#1937363 - 05/05/08 12:20 PM
Myanmar Crisis
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Compact Diss
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If anyone is going to be setting up a raffle or fund to donate to this latest crisis I am willing to throw in an 8x10 of BB King or any artist on my page, we can talk specifics later. Anything I can do to help, let me know how I can be involved in helping these people.
Joe
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#1937402 - 05/05/08 01:24 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Dr. Ellwood]
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BrianWren
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I just had a look at the country and history of Myanmar. Does anyone have a reason (that is, beyond just hoping so) to believe that any relief intended for Myanmar would ever reach those who need it?
I mean, I read that a human rights group had a cadre of its representatives met and beat up. This is thought to have been sanctioned by the government itself.
Due to Myanmar's political climate, there are not many media companies in relation to the country's population, although a certain number exist. Some are privately owned, but all have to go through the censorship board.
Internet access within the nation has been suspended, reportedly in an attempt to dampen international awareness of the situation there, politically. It has also been reported that troops have been specifically targeting people with cameras.
Evidence has been gathered suggesting that the Burmese regime has marked certain ethnic minorities such as the Karen for extermination (the common terms for that are “ethnic cleansing” and “genocide”).
In November 2006, the International Labour Organization announced it would be seeking “to prosecute members of the ruling Myanmar junta for crimes against humanity” over the continuous forced labour of its citizens by the military at the International Court of Justice. If they force their citizens into labor, it would seem that they have no interest in their citizens’s well being. That is, they see the citizenry as an expendible resource.
I am inclined to believe that any help sent to a country like this is doomed to never reach those who need it. I also am inclined to hear any reasons that show that my initial inclination is mistaken...
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#1937422 - 05/05/08 01:49 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: BrianWren]
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Phil W
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It seems really dumb of me and insensitive but I wish you wouldn't refer to it as Myanmar. The people of Burma have suffered for many years at the hands of the military regime and that regime is the one that instigated the name, Myanmar.
This humanitarian crisis is terrible and we have to help despite obvious concerns over the potential misuse of aid but this is just the latest suffering of the Burmese people who have been suffering in a huge scale for a long time while the world has done very little.
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#1937426 - 05/05/08 01:54 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Phil W]
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Dr. Ellwood
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We will see what the useless UN does!
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#1937466 - 05/05/08 02:56 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Phil W]
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Compact Diss
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It seems really dumb of me and insensitive but I wish you wouldn't refer to it as Myanmar. The people of Burma have suffered for many years at the hands of the military regime and that regime is the one that instigated the name, Myanmar.
This humanitarian crisis is terrible and we have to help despite obvious concerns over the potential misuse of aid but this is just the latest suffering of the Burmese people who have been suffering in a huge scale for a long time while the world has done very little.
Wow. I was calling it Burma but someone at work corrected me. I don't care what the hell it is called all I know is that these people need help. I can't even imagine the devastation these people are experiencing, the guy cutting me off in traffic was the worst thing I experienced on my drive in, open up CNN and I see real pain and real suffering. We have it easy on a daily basis.
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#1937479 - 05/05/08 03:18 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Phil W]
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BrianWren
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This humanitarian crisis is terrible and we have to help despite obvious concerns over the potential misuse of aid.
I heard this proverb, and it has meant a lot to me over the years: “If you go into the woods to rescue someone, and you die, you failed.” The way it applies here is that the one who goes into the woods to help but dies is driven most likely by “But I have to do soemthing!” Yet they actually did nothing.
I would like to help the victims of this tropical cyclone, whatever the snot they’re called. But my desire does not create an approach path where one does not exist—irrespective of the intensity of my empathy and grief.
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#1937482 - 05/05/08 03:22 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: BrianWren]
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Compact Diss
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I just watched the news and so far their government is not answering our offers of aid.
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#1937488 - 05/05/08 03:30 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Compact Diss]
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Dr. Ellwood
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I just watched the news and so far their government is not answering our offers of aid.
They will CD, it takes a little time to figure out the logistics of how to send the aid money to their hidden bank accounts.
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#1937525 - 05/05/08 04:52 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Hardtail]
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A String
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Let's please keep the politics in check guys.
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#1937547 - 05/05/08 05:35 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Dr. Ellwood]
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miroslav
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Nothing against the people of Myanmar or Burma...but I can't help point out that in the USA...the Midwest has already been hit hard by tornados/flooding...and this week is setting up for yet one more round of bad storms.
I know we have government aid systems already in place in the USA...but it's never quite enough.
Since the government of Myanmar/Burma is reluctant to make support easy and to open it's doors....maybe it would be best to just help our own folks here if anyone is inclined to do so.
Looks like Texas/Oklahoma and on up into the Ohio valley...will be getting a big slam this week....
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miroslav - miroslavmusic.com"Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important."
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#1937548 - 05/05/08 05:40 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Hardtail]
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Gifthorse
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Its wierd, in that location in the world you would assume the people would be at least aware of typhoons or cyclones (anyone know the difference? Are Typhoons north of the equator?)
I am saying that because 120 mph winds hardly seem as dismal as say a hurricane in the US. Typhoons often hit Taiwan and people rarely die. I understand this country may be third world but still, you would think the populace after living with the reality of cyclones for thousands of years would be better prepared to deal with one even at little notice.
I know I am ignorant, I am bad with geography and know little about the culture..
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#1937551 - 05/05/08 05:47 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: miroslav]
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Kramer Ferrington III.
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Well, I don't think you can just whack some money in an envelope and send it "to the distressed people of Myanmar (nee Burma)".
Perhaps the best solution would be to find some charity that's already working there (Red Cross?) and donate some money to them. That way their govt. wouldn't get its hands on your donation.
It doesn't mean that your money will actually ever reach Myanmar/Burma because all these organizations have overheads of their own to pay for, and must also decide whether your money is best spent in Myanmar or Darfur or Bolivia or wherever. But at least it's a way of knowing that your money won't be spent on machine-guns.
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#1937557 - 05/05/08 06:00 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Kramer Ferrington III.]
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Bluesape
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Last reminder on politics.....
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Never a DUH! moment! Well, almost never. OK, OK! Sometimes never!
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#1937569 - 05/05/08 06:24 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Bluesape]
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Gifthorse
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You know obviously there was something that this storm brought that was worse than probably anyone knew of, or that many people wouldn't be affected. I am just ignorant of the whole cyclone gag because I live in Michigan. I know down south they have hurricanes, and I know typhoons are in the pacific. So anyone know why hurricanes have more powerful winds?
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#1937577 - 05/05/08 06:46 PM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Gifthorse]
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Compact Diss
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Anyone can feel free to remove this thread. It was meant for good but some have strong opinions, I understand. Been there, done that. I just read that Oxfam is setting something up if anyone wants to donate.
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#1937708 - 05/06/08 01:35 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Kramer Ferrington III.]
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Phil W
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Well, I don't think you can just whack some money in an envelope and send it "to the distressed people of Myanmar (nee Burma)".
Perhaps the best solution would be to find some charity that's already working there (Red Cross?) and donate some money to them. That way their govt. wouldn't get its hands on your donation.
It doesn't mean that your money will actually ever reach Myanmar/Burma because all these organizations have overheads of their own to pay for, and must also decide whether your money is best spent in Myanmar or Darfur or Bolivia or wherever. But at least it's a way of knowing that your money won't be spent on machine-guns.
+1
That's just what I meant by trying to help. There are organisations with people risking their lives in Burma trying to help. The situation for minorities, for Christians and for ordinary people there is atrocious and has been for years..
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#1937711 - 05/06/08 01:56 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: BrianWren]
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Phil W
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This humanitarian crisis is terrible and we have to help despite obvious concerns over the potential misuse of aid. But that just doesn't make any sense at all. If the intended aid doesn't get to the actual victims, wherein is any benefit accomplished? All you would be doing is strengthening the hand of those doing the oppressing.
I agree. We have to be smart in our giving.
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#1937712 - 05/06/08 02:04 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Compact Diss]
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Phil W
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Anyone can feel free to remove this thread. It was meant for good but some have strong opinions, I understand. Been there, done that. I just read that Oxfam is setting something up if anyone wants to donate.
I don't think this thread is anything to worry about. Thanks for raising the issues.
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#1937740 - 05/06/08 04:17 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Phil W]
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Strategery
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Hey, too many people around the world have a huge heart when it comes to giving..to include its gov'ts, but as stated on this thread several times, too many times the money has gotten into the wrong hands and the people suffering never saw any of it.
Even the president's wife came on tv saying they're trying to get American aid there but as of yet, the Miramar/Burma gov't has yet to accept it.
It's a shame when dictatorships let THEIR politics get in the way of humanitarian efforts for their own people.
I feel sorry for the people.
I'm from the South here in America, have lived through several hurricanes where I've watched trees crash into my home and my roof fly off the house.
Hey, when it's over, I get the chain saw out, start cutting up trees and clearing the debris, and then call up the insurance company and get the ball rolling.
Buy hey, I have that capability but in countries like that, they don't have the same means that we do.
It absolutely amazes me when I watch parts of the world gravitate toward those kinds of gov'ts that refuse to care for its citizens in a natural disaster.
Lot's of people here love to talk about Katrina and make ridiculous accusations, but I'm telling you...that was a disaster of Biblical proportions that simply can't be repaired over night.
You can see a snipet of it on a news report and form your opinion, but until you GO THERE and see it...you don't have a clue.
Similar to N.Y. City and Ground Zero.
I was 12 when Hurrican Camille came through Biloxi Mississippi and that absoulutely flatened everything.
In those days, there wasn't the finger pointing that goes on now.
The people were more resiliant, they picked up the pieces and moved on.
They didn't complain, bitch, demand, or point fingers, especially when a natural disaster was the reason for their woes.
Most went to their churches and thanked God that they were still alive and buried and prayed for the dead and missing.
Neighbor helped neighbor.
That's how we still do it down here but unfortunately, you'll have to search the WWW hard to see such things and you damn sure won't see it on any news channel. Such things are not popular to show.
Now days, people for what ever reason, can't understand why repairs of this magnitude can't be made over night.
They want the INSTANT FIX...even though they realize it's not possible.
The stupidity of that mindset simply amazes me.
It's funny, the news is on now and they're reporting on it.
It looks like 30,000 could be dead and maybe...they're starting to accept aid because of the magnitude of the destruction.
THey're also saying that they REFUSED aid in 2005. Go figure.
Maybe there's a ray of light at the end of this tunnel, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Randy
Edited by Strategery (05/06/08 04:19 AM)
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#1937792 - 05/06/08 06:23 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Strategery]
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miroslav
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News Clip - Bush just announced that the USA has an aid package signed and ready to go...they are now also waiting for the Myanmar military governament to open it's doors for more cooperative aid from the USA...
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miroslav - miroslavmusic.com"Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important."
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#1937851 - 05/06/08 07:46 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Gifthorse]
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BrianWren
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...typhoons or cyclones (anyone know the difference? Are Typhoons north of the equator?)
Tropical cyclone form all over the world where the sea temperature is above 26ºC. In the Atlantic and east Pacific, these are called hurricanes when the wind speed gets above 75MPH. West of the date line (I think) the same exact storm mechanism and behavior is called a typhoon. In the Indian Ocean, they are called cyclones.
Of all the places these storms form, the worst ever recorded are in the Indian Ocean.
But the typhoons between Hawaii and the Philipines often (several times every year) exceed sustained winds of 200MPH.
Far and away the worst part of these storms is the really low central air pressure, which lifts the ocean level like a vacuum. This 50 mile diameter bulge of water is pulled ashore with the storm. The interaction of the bulge, the shore and the wind causes what's called a storm surge, and it can be a wall of water that rise 30 to 40 feet in less than 20 seconds, and persists. Drownings are the leading cause of tropical-cyclone-caused deaths.
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#1937859 - 05/06/08 08:02 AM
Re: Myanmar Crisis
[Re: Gifthorse]
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BrianWren
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You know obviously there was something that this storm brought that was worse than probably anyone knew of, or that many people wouldn't be affected. I am just ignorant of the whole cyclone gag because I live in Michigan. I know down south they have hurricanes, and I know typhoons are in the pacific. So anyone know why hurricanes have more powerful winds?
They need lots and lots of humidity (that causes the lofting of the air which is what drives them), hot enough sea surface temperatures to provide that humidity (cyclones just cannot get organized unless the surface temp is a minimum 26ºC), and low velocity of the upper level winds across their "heads."
The hotter the sea temp, the higher the wind.
The lower the wind across the top (shear, it's called), the higher the wind.
The longer they sit still, the higher the wind (they get more organized).
In economically depressed areas, the sea is where subsistance can be found, so everyone moves there. That makes far more people than the roads can evacuate quickly.
In economically depressed areas, there is not much attention paid to the news, because they're too busy trying to eke out a living, so they often "don't get the memo."
These are the victims of the storm surge...
If a storm is particularly fast moving, it can be upon people before they can react.
If you remember, Katrina went from a Category 2 to a cat 5 in about 15 hours. The whole time, the predicted storm track was shifting by as much as 300 miles. In a case like that, who do you evacuate? And we have far better communications, transportation and forecasting abilities than a place like Burma/Myanmar.
(Not that I am proposing that man is not the omnipotent master of his own destiny... )
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