. from my main board, the Yamaha. Of course I could do splits, but after losing my set up just pre-gig one time long ago, I'm not a big fan of extensive programming. I'm pretty much an out-of-the-box guy. Second, to Delaware Dave's comment, "horrible in the upper end", Mitch writes XK and SK has same as VASE III technology. I never thought the XK1 sounded horrible. With the same technology, the two should sound the same. I wonder maybe there WAS something wrong with the unit Dave was using or maybe EQ/amplification? Or perhaps just a matter of personal taste. Can anyone else comment further on the SK sound?

Thanks again!


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
StanC #3091614 04/05/21 03:45 PM
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I think my SKX is Vase III like my XK3c but it sounds WAY better. So heck if I know.

Last edited by CEB; 04/05/21 03:46 PM.

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StanC #3091619 04/05/21 04:23 PM
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I have a SK1 which I'm using to play Carlos Santana's covers and I'm pretty happy with it. I can make it loud and crunchy, or soft and mellow, as it should be for this kind of music. Never found it to sound "horrible" in the upper end. So it fits to my needs.

On the other hand, I'm not a die-hard hammond player, and I never tried to very precisely tweak it to rebuild a particular hammond sound. I guess for every board, there will always be people praising and criticizing its sounds, as it is so subjective. So the best, as always, is to try it by yourself.

I can imagine though that there's better offering nowadays, as the SK1 is quite an old board. Look for the value for money and which features you absolutely need.

Last edited by jejefunkyman; 04/05/21 04:25 PM.
StanC #3091621 04/05/21 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by StanC
{SK1 vs. XK-1c}...it's down to just a couple things. First the extra voices. I don't necessarily need them, but it might be nice to have the option
At least the XK-1c still includes MIDI zoning, so you can easily add sounds from, say, an iPhone/iPad... and the XK-1c also has a kind of advantage in having all that empty panel space, giving you somewhere to put that extra device.

Originally Posted by StanC
never thought the XK1 sounded horrible. With the same technology, the two should sound the same.
Not all VASE III Hammonds sound the same. The basic technology of the drawbar sound is the same, but they have made changes, including in the Leslie simulation, which has a big effect on the sound. See also: http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2787869/Re_Help_choosing_Hammond_XK1_v


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StanC #3091624 04/05/21 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by StanC
I never thought the XK1 sounded horrible. With the same technology, the two should sound the same. I wonder maybe there WAS something wrong with the unit Dave was using or maybe EQ/amplification? Or perhaps just a matter of personal taste. Can anyone else comment further on the SK sound?
I had an XK1 and migrated to an SK1 in 2012.

As previously noted, I found the basic B3 emulation of the SK1 and XK1 to be very similar with the SK1 having a much better Leslie sim and more tweakability than the XK1, including the ability to load custom settings from Jim Alfredson and others.

I swapped out the XK1 for the SK1 mainly due to the SK1's smaller size, its improved Leslie sim, and its extra voices which are gig worthy enough to be used in a pinch.

I would add that the SK1's action is more springy and IMO not quite as light, fast, and B3-like as the XK1's. Having said this, the SK1's action is still pretty good for B3 chops,

Last edited by HSS; 04/05/21 06:44 PM.

Gigs: Nord 5D 73, Kurzwel SP4-7, Hammond SK1, Numa Compact 2x, Yamaha MX88, Casio CGP700, QSC K12, Yamaha DBR10, JBL515xt(2)

StanC #3091680 04/05/21 08:39 PM
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I've been satisfied with my SK1-73. Replaced an Electro 3 with it. Seems like the Nord sounded a lot the same regardless of the drawbutton setting. I do like the extra voices, you can load groups of them (until you run out of room). They aren't as good as my Kurzweils, well, the Wurlitzer and Rhodes are pretty good. The Leslie effect is better than Kurzweil's KB3 on high speed, although a Vent would be worth it if one was doing solo organ work.

Doesn't get as much use now for me, at 79, I don't want to carry anything out heaver than my Samson 61 MIDI controller and iPad with Module's organs (and 500+ other sounds).

It IS a bunch lighter and easier to carry than the old XK1. If you are looking used, probably not a huge difference in price over XK1-c.with same organ but no auxiliary sounds.


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Well, I decided to do my duty as an American citizen and help to recharge the economy by spending my stimulus check! SK1 on the way! But it wasn't easy. Sweetwater, out of stock more in a FEW WEEKS. SameDayMusic - 25 minutes on the phone, no one answered - Good bye. Musicians friend, back ordered. So I went back to a deal I saw on ebay that I was hoping to negotiate with one of the above. It included a gig bag and the EXP-20 for the same price.


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
StanC #3091864 04/06/21 08:26 PM
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Congratulations! I'm a happy SK2 user -- organs sound plenty good to me. Enjoy!

StanC #3091930 04/07/21 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by StanC
Well, I decided to do my duty as an American citizen and help to recharge the economy by spending my stimulus check! SK1 on the way!
Congrats - nice board.

Cheers, Mike


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stoken6 #3091932 04/07/21 11:14 AM
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Wow! Despite the estimated delivery of Monday 4/12, the tracking number says out for delivery as I type. Ordered yesterday at around 10, delivery today! Armens in NY was the vendor. I'm in CT so that was just a short hop!


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
StanC #3091956 04/07/21 03:36 PM
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Good for you Stan, you will be very happy with the sk1; I'm late to comment, but I still have mine and for what we play, it is a great backpack B3/Epiano, piano. Joe


SK-1 61; Mojo LE; Mojo 61. Leslie 122. MS kp500sn, Ventilators.
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Stan - congrats you're gonna love the SK1! thu

Joe P #3092080 04/08/21 06:09 PM
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OK first impressions!
Help from SK1 owners? The default B3 called The Rock, setting for the leslie is with the Stop LED lit. When the fast mode is turned off, there is no slow mode. Yes Stop can be turned off every time there is a power recycle or patch change (PITA). So I thought I have to create my own sound by tweaking the default. The manual (may as well be in Chinese) has a section about how to create your own sounds but falls short of the finish line and saving the work. Also quite disappointing is the Overdrive. When activated and amount knob at max, does not change the sound at all. I don't generally use a lot of distortion. On the XK1, I would run it with the knob maybe at 9 o'clock. At 12 or more, was way too much.

Any hints and suggestions are appreciated!


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
StanC #3092155 04/09/21 06:17 AM
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Stan,you’ve made a wise purchase. Don’t let the sometimes cryptic manual get you down. The finish line for saving a patch is on page 62 of the manual. When you’ve got the patch tweaked hit the record button then hit enter.

Overdrive has a mess of variable settings on page 92. #1 Overdrive-Drive sets a master range of o.d. available to the o.d. knob. You can also set how the the expression pedal interacts with the o.d. Whether o.d. is on and how much there is can be programmed per patch. When you want o.d. make sure the o.d. button is lit.

I hope this helps a bit and isn’t painfully obvious. I’m well over 5 years in and the manual still gives me a headache. A real Hammond console is so much simpler to understand.

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Yes I agree that the SK1 is not the easiest board to setup. It took me also quite some time and effort to do it, but I found the user manual well made. I think it is just the way the board is designed which makes it a bit complicated. But there are tons of documentation on the Hammond website, also some video tutorials. Make sure to check them out, and take some time with the board to test various functions. But once the SK1 is setup, then you’re goog to to 😁 And the fun can begin...

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Originally Posted by jejefunkyman
. . . tons of documentation on the Hammond website, also some video tutorials. Make sure to check them out, and take some time with the board to test various functions. ...

I looked for a forum and did go to a Hammond website. But did not find anything useful. I registered with the forum but could not find a way to log on. Contacted moderator - awaiting reply. The Hammond website I was on must have been the wrong place. Can you please send a link to the one you mention?

Thx!


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
Pa Gherkin #3092173 04/09/21 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Pa Gherkin
Overdrive has a mess of variable settings on page 92. #1 Overdrive-Drive sets a master range of o.d. available to the o.d. knob. You can also set how the the expression pedal interacts with the o.d. .

Eureka That;'s it! thu Thank you, Thank you! Guess I never made it to page 92! Too anxious to just play! (that's my story and I'm sticking with it.) The problem was the expression pedal was set to control the O.D. That is kind bizarre. Why would the default factory setting be for the expression pedal to control anything but expression? confused


Stan
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Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
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Google Hammond organ company USA, go to support page for tutorials.


SK-1 61; Mojo LE; Mojo 61. Leslie 122. MS kp500sn, Ventilators.
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Originally Posted by jpgxk3
Google Hammond organ company USA, go to support page for tutorials.
Thank You!


Stan
Gig Rig: Yamaha S90 XS; Hammond XK-1; Rehearsal: Yamaha MOX8.
Retired: Yamaha S90, Korg Triton Le61, Hammond M2/Leslie 145, Wurly 200, Ensoniq VFX, NEO Vent;
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Keys: Hammond SK2, Hammond SK1, Korg Vox Continental
Amplification: Line6 L3T, Yamaha DBR-10, Presonus Air 10, Leslie 122V
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HSS #3092802 04/13/21 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by HSS
Of the four clones mentioned above which I've played, I personally prefer the SK1's B3 sound emulation slightly over the Mojo's and a lot over the Nord 5D and the Numa Compact 2x's.
Besides what's strictly subjective, I think some of the variability in how people rank these boards is that different players can care about different things (possibly also related to their musical styles, e.g. jazz players may care more about different attributes than rock players, etc.). So for example, I care more about overdrive, leakage/crosstalk, key click, and percussion than I do about chorus/vibrato. Others are much more concerned with the CV than the overdrive or key click.

I preferred the Nord over the SK1 largely because of the overdrive. My favorite built-in rotary effect is the Numa Organ 2. No board has the best of everything. (I haven't actually played a Mojo, though I have played VB3 elsewhere... and yes, it is quite good.)

Of course the real B3s and Leslies we're emulating varied in some of these attributes as well!

Originally Posted by HSS
I also have a Nord 5d and a Numa Compact 2x, which has a stripped-down Numa organ engine
Just as an aside, the Numa Compact 2X overdrive/rotary is not nearly as good as in the Numa organs.


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Originally Posted by AnotherScott
Originally Posted by HSS
Of the four clones mentioned above which I've played, I personally prefer the SK1's B3 sound emulation slightly over the Mojo's and a lot over the Nord 5D and the Numa Compact 2x's.
Besides what's strictly subjective, I think some of the variability in how people rank these boards is that different players can care about different things (possibly also related to their musical styles, e.g. jazz players may care more about different attributes than rock players, etc.). So for example, I care more about overdrive, leakage/crosstalk, key click, and percussion than I do about chorus/vibrato. Others are much more concerned with the CV than the overdrive or key click.

I preferred the Nord over the SK1 largely because of the overdrive. My favorite built-in rotary effect is the Numa Organ 2. No board has the best of everything. (I haven't actually played a Mojo, though I have played VB3 elsewhere... and yes, it is quite good.)

Of course the real B3s and Leslies we're emulating varied in some of these attributes as well!

Originally Posted by HSS
I also have a Nord 5d and a Numa Compact 2x, which has a stripped-down Numa organ engine
Just as an aside, the Numa Compact 2X overdrive/rotary is not nearly as good as in the Numa organs.
All good points... I don't use much overdive, so the SK1's overdrive issue doesn't concern me much. C/V and percussion are what I use the most, hence my bias.


Gigs: Nord 5D 73, Kurzwel SP4-7, Hammond SK1, Numa Compact 2x, Yamaha MX88, Casio CGP700, QSC K12, Yamaha DBR10, JBL515xt(2)


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