#433560 - 11/01/03 07:52 PM
BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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passionmax
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Registered: 11/13/02
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I have a Luciod Gen 6/96 as my master clock. Then I am going to 3 digital pieces using 15ft Word clock cabels. Is the clock more stable with shorter cables or are the cables fine
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#433561 - 11/02/03 08:52 AM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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Sp3nc3r
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Registered: 10/31/00
Posts: 3862
Loc: St. John's, NL., Canada
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Too much longer and things MIGHT start to get dodgy. The more improtant factor is having all of your cables the same length.
Cheers!
Spencer
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"I prefer to beat my opponents the old-fashioned way....BRUTALLY!!!!"
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#433562 - 11/02/03 08:57 AM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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Christian Peters
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Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 29
Loc: Berlin, Germany
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passionmax,
I think 15ft cables (which are approx. 5m - right?) are o.k. But the lenght of a cable has nothing to do with the stability of the transfered clock signal. A longer cable run could increase jitter in your clock signal. Also the risk of catching distortions caused by other devices or cables in your studio is getting higher with longer clock cables. But the stability of your Gen 6/96 clock is not affected by your cable lenght.
Regards, Christian.
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#433563 - 11/02/03 01:53 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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kubapk
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Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 44
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Hi there...
If you can shorten your world-clock cables do it. The quality of your cables and connections is also very important. We had such a problem in our studio (yes, Lucid clock generator, Yamaha 02r96, Studer D19 and ProTools). After shortening cables everythong become more stable.
Best regards and sorry for bad English
Kuba
P.S. Test sonic results od using different clock generators - the results are really interesting
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#433564 - 11/02/03 02:34 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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passionmax
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Registered: 11/13/02
Posts: 236
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Hi,
thanks for your advise. the main reason I brought the cable question up is When I am mixing the stereo mix sounds spatial and a lot of depth. when I print the mix there is a little change. A little less hihghs and lows and reverbs sound a little duller. very minor. I had a engineer come in to check it out. we figured out that maybe the cable lengths are degrading the sound or adding more jitter. This is my setup. see if you guys can help me fix thi s problem.
Digital performer lightpipe out 24 channels from a motu 2408MKIII to a Yamaha dm-2000 desk. Then spdif out of the desk into the motu 2408mkIII spdif in to print my final mix. I have a lucid gen6/96 as my master clock. All cables are 15 -20ft long. I also used to have my DM2000 going to a cranesong HEDd-192 by AESEBU first so I can insert a Avalon 747. and then spdif to the motu 2408III. we notice the extra piece degraded the sound even more so we disconnected it and went straight from the DM2000 to the motu. He also thought that the MOTU my suck and I should change to RME. he felt the MOTU was not proffessional and probably does a horrible job with Wordclock and that the RME stuff is much more stable. let me know your thouhgts
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#433565 - 11/03/03 10:06 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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vibes
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Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 79
Loc: USA
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I have the gen x word clok as well..stable piece of gear..had some similiar issues and was advised by numerous experts to try and have cables be the same length and be sure that the digital gear in the studio is not daisy chained and as a total finis just to be sure get a terminator cap for the last output of the word clock(radio shack)..believe it or not..all of my problems disappeared once I added a simple terminator cap to out 6 on the last out of the word clock distributor..hope this helps
regards
vibes
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#433566 - 11/03/03 10:06 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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jdunn
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Registered: 05/19/02
Posts: 192
Loc: Los Angeles
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A few thoughts.... MOTU indeed does a pretty poor job at implementing wordclock. Their AES/EBU sucks too!
I am using an Apogee Big Ben to feed a Fairlight Merlin and a Sony DMX R100 console w/ 25' Canare cables. No clocking problems, though the Apogee says the Sony is over-terminated until it's turned on. This has nothing to do w/ cable length though.
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#433567 - 11/03/03 10:12 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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vibes
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Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 79
Loc: USA
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One more thought with the clock issues from or with the motu 2408..
here I think may lie your problem..the 2408 wants and likes to be the master..
I do have a set up on the pc that requires the 2408 to send master clock to the lucid which then slaves the rest of your gear tom it..
upon looking at youre problem I HIGHLY suggest setting up your motu as master..set gen x to external clock and you might be suprised at the fidelity..also be sure that all of the clocking relationships match your settings of your audio card..meaning your pci324 on the motu should be set as MASTER when master..and word clock only when slaving to an external source like the gen x..btw..the lucid piece can handle this job as distributor and actually improve signal a bit..so GO FOR IT!!
regards
vibes
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#433568 - 11/04/03 01:05 AM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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TinderArts
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Registered: 07/31/00
Posts: 5675
Loc: Bowie, MD
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Any digital gear that performs worse when synced to an external word clock is going to have a short shelf life and low resale value. Avoid such products.
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#433569 - 11/04/03 01:36 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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Roger Foote
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Registered: 07/05/03
Posts: 156
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We have 7 assorted MOTU interfaces, (1224's, 308's, 24i, 2408, 2408mkII) and all work correctly slaved to our GenX 6 master clock. AES is being used heavily too without a problem on Mac G4's running DP3 under OS9.2.2.
The main rig has a 1224, 308, 2408mkII, E4XT Ultra, EX5R and TC M3000 as W/C slaves. We have Lexicon PCM81 and PCM 91 connected via AES/EBU to the 308.
All cables are the same length (6 feet). We bought the cables from Mouser Electronics, we chose their Hi-Rel cables and they seem to be really high quality.
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#433570 - 11/04/03 03:00 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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Yuri T.
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Registered: 02/27/01
Posts: 656
Loc: ,,UNITED STATES
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Max recommended cable lenghts:
Word Clock 75ohm BNC 15 feet max
AES/EBU 110ohm XLR 300 feet max
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#433571 - 11/04/03 11:47 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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edmann
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Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 314
Loc: MA
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Originally posted by vibes:
One more thought with the clock issues from or with the motu 2408..
here I think may lie your problem..the 2408 wants and likes to be the master..
I do have a set up on the pc that requires the 2408 to send master clock to the lucid which then slaves the rest of your gear tom it..
upon looking at youre problem I HIGHLY suggest setting up your motu as master..set gen x to external clock and you might be suprised at the fidelity..also be sure that all of the clocking relationships match your settings of your audio card..meaning your pci324 on the motu should be set as MASTER when master..and word clock only when slaving to an external source like the gen x..btw..the lucid piece can handle this job as distributor and actually improve signal a bit..so GO FOR IT!!
regards
vibes
Have you ever done this?
thanks
Ed
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Ed Mann
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#433572 - 11/05/03 01:18 PM
Re: BNC word clock cable length. does it matter?
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vibes
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Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 79
Loc: USA
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Hey Ed..
I am always open to a BETTER way with clock..
My examle is related to a bunch of gear that acting badly in terms of clock(including making the lucid the master)..basically bad interaction with one another...
other items in the mix of clock include..
digimax lightpipe
rme 96/52(in mac)
motu 2408(with pci 324 in pc)..stand alone at times interfacing with the rme in the mac..
also finalizer and rarely an adat..go back and forth between pc and mac for many reasons..but in my case at least..clicks and pops..anything related to clock was settled once making the 2408 the master..I guess boosting the signal from the lucid piece and using external clock on it now makes it a glorified wc distributor..but after a long time of every possible config..master/slave..this is what works for me on a regular basis..
With the lucid as boss could not get the digimax to clock at all unless I make it the master..
So thats it..thoughts?
regards
vibes
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