#1683813 - 09/13/05 09:18 PM
Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
Kendrix
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 09/06/01
Posts: 2150
Loc: Rochester,NY,UNITED STATES
|
Offline
|
|
I must say Im disppointed there isnt more action here. The "use your ears" motif is compelling and JJ may have the sickest most entertaining sense of humor of all the moderators on the planet.
So, I thought Id post this here.
I work mostly as a lone wolf hobbiest in in a small room/home studio. Im struggling with room treatments to improve my tracking versus going very dry (easier to do) and using artifical ambience/verb. It seems to me that a stereo convolution device, in theory, is the best way to apply space artificialy and achieve realistic results.
The plug ins I have are mono inputs- not true stereo. Seems to me the real deal is a full stereo implementation using stereo impulses.
I believe the Sony device intro'd a couple years back is one such beast. Anyone know of convolution plug ins and impulses that are true stereo?
FWIW- Im on Cubase digitally coupled to a Yamaha AW4416.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683814 - 09/14/05 08:43 AM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
Cojonesonasteek
Member
Registered: 01/24/05
Posts: 14
Loc: Austin, Texas USofA
|
|
Offline
|
|
Which convolution verb are you working with? I own Waves IR-1, which has stereo impulses, and have demoed TL Space, which also has stereo impulses. I love the IR-1's flexibility - far more parameters I can tweak to get stuff placed just where I want it in the soundstage. I hear good things about Altiverb but haven't used it. The Sony hardware unit you mention is very expensive compared to the software convolution verbs available (I think retail on the Sony 777 was $7,500 when it came out, vs. $1,000 for a TDM version of IR-1). You can pick up the Native version of IR-1 or TL Space for your Cubase rig for about half that.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683815 - 09/16/05 02:54 AM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
J.J. Blair
Senior Member
Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 326
Loc: Hollywood, CA
|
|
Offline
|
|
Sorry, but I've been superbusy lately. I have as bunch of stuff I ant to post as soon as I can get things off my plate.
Altiverb is really terrific. I use it all the time when I mix ITB.
_________________________
Friends don't let friends act like rockstars.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683816 - 09/16/05 06:53 AM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
Kendrix
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 09/06/01
Posts: 2150
Loc: Rochester,NY,UNITED STATES
|
|
Offline
|
|
Ive started out using the SIR freeware.
It aint bad at all.
I think I was misinerpreting this as a mono-in stereo out device.
Now I realize it is actually stereo in and out.
My bad. Nevermind
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683817 - 09/17/05 11:28 PM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
tripit
Member
Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 20
Loc: LA, CA. USA
|
|
Offline
|
|
I'll second the Altiverb. There are a boat load of IR's too. Run it in mono to mon, mono to stereo, or stereo to stereo, depending on the IR's.
_________________________
What the hell is that thing?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683818 - 10/01/05 12:34 AM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
FIBES
Senior Member
Registered: 08/13/01
Posts: 209
Loc: HELL
|
|
Offline
|
|
Altiverb is definately a great tool.
Quad bro, quad.
_________________________
FIBES
"you can like it or you can not like it."
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683819 - 10/02/05 08:06 PM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
Jessica T
Senior Member
Registered: 02/22/05
Posts: 207
Loc: St. Petersburg, FL
|
|
Offline
|
|
I understand in general how algorythms differ from convolution (hope I spelled that right) in that algorythms are kind of general and the latter are very specific to a given place. But how are the specific measurements gathered for the space in question? If someone has a hardware convolution verb, can they take it to their church or school theater and do this process themself or are all of the programs written to ROM and can not be updated? Also, can convolution verb programs be tweaked like algorythmic ones can be? This seems like a lot, but I'm kind of a newby here and this topic is an exciting new frontier! Thanks.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683820 - 10/03/05 11:53 AM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
BrianK
Senior Member
Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 228
Loc: Los Angeles,CA,UNITED STATES
|
|
Offline
|
|
Not having used them myself (until later this afternoon I will!) I am curious how you relate them to other forms of verb in character? (I know each can be different, but are there sonic strengths and wekanesses (short vs long, for example?)
_________________________
Relax and float downstream...
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683821 - 10/07/05 03:55 PM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
FIBES
Senior Member
Registered: 08/13/01
Posts: 209
Loc: HELL
|
|
Offline
|
|
Originally posted by BrianK:
Not having used them myself (until later this afternoon I will!) I am curious how you relate them to other forms of verb in character? (I know each can be different, but are there sonic strengths and wekanesses (short vs long, for example?)
They are only as good as their impulses but Altiverb 5 gives so much control i very rarely go elsewhere. The plates are super.
_________________________
FIBES
"you can like it or you can not like it."
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683822 - 10/13/05 11:25 PM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
js
Senior Member
Registered: 02/15/01
Posts: 168
Loc: Up and to the left
|
|
Offline
|
|
Convolution is great for capturing real space and real devices. The "measurement" is done by exciting the space or device with either an impulse (think "click") or a sine sweep. You record the result. You then run the source tone and the result through a program which creates the convolution file (often called the impulse file..)
If you stick a speaker in a room and record that a good distance away, you get the reverb print of the room at the spot the mic is at. If you use 2 mics set some distance apart, you'll record a stereo impulse.
So what convolution does well is capture the sound of a real space. Works well with small spaces, large spaces, any space.
But think of it as a snapshot, not a movie. Reverbs such as Lexicon devices get much of their sound by adding modulation to the reverb tail. Convolution cannot capture that. There's tons of impulse files of reverb units around, but because they can't capture the modulation, they come up short. Some still are useful, though.
You don't have to limit impulses to spaces and reverb units. I impulsed a bunch of guitar speakers close mic'ed in different mic positions. I use them as an alternative to the speaker sections of guitar amp simulator plug ins. (If you want to play with them, they're on Noisevault).
js
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1683823 - 10/16/05 08:23 PM
Re: Stereo convolution verbs and impulses
|
Jessica T
Senior Member
Registered: 02/22/05
Posts: 207
Loc: St. Petersburg, FL
|
|
Offline
|
|
Thanks a lot JS. That's pretty cool.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
Moderator: BrianK, J.J. Blair
|
|
|
