#1964180 - 06/29/08 02:34 PM
Best Piano Mic?
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wdl
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There is precious little talk about how best to mic a grand piano for live/studio work. I've come a cross a real gem of a mic from Applied Microphone Technology, called the AMT M40:
Here is a pic of the unit:
Here is a pic of how the mic is placed:
Check out the specs and who uses them
Any other ideas on this new topic would be welcome!
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Bill http://www.myspace.com/billlevinson Nord Stage, Hammond XK3, Hammond C3, Leslie 122, Steinway B, Dyno-My-Rhodes 73, D6, 200A, AccuGroove T112 cabs, QSC power, Manley preamps
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#1964203 - 06/29/08 05:00 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: wdl]
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SK
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Very interesting. Looks sort of like a combination mic/pickup. I used to bring my own piano pickups for live piano gigs.
From the endorsements, I get a feeling these might be used more for concerts and live recordings than studio, but I may be wrong. I need to ask my engineer about it - he did the sound for a Chick Corea acoustic gig recently.
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#1964244 - 06/29/08 07:33 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: wdl]
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wdl
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this one is mostly for live gigs. For recording, they suggest the following:
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Bill http://www.myspace.com/billlevinson Nord Stage, Hammond XK3, Hammond C3, Leslie 122, Steinway B, Dyno-My-Rhodes 73, D6, 200A, AccuGroove T112 cabs, QSC power, Manley preamps
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#1964245 - 06/29/08 07:36 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: wdl]
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SK
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Ah. Now that makes sense.
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#1964441 - 06/30/08 07:54 AM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: SK]
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Jeff Klopmeyer
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It's very difficult to assign the word "best" to any microphone (or monitor speaker, for that matter). What's great for miking a classical piano is going to possibly be different than what's ideal for jazz or pop.
One mic I don't particularly love for other sources is an AKG C414, but I've generally had great results using two for stereo piano miking.
Some specialty systems, like the one referenced above, get good reviews. If you have the money, the Earthworks PM40 is pretty highly acclaimed, as is the DPA SMK4061. But in the studio, I've been more a fan of taking high-quality matched pairs and trying out what works best for that player, on that piano, on that kind of music (whatever it is), as oposed to thinking one solution is going to be best for everything.
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#1964458 - 06/30/08 08:15 AM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: Jeff Klopmeyer]
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ITGITC?
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But in the studio, I've been more a fan of taking high-quality matched pairs and trying out what works best for that player, on that piano, on that kind of music (whatever it is), as oposed to thinking one solution is going to be best for everything.
Similar idea for vocalists. One mic doesn't work for all voices. You just have to try various mics to determine which one is best.
For me, it's an old SM57 with a pillow in front and a large piece of floorboard from a 1984 Chrysler LeBaron in front of that. 
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"Old age and treachery TRUMPS youth and beauty." ................................ Is There Gas in the Car? 
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#1964464 - 06/30/08 08:31 AM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: ITGITC?]
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wdl
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PS- I just used the word "best" with a "?" to stimulate discussion. I do think that the M40 does a great job for live performance - especially because it is the only mic where you can close the lid, minimize bleed from other sources, and very high gain before feedback. It is only about $400 bucks. Even with the matched condensers, the total is about $1,000. Compare that to the $3,500 Earthworks system, and it starts to sound pretty great
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Bill http://www.myspace.com/billlevinson Nord Stage, Hammond XK3, Hammond C3, Leslie 122, Steinway B, Dyno-My-Rhodes 73, D6, 200A, AccuGroove T112 cabs, QSC power, Manley preamps
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#1964613 - 06/30/08 02:05 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: wdl]
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Jeff Klopmeyer
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Sure... there's definitely "great for the money", which is very legitimate when very few of us have unlimited expense accounts at music stores. 
But with a thread title like "best", you do have to consider the high-end options as well.
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#1964677 - 06/30/08 05:01 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: Jeff Klopmeyer]
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ABECK
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I agree with Jeff, 414s aren't too bad for stereo mic'ing a piano (not my cup-o-tea for vocals though.) earthworks also does have some good options - love their stuff. For stereo mic'ing, I prefer an ORTF setup, which is something like 10in apart, 110 degree spread (think of putting mics right where your ears are.) Spaced pairs can be difficult. Although, sometimes mono is a good option too. In that case, something like a U67 always did it for me. A foot or two away, lid open.
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#1964683 - 06/30/08 05:22 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: ABECK]
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wdl
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There are dozens of cool approaches for good recording...price no object, blah, blah, blah...
But none of those kick it with the headroom and in a live setting line the M40.........
Also, the darned thing sets up in a second
_________________________
Bill http://www.myspace.com/billlevinson Nord Stage, Hammond XK3, Hammond C3, Leslie 122, Steinway B, Dyno-My-Rhodes 73, D6, 200A, AccuGroove T112 cabs, QSC power, Manley preamps
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#1964714 - 06/30/08 07:22 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: wdl]
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Steve Nathan
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I read the thread title and expected this to be a discussion of Elux251s
I tend to go with the $15K/per mics when they're available
When they're not, (spam alert), I (honest to God) still love the Studio Projects mics (and 2 decimal places cheaper :)) . Forewarned, but it's the truth, I don't endorse anything I don't use.
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#1964781 - 07/01/08 01:07 AM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: Steve Nathan]
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Bobadohshe
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+1 on the Studio Projects man. A close friend of mine uses the C1 for all his large diaphragm needs, and man does that thing sparkle and shine!
I want to get one more and use them on my piano.
For now I've been using two Shure KSM 27s. It's a budget solution no doubt, but until I can get some AKG 414s, they're doing the trick for me.
Heck I might honestly just get another C1 as Steve suggested.
And then run them through This Puppy.
Edited by Bobadohshe (07/01/08 08:31 AM)
Edit Reason: grammar
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#1964801 - 07/01/08 03:36 AM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: Bobadohshe]
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ABECK
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Good point, Bobadohshe, a good mic pre is just as important as the mic.
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#1965557 - 07/02/08 03:06 PM
Re: Best Piano Mic?
[Re: Jeff Klopmeyer]
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Mark Schmieder
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So many ways to mic the piano. Some even use twenty or mics, to pull in the whole 3D field of sound and then mix it later.
One popular approach is what is known as a Boundary Mic, which looks like a thin slab that sits on the soundboard. This approach is also quite popular with kick drums. In recent years, the Boundary Mic has gained a lot of populararity for both applications, but the mics tend to be special-purposed for one or the other. Several manufacturers now have quality, affordable boundary mics. It takes some of the guesswork out of miking, but like any mic still has to be used with some understanding of what is going on and what you are trying to achieve.
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