#512174 - 04/14/04 02:57 PM
Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Keyplayer
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Registered: 11/19/01
Posts: 410
Loc: Maryland, USA
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Hey George,
Have you seen this "Baby SSL 9000XK" console? Is it any good? Anybody else?
http://users.pandora.be/studiolane/AWS_Preview.pdf
Oh yeah, I almost forgot. It's $87K for a 24ch/8buss version.
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#512175 - 04/14/04 03:52 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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System 8
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Registered: 11/01/02
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I want one! Finally they are coming out with mixers we can afford, at least we can afford to take a loan out and get on.
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#512176 - 04/14/04 04:00 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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mark kramer
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Registered: 09/29/03
Posts: 54
Loc: Dresher, PA.
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Strange: it does not appear on the SSL website.
Also, I see keyplayer just posted the price.
Thus, it just dropped off my shopping list.
Regards,
Mark
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#512177 - 04/14/04 04:11 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Curve Dominant
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Huh! An SSL control surface for Pro Tools. They oughta sell a few of those.
When a top analog console manufacturer starts making control surfaces for DAWs, you know there's a cycle completing itself.
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#512178 - 04/14/04 04:24 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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3D Audio
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Registered: 01/19/00
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Given the same price for a console with audio routing and preamps and EQs and buses, or an ethernet remote control with no audio capabilities, which would you choose? One has usefulness regardless of ProTools and the other is a dedicated PT controller. Which do you think will hold its value longer?
It seems SSL has made a very timely move into the right arena.
_________________________
Lynn Fuston 3D Audio Inc Home of 3dB
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#512179 - 04/14/04 04:33 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Gtoledo3
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Registered: 08/03/01
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Loc: Tampa,FL,UNITED STATES
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Originally posted by 3D Audio:
Given the same price for a console with audio routing and preamps and EQs and buses, or an ethernet remote control with no audio capabilities, which would you choose? One has usefulness regardless of ProTools and the other is a dedicated PT controller. Which do you think will hold its value longer?
It seems SSL has made a very timely move into the right arena.
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#512180 - 04/14/04 04:43 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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LawrenceF
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Registered: 10/11/01
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Wow.
Lawrence
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#512181 - 04/14/04 04:54 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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System 8
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I just talked to SSL in New York on this puppy.It will cost $87,000 and will be on their web site on Friday. It is an analog mixer that has a toggle switch which allows it to be a controller for all the DAW's. The led strip on each channel is a nice touch. Great transport control. Should make Yamaha DM 2000 owners a little jealous.
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#512182 - 04/14/04 05:10 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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dave-G
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Registered: 04/07/01
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Loc: FL and CA Bay Areas
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Originally posted by 3D Audio:
Given the same price for a console with audio routing and preamps and EQs and buses, or an ethernet remote control with no audio capabilities, which would you choose? One has usefulness regardless of ProTools and the other is a dedicated PT controller. Which do you think will hold its value longer?
It seems SSL has made a very timely move into the right arena.
On the other hand, because of their stranglehold on interface protocol, this SSL is likely to be handcuffed into "HUI emulation" via MIDI for its control of ProTools. In that case, it's moderately comparable to an analog DM2000.
It all remains to be seen, but it's funny how recent years have boosted SSL on to a pedestal, as if an icon of sound "quality". I can pretty clearly remember the almost ProTools-like disdain that many engineers held for SSL's sound despite their appreciation of its routing, automation and dynamics features-per-channel.
Anyway.. good luck to both these things.. It's nice to see some developments that bring some more physical and intuitive interface for working with this stuff, regardless of expense.
-dave
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#512183 - 04/14/04 05:26 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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System 8
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My understanding is the mic pre's of SSL 10 years ago were not that great, but recently they have made strides in their latest pre's. In fact they are pretty clean and neutral sounding.
SOS reviewed their latest mic pre's and said "The preamp section sounds big, with a full and solid bass combined with an airy open high end. The mid-range has an intrinsically clean and neutral quality which, combined with the extremely low noise floor and virtually non-existent distortion, provides a wonderfully 'black' backdrop to recordings made in a quiet and well-controlled acoustic. The unit clearly has bags of headroom, and it doesn't sound strained even when driving the output hard, as can often be required to interface with professional digital recorders."
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#512184 - 04/14/04 06:05 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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doug osborne
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Registered: 08/15/00
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Yup, SSL has to be using HUI emulation.
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#512185 - 04/14/04 06:37 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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System 8
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Someone told me that since the Hui was only a 8 channels on it, you can't control more than 8 faders with the Hui emulation, is this true?
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#512186 - 04/14/04 07:47 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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LawrenceF
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Registered: 10/11/01
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Originally posted by System 8:
Someone told me that since the Hui was only a 8 channels on it, you can't control more than 8 faders with the Hui emulation, is this true?
The only drawback was some support people said that it would require 3 seperate midi in/outs, a multiple midi interface card. But it can be done because the DxB is reported to have a 24 fader bank of HUI control.
On a $85k mixer I think it shouldn't be a major design issue.
Lawrence
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#512187 - 04/15/04 02:05 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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DAS
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Registered: 09/15/03
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Loc: Nashville
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Eric, good point. This does look like a cycle repeating itself.
It seems to me, this is a bit of an acceptance on SSL's part as to where they see the future heading. Let's face it, at least in today's economy renting a studio that has a $700K console is only affordable for a very small percentage of today's record budgets. I believe it was tron who earlier noted that current LA rates for studios are approaching mid 1980's levels...and engineer rates are not far behind. This desk gives a chance for studios to offer more than a bedroom can give and still offer top SSL hardware with what might be the first decent control surface...both at a price that can give studios some breathing room. I'm sure there will be many who will complain about this or that, (probably me, for that matter) But in the end, this looks like a great way to have the best of both worlds. Or at least some of the best. I believe we're seeing the future.
_________________________
DAS
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#512188 - 04/15/04 02:56 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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E-Lambo
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DAS - yeah, what you said... An SSL has always been more than necessary for me, and certainly more expensive, but I've always wanted the sound. Now here it is. SSL-LE. Very appealing.
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#512189 - 04/15/04 06:09 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Philip O'Keefe
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Originally posted by System 8:
Someone told me that since the Hui was only a 8 channels on it, you can't control more than 8 faders with the Hui emulation, is this true?
So yes, even with HUI emulation, it would certainly be possible for a 24, or even 32 channel fader surface / controller. I'm not positive, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's exactly how SSL is going to implement it.
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#512190 - 04/15/04 09:44 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Ultra left & right
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Registered: 07/11/02
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Gtoledo3:
I agree Lynn, though I think it would have been nice if they had included an automation option, and made it expandable.... unless I am missing something and those options are included/available.
-----------------
Exactly! Expandability and automation option and I would consider one right away.
Ultra
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#512191 - 04/15/04 11:28 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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System 8
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For that money you could still buy a DM2000, a bunch of SSL X-logic front ends, and an outboard analogue mixbus unit, and still have change for a comfy sofa and some acoustic treatment!
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#512192 - 04/15/04 03:40 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Ultra left & right
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Only four rotary encoders fo plugs. Couldn't they have given us at least eight?
  Ultra
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#512193 - 04/15/04 05:19 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Philip O'Keefe
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Originally posted by System 8:
For that money you could still buy a DM2000, a bunch of SSL X-logic front ends, and an outboard analogue mixbus unit, and still have change for a comfy sofa and some acoustic treatment!
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#512194 - 04/15/04 11:26 PM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Bill Mueller
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System 8,
As a DM2000 user (and past SSL engineer) I feel not one twinge of jelousy.
$87,000.00 will buy: 2-DM2000's, 6-AD824's (total of 96 mic pre's), two GML 2032's, 2 SSL XLogic channels, $18,000.00 worth of PT Plug ins (can you spend that much?) and $4,000.00 for a month in Hawaii.
I end up with 100 high quality mic inputs, 192 24 bit 96k mix channels, 24 high quality digital efx units, 5.1 monitoring and dynamics, graphic eq's, amp modeling, etc., etc.,
The guys who might feel a little put out are the poor souls who paid over $500K for a 20bit Axiom.
Best Regards,
Bill
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#512195 - 04/16/04 12:13 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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djwayne
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Registered: 08/23/03
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Well, if I needed an $87,000 tax write off maybe..but until that time comes, I'll stick with my $4,200 Mackie 24x8 with meter bridge....let's see...24 x 8 analog board, does the SSL really sound that much better ?? $87,000...I could buy 20 Mackies for that.
okay, I'm out of my league here.
_________________________
Living' in the shadow,
of someone else's dream....
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#512196 - 04/16/04 02:58 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Philip O'Keefe
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Originally posted by Bill Mueller:
$87,000.00 will buy: 2-DM2000's, 6-AD824's (total of 96 mic pre's), two GML 2032's, 2 SSL XLogic channels, $18,000.00 worth of PT Plug ins (can you spend that much?) and $4,000.00 for a month in Hawaii.
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#512197 - 04/16/04 05:34 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Wolfgang Eller
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Originally posted by djwayne:
Does the SSL really sound that much better ?? $87,000...I could buy 20 Mackies for that.
okay, I'm out of my league here.
But it is always hard and expensive to get the last 5%.
Cheers Wolfgang
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#512198 - 04/16/04 05:40 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Philip O'Keefe
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Originally posted by Wolfgang Eller:
Yes the SSL sounds better. If itīs that much, you have to decide by your own.
But it is always hard and expensive to get the last 5%.
Cheers Wolfgang
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#512199 - 04/16/04 08:01 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Ultra left & right
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Phil O'Keefe: Yes Bill, but you won't have the SSL "name" to impress clients.
------------------------------
I'm sure you would impress many.
Ultra 
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#512200 - 04/16/04 08:48 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Philip O'Keefe
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Originally posted by Ultra left & right: Phil O'Keefe: Yes Bill, but you won't have the SSL "name" to impress clients.
------------------------------
I'm sure you would impress many.
Ultra  Some for sonic preference reasons, some for mix automation reasons, and some strictly because they know the 'name' and little else. But the automation isn't on this board, is it? That leaves at least two reasons why someone might be impressed with it, and I'm sure people will think of others. But that doesn't mean great work can't be done on a DM2000...
IMO, client demands, preferences and expectations ARE reasonable considerations when making gear decisions. However, so are cost vs benefit considerations and what your market and rates can support. So while I am happy to see things of that nature being developed by companies like SSL and even Digidesign with their new controller, it's still too rich for my blood. I don't want the payments on a $100 K console / controller hanging over my head every month.
But I'm sure it will be the perfect fit for other people. And that's cool for them. But I can't justify the price - not in my market with my rates and with the industry in the turmoil it is in. Not when I can get a board that does what I need for a fraction of that price without having to take on that huge payment burden.
Of course, YMMV. But in my world, people are not going to be impressed enough with the SSL name to be willing to pay enough extra above what I'm charging now to make it a smart financial move.
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#512201 - 04/16/04 09:04 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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Ultra left & right
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Not that is my problem, Phil, but I have never understood your investments. You could have sold your ELAM's long time ago and gotten yourself a SSL, or at least a HD-system. Instead you're working on lots of small stuff, only capable of 48KHz, with terrible second hand value  .
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#512202 - 04/16/04 10:55 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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djwayne
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Registered: 08/23/03
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Originally posted by Wolfgang Eller: Originally posted by djwayne:
Does the SSL really sound that much better ?? $87,000...I could buy 20 Mackies for that.
okay, I'm out of my league here.
But it is always hard and expensive to get the last 5%.
Cheers Wolfgang
_________________________
Living' in the shadow,
of someone else's dream....
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#512203 - 04/16/04 11:22 AM
Re: Hey George. "Baby SSL?"
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DAS
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Registered: 09/15/03
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just my two cents on the SSL automation issue....
For all these years making the "industry standard" console, I've yet to see a automation system these guys have made that I think is great. I can forgive the ancient system of the previous generation, but Axion, 9K and the XL all have one of the most cumbersome, counterintuitive systems I've ever seen. The Euphonix and even the PT system is much better. IMO SSL got to happy with that dang light pen!
Even Lucasfilm, when they bought all of those 9Ks a few years back had them all retrofitted with Flying Faders!
Adding 24 faders of automation would have pushed the price point significantly higher. And they probably figured that since the whole point of this console seems to be working with PT (or other DAW) that would be the mixing platform anyway. Why add the cost for something that would rarely be used?
_________________________
DAS
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