#433257 - 10/20/03 02:34 AM
How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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Brad Roberson
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Registered: 10/19/03
Posts: 1
Loc: San Francisco
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How can I improve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
Hi all, I hope someone out there has some ideas or info that can really help me out.
I'm someone who is usually pretty good at figuring things out. I've taught myself how to play bass, guitar, piano, and sing on my own. I have also over the years been trying to teach myself how to record my music with some success, but when it comes to compressing or limiting or eq-ing vocals I'm afraid that I'm totally lost.
I've had a ROLAND VS 1680 for about 2 years now. I just recently installed one of the VS8F2 EFX cards last summer. While I feel like I have a pretty good handle on getting decent sounds when miking my intstruments... vocals have been an entirely different story all together.
I suspect a major problem is my inexperience dealing with the digital compressor / limiter settings in the EFX card. No matter what I try to do my vocal tracks consistently sound muffled in the mix... like I'm singing into a pillow.
If you like, you can listen to a sample of one of my recordings.
http://home.earthlink.net/~vandykepajama/101403poncho.mp3
On this track I sang into an AKG solid-tube condenser mic, that was plugged directly into my Roland VS.
I ran that through a Dual compressor / Limiter setting on the EFX card. I set the threshold at -12 the ratio at 2:1 the attack to 1 and the release at 100 and set the out put level at 10 db for compressor A. Compressor B had all of the same settings except that the output level was set at 0 db.
I then ran the vocal signal through a second EFX stetting that utilized a Limiter. I set the threshold at 85 the release at 20 and the output level at 85
This EFX also had a 3 band EQ
I cut the low frequency -2db at 220 w/ a Q of .6
I boosted the mid 5db at 2910 w/ a q of 2.0
and also boosted the high at 5.8k with a q of 2.2.
the only other thing in the vocal efx chain is a 70ms delay.
I hoping someone out there can listen to this track or read the settings that I detailed above and recognize where I might have gone wrong. I need someone to steer me in the right direction because I'm pulling what little hair I have left on my head trying to figure this one out on my own.
Please Help me!
Thanks,
Brad Robertson
sample recording 
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#433258 - 10/20/03 03:03 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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Matt.Hepworth
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Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 2972
Loc: Riverdale, UT
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Checked it out. Kind of muddy, but kind of interesting in the highs too. Use a wider Q (2 or 3) on the lows and get rid of some of that bottom. Kill all below 100hz. Use a wide boost in the 3-8k range (you'll) have to sweep it around and find the sound you're after there, but do it in the mix, not with the vocal soloed, because the vocal will sound bad by itself sometimes, even when it's perfect for the song.
Slow the attack on the comp and use single time with a little higher ratio to see what happens. Not having the vocal to play with, that's where I'd start, then tweak to where you need.
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No matter how good something is, there will always be someone blasting away on a forum somewhere about how much they hate it.
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#433259 - 10/20/03 03:06 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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Matt.Hepworth
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Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 2972
Loc: Riverdale, UT
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Oh yeah, let us know how it turns out!
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No matter how good something is, there will always be someone blasting away on a forum somewhere about how much they hate it.
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#433260 - 10/20/03 03:47 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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where02190
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Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 5402
Loc: Weymouth, Ma. USA
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IMHO the solid tube is a very ho hum mic. I'd start there. Also, I'd get an outboard preamp, The Roland preamps are also pretty hohum. The FMR Really Nice Preamp is a good budget choice.
Don't sing up into the mic. this restricts your airflow and you'll lose power and definitiion. yea I know all those instudio M-tv shot show singers doing it, it's a load of crap. By tilting the head up you constrict your windpipe, and rob yourself of power and control.
I always recommend the elvis pose, stand straight relax shoulders forward, and neck relaxed and straight. Your windpipe is fully open, your chest cavity is relaxed and will resonate properly, and you have max power and control over your airflow. (Go ahead, A/B the two methods right now, you'll see.)
If low end boomyness is aproblem give the mic a bit more distance from your mouth.
Basically what I'm suggesting is work on getting a better vocal sound going in, rather than "fixing in the mix". then, when mixing time comes, a bit of eq and compression will really make your vocal tracks (and all other tracks, the theory applies to everything) sparkle and shine.
_________________________
Hope this is helpful. NP Recording Studios Analog approach to digital recording.
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#433261 - 10/21/03 12:19 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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zele
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Registered: 01/12/01
Posts: 1136
Loc: carmel,CA,UNITED STATES
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Brad
http://www.vsplanet.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?category=1
give this site a search----wonderful help from VS users..
cjogo
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#433262 - 10/21/03 06:22 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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Alndln
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Registered: 08/15/00
Posts: 6451
Loc: ,NY,UNITED STATES
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Since the Roland has SPDIF in,you might want to consider a Mic Pre with SPDIF out to bypass the Rolands converters.
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"A Robot Playing Trumpet Blows"
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#433263 - 10/21/03 11:02 AM
Re: How can I imporve the quality of the vocals recorded on my ROLAND VS 1680? -samples
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edmann
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Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 314
Loc: MA
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Give it some air - i.e. employ a bit of off-axis and distance between you and the mic. Often I will put a large diaphram condenser mic up at about the level of the brow and 12" - 18" in front of the singer - sometimes with a screen - and as was mentioned in a previous post: do not sing up into the mic... just face forward or be comfortable. Open the pickup pattern up as much as your situation will allow. You may be amazed at how much this will add to the quality of the recording.
good luck!
Ed
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Ed Mann
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