#990028 - 04/08/05 02:32 AM
music industry school question
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welcomein
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hey guys, im currently looking into possibly going to school for something in the field of music industry, i've been looking at the musicians institute, and it looks like they have a pretty good program, has anyone here attended there or know some more about it?
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#990029 - 04/08/05 11:18 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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So, everyone who got their studio jobs via a music school, please raise their hands!
(sound of crickets....)
I have two suggestions.
1. Try to get a job in the industry and work your way up.
2. Go to a four year acreditied college for a full degree.
Just my opinion.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#990030 - 04/08/05 12:05 PM
Re: music industry school question
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robmix
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I did, as did most of my graduating class. I started at the Hit Factory in NYC and quickly moved past all the other runners who didn't go to recording school. It helps to know what all the buttons do. My first week I was setting up Synclaviers and doing recalls for the assistants - all things I learned to do at school . BTW, I also recommend a four year degree.
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#990031 - 04/08/05 03:21 PM
Re: music industry school question
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bdbklyn
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As some one who has hired hundreds of young engineers and worked at a number of major studios, I can give you some insight as to how it works. If the person doing the hiring doesn't have a 4 year degree or any "formal" recording training, their criteria for who they hire will be the same. They are more likely to hire someone with no background who is eager to learn, a quck study and easy to get along with.
While an admistrator, I would get a least 100 resume's a month. There were possibly 3 positions per year that needed to be filled. As I've stated before, in the 90's when everyone was cutting back on staff, an unfilled postion due to natural attrition or having to let someone go needed to be filled immediately.
I would always have a stack of preffered resume's to review in that contingency and had normally met with most of the candidates in that category.
I would, upon review of a persons resume', file it accordingly. My "A" file were 4 year college graduates with some recording training or some college and major recording program completion. Anyone also having experience with customer service would go to the top of that pile.
My B folder would have those with just high school and a major recording program. The c folder would be the kids that just wanted to get into the biz.
Bill Dooley
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#990032 - 04/10/05 08:31 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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hmm, thanks for all your thoughts guys... i got this link from a guy on another forum, what do you think about the article?
http://www.ibreathemusic.com/article/156
seems like the MI gives you opportunity to do whatever you want...
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#990033 - 04/11/05 09:54 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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"seems like the MI gives you opportunity to do whatever you want... "
Well, you could stay home, save the money, and do anything that you want, too.
Listen, this guy wrote from his experience. Fair enough. Now I'm writing from my experience. As a guy who had occasion to hire many people, I can tell you that I have had so many assholes come to me from technical schools that I got to the point where I would just throw their applications away. They didn't know what they were supposed to know to do the work. They generally had a -lot- of attitude. They were generally unreliable, late, missing in action, and seemed to have more personal problems and drama that spilled into the workplace than one might find in six operas. Not what I want in entry-level personnel trying to work their way up in a busy company with 120 employees.
We hired quite a few in the late 80s and early 90s, and when we stopped, a representative of one of these schools called and spoke to me about it. When I gave them an ear-full about the quality of their curiculae and the persona of their graduates, they never called back.
You can do whatever you want, or you can learn to do the job that the employers need you to do, and learn the skills to make you a valuable asset. Your choice.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#990034 - 04/11/05 12:52 PM
Re: music industry school question
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teaboy
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in a way i agree a little bit with both sides of the argument. i went to one of the 'dreaded' schools.... only for a nine month diploma though... since i didn't really want to grow old and twisted before i'd actually set foot in a studio with a paycheck in my pocket.
i would say from my experience that education can only help you... assuming that in the first place you are a nice, intelligent, musical & hard-working rock'n'roll son of a biatchio. if you have none of the above vital stats then you're basically fuc*ed because nobody will give you a job for more than 10 minutes.
i did a million and one teaboy / bog-cleaning jobs etc at studios before i fell into what i actually wanted to do (which is produce/laugh/earn money... etc) and although i had a little education in studio stuff.... frankyly nobody gave a rat's ass. i actually KNOW that i lost a potential job at a major 4 ssl studio in london because the bastard who interviewed me wanted somebody 'just like he was' when he started. ie... no education whatsoever.
anyways..... to sum up, i'lll give you some fortune cookie style quotes from 2 of my most treasured givers of advice. make up your own mind
"so young and you throw your whole life away" - R.E (worked for the BBC and taught double bass at my school when i told him i wanted to have a career in music)
"life is short so you'd better do what you want because most people don't and end up like that guy over there"
-my grandad (pointing at a city-banker in his late 40's puking up in a train station)
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#990035 - 04/17/05 03:55 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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hmm yeah, these are all definitely good points that im reading... i guess i'm just not sure, it seems like MI has a pretty intensive program and i've heard from a lot of people that it is well respected, and that they also have great contacts in the industry.
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#990036 - 04/19/05 02:56 PM
Re: music industry school question
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Mudcat
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You need to check out MTSU's Recording Industry Program .
I am a graduate and taught there for a while in the early 90s.
If you are motivated they will give you the tools to develop your skills, use your talents and get a good internship. Cost of living is very low in middle Tennessee and you are a 30 minute drive from Nashville.
If you think a diploma will guarantee you a job in the recording industry, don't bother enrolling. It's still up to you to excel as an engineer and develop the right people skills to land and keep jobs and/or clients. The most succesful graduates of MTSU's program are very entrepeneurially minded and quite driven.
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Mudcat's music on Soundclick "Work hard. Rock hard. Eat hard. Sleep hard. Grow big. Wear glasses if you need 'em."-The Webb Wilder Credo-
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#990037 - 04/19/05 11:25 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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hmm ill check that out mudcat, have you heard anything about the program at MI, i've been hearing good things in general about it in the last week or so, i'd really like to go out west if possible...
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#990038 - 04/20/05 10:17 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Valkyrie Sound
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Try USC's program if you want to go to LA.
I went there and loved it...
Listen to Bill... he's got the perfect picture for ya. You can also search this forum. There is more info on audio ed programs here if you look.
In the meantime... my very outdated site has some info on me: http://www.vsoundinc.com
Good luck!
Valky
PS: Hiya Bill! 
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#990039 - 04/20/05 02:40 PM
Re: music industry school question
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Mudcat
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Originally posted by welcomein:
hmm ill check that out mudcat, have you heard anything about the program at MI, i've been hearing good things in general about it in the last week or so, i'd really like to go out west if possible...
Visit their websites and give the recording departments at these schools a call to get all of the information you can.
Please pay attention to what Bill said above. His advice is quite sage.
_________________________
Mudcat's music on Soundclick "Work hard. Rock hard. Eat hard. Sleep hard. Grow big. Wear glasses if you need 'em."-The Webb Wilder Credo-
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#990040 - 04/24/05 10:03 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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do you think it might be beneficial to go to one of their workshops? they're having a weeklong one at the end of june,i figure it could be a cool way to meet some people and check out the school.. maybe even learn something too!
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#990041 - 04/25/05 10:28 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Mudcat
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Originally posted by welcomein:
do you think it might be beneficial to go to one of their workshops? they're having a weeklong one at the end of june,i figure it could be a cool way to meet some people and check out the school.. maybe even learn something too!
_________________________
Mudcat's music on Soundclick "Work hard. Rock hard. Eat hard. Sleep hard. Grow big. Wear glasses if you need 'em."-The Webb Wilder Credo-
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#990042 - 05/01/05 07:51 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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yeah thats what i figured, and if nothing else, it could be a wicked cool time! they even give you a DVD at the end of your performance at the finale concert...
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#990043 - 05/02/05 07:31 AM
Re: music industry school question
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keyman_sam
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Guyz, i'm 17 and i want it to be my life. however, how i also want a regular college degree!
what do i do?? learning from yall guyz experiences.
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#990044 - 05/02/05 07:44 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Valkyrie Sound
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Go to USC if you also want a full degree.
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#990045 - 05/02/05 08:17 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Mudcat
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Originally posted by Valkyrie Sound:
Go to USC if you also want a full degree.
_________________________
Mudcat's music on Soundclick "Work hard. Rock hard. Eat hard. Sleep hard. Grow big. Wear glasses if you need 'em."-The Webb Wilder Credo-
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#990046 - 05/09/05 12:00 AM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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well i for one think you could get a music degree anywhere if you also want to focus on other things really, any major university will be able to give you that... for me, i'm considering MI because i want to focus 100% on music and that's what they provide you with.
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#990047 - 05/09/05 04:18 PM
Re: music industry school question
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theblue1
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It's been my perception watching this and other industries for the past quarter century that when business goes south, the schools really crank up their marketing.
Since the recording industry is about as south as it's been in a long time, the schools seems especially desperate to fill their seats.
Do not be fooled by people with an aggenda who fill your head with your excellent prospects for employment. In this business environment, there is little work and less opportunity.
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#990048 - 05/15/05 01:41 AM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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hehe most of the people i have talked to don't really seem to have an agenda, they are acquaintances, friends, or just other musicians i have met while out and about... it seems like a pretty good place from what i can tell...
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#990049 - 06/01/05 07:43 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Steevo
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Originally posted by Mudcat: Originally posted by Valkyrie Sound:
Go to USC if you also want a full degree.
Many of the above comments are right on ... a four-year degree should provide you with a solid foundation to advance more rapidly, and also open your eyes to options within the industry that you might not be aware of.
Good luck. S.
Oh, Hi Bill, I'm sure that my resume was in your stack of 100 at some point!
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#990050 - 06/03/05 12:14 PM
Re: music industry school question
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Henchman
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Originally posted by robmix:
I did, as did most of my graduating class. I started at the Hit Factory in NYC and quickly moved past all the other runners who didn't go to recording school. It helps to know what all the buttons do. My first week I was setting up Synclaviers and doing recalls for the assistants - all things I learned to do at school . BTW, I also recommend a four year degree.
The Hit Factory is closed, isn't it?
As well as alot of big studio's that were the breeding ground for alot of talented people.
I too started in a wellknown studio years ago.
Fact is, that the music industry today is a very different one than it was even 5 years ago. And I personally have a hard time encouraging anyone to get into the field, or spend ANY money trying to get an education in it.
The chances are that it won't pay off. And be awrae that when you get out of scholl, the chnaces of making anyhting more than minimum wage for the next couple of years are slim to nothing.
_________________________
IMDB Credit list President George Washington: "The government of the United States is in no sense founded on the Christian Religion." President Abraham Lincoln: "The Bible is not my book, nor Christianity my religion."
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#990051 - 06/12/05 06:28 PM
Re: music industry school question
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welcomein
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thanks for all the advice dudes, this is a field that i'm pretty interested in so ill have to think about it a lot! at the least i think im going to check out the MI place at a weekend workshop coming up this summer...
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#990052 - 06/13/05 12:21 PM
Re: music industry school question
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iamthoreau13
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Originally posted by theblue1:
It's been my perception watching this and other industries for the past quarter century that when business goes south, the schools really crank up their marketing.
Since the recording industry is about as south as it's been in a long time, the schools seems especially desperate to fill their seats.
Do not be fooled by people with an aggenda who fill your head with your excellent prospects for employment. In this business environment, there is little work and less opportunity.
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#990053 - 06/13/05 07:56 PM
Re: music industry school question
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bdbklyn
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Originally posted by iamthoreau13:
[/qb]
Now that's an interesting agenda. One I've never really considered. I have been around so many professionals throughout my career that did nothing but encourage people to succeed and be better at what they do. From Ed Cherney and Chris Stone who used to moderate this particualr forum to George Massenburg, Bob Katz, Brad Blackwood and recently on Mr. Anderton's forum, David Reitzas and Bruce Swedien. These professionals or myself or other posters here have done nothing to discourage anyone from "taking work from them".
That's a very interesting perspective you have iamthroreau13.
(are there really 12 other iamthoreau's?)
Can I ask you what you are basing your opinion on?Does anyone else feel this way?
Bill Dooley
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#990054 - 06/17/05 09:44 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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Originally posted by Steevo:
[QUOTE] Oh, Hi Bill, I'm sure that my resume was in your stack of 100 at some point!
If so, you would have gotten a call. I was very high on the Miami program. It is these non-accreditied focus schools with which I have a problem, that promise to make you an engineer in 9 months, and ... well... don't.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#990055 - 06/17/05 09:55 AM
Re: music industry school question
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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Originally posted by iamthoreau13:
[QUOTE]
Speaking of agendas, of course someone already in the industry is going to try to keep someone looking to get in out. Who wants other people taking work from them? Everyone has an agenda, even you.
The audio industry is filled with working professionals who seem to be the least selfish when it comes to sharing, of pros in any industry. The top players in the business are available at news groups and bulletin boards every day to share information, not only amongst themselves, but with anyone who cares to ask a question or join in on a discussion.
There isn't anyone coming into this business today that I consider to be a threat to my income. I've been making recordings since 1965. If you hire a newbee over my experience, that is your choice. Enough people make the opposite choice to keep me working as much as I want to work. If you really think that you got something to take me down, bring it on. But don't sit on the sidelines crying that you 'coulda been a contenda' but we never gave you a chance. We do everything to prepare you except give you the damned job.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#990056 - 06/18/05 11:47 AM
Re: music industry school question
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bdbklyn
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Bill,
A little more hostile than my response, my blood was boiling about that comment too. After about 12 edits or so I was able to make my reply seem civil. My original reply was simply your first sentence...."What bullshit!".
Bill dooley
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#990057 - 06/24/05 08:58 PM
Re: music industry school question
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Gemz
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I am also looking into the recording industry. I am Graduating from high school next year and am looking a a few different schools. I am really interested in OIART (Ontario Institute of Audio Recoding Technology) Does anyone know anything about their course?
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