#1682701 - 07/02/05 03:33 AM
I really need some advice...
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olegu
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Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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What DAW's should / can I go for?
I have a pIII 866 MHz (yeah, I know its old..)
With 128 (hopefully soon to be 384MB) RAM
and a SB live soundcard.
And I'm running Win 98! 
So I figure I have two alternatives:
1. find some windows software that will run on my machine, and don't cost to much
or
2. Go open source (linux) and hope that the programs have improved since last time I tried that..
Earlier I have mostly been using Buzz (If you don't know, buzz is a kick ass soft synth with a patten based sequencer and tracker style programming) But due to changes in my style and the addition of a Yamaha p120 to my gear, I need some software that is more linear, and makes working with longer audio takes easy. Unless of course someone's got a real trick on how to do that with buzz.
I'm afraid though that I'll miss the flexibility of Buzz.
I must allso say (as you can see from the specs of my pc) that I am on a really tight budget. I'm serving my duty year (yes we have conscription  ) in the Royal Norwegian Airforce now and I make about $20 a day.
Any advice will be very much appreciated.
-Olegu
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#1682702 - 07/02/05 01:15 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Philip O'Keefe
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Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 17674
Loc: Riverside,CA,UNITED STATES
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$20 a DAY?
Wow, I don't know where to start. Have you tried the various Windows shareware apps? N-Trax Studio might be an option.
Audition's out... won't run on WIN98. Ditto that for the latest versions of Pro Tools LE. Pro Tools Free will run, but it's junk IMO, and has only functioned well on a few machines out of the several I've tried it on... and you'd need that RAM upgrade either way... it's available from http://www.digidesign.com
Tracktion might work... let me check... Nope, you need Win2K or XP.
Things are not looking too good. Do you have a audio interface already?
Anyway, check out some of the shareware / freeware stuff on this page... those will be your absolute lowest cost options:
http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/win95/MULTITRACK_RECORDING/
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#1682703 - 07/02/05 05:48 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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olegu
Senior Member
Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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Hi
Thanks for the responce.
I think $20 a day is a fair pay for sitting on my ass doing next ot nothing.... 
I'm not treated that bad really, they pay my rent, I get some money for my wife, and some for food, (The idea is that your'e supposed to to your service before you settle down, but I settled down a bit to quick...  ) So I figure I might spend about $100, if the software really does the trick.
As for n-track, it really looks promising, I'm going to try the shareware version in the morning. Have anyone tried it out, any experiences?
Audio interface..?
I have my trusted SB live 5.1, paired with my Yamaha MG 12/4 mixer, I find it very much usable (not for real time effect processing though.. no WDM drivers in Win 98 )
And yes Pro Tools free is, how should I say it..
less then optimal in any way. (I don't like it, and it crashed quite often ... )
Have anyone tried Ardour on Linux? Looks promising at least...
Again thanx for the help.
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#1682704 - 07/02/05 06:07 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 08/23/03
Posts: 7294
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On your budget, stick with the SB, and work in MME. Forget WDM.
NTRax works well. You might also look at Tstar, another low budget option. You could probably get a used copy of SAW Pro which would run quite well on an 866. I recommend more memory.... shoot for closer to 1 gig. (Yep, I just checked, there's a $40 SAW Pro on ebay right now. This was about a $900 program, and it kicks ass.)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41786&item=7333059009&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
Really, Linux is fine if what you want to do is piss around with your computer figuring out how to do things. Some day it will be great. I want to make music. Today.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#1682705 - 07/02/05 09:52 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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AudioMaverick
Platinum Member
Registered: 05/19/01
Posts: 1790
Loc: Outskirts of Big Bear, CA,UNIT...
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olegu... What is your motherboard? I have two of these with no home, sitting at about 7.000 feet in California...
http://www.legacyelectronics.com/products_listing.php
Legacy Electronics - model 37x5ES0L-1AAG
.spec: PC133 | SDRAM | 168-Pin DIMM | Unbuffered | 133 | 32 Meg x 64 | 32x4 | 16 | Non-ECC | CL3 | 30.48mm(1.20")
They were for an ASUS CUV4X, which has since seen better days. I've never sent anything out of the USA, before. I wonder how these would fare on the trip, or what it would cost.
I can't find a system to put them in. The double-sdied architecture limits what system will accept them. If it would be possible to donate to your cause, I'd be happy to send them.
I think you could benefit from getting XP-Home for just under $100US, and downloading Audacity.
Let me know. Drop an email!
_________________________
"It's all about the... um-m-m, uh-h-h..."
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#1682706 - 07/03/05 03:21 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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olegu
Senior Member
Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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I just might get XP!
Last night when I was trying to get the n-tracks evaluation version working, I had to install something called .Net framwork. This was just a standard windows update package, so there really should be no problem. But it's Win98, of course there was a problem. It complained that it could not get access to some windows installer components. bah, I'm sick and tired of win 98.
Would XP perform ok in my pc if i Upped my ram to 512MB or 384MB?
Saw studio, I've never even heard of that before, anyone using it?
Again, I'm very thankful for all the responces.
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#1682707 - 07/03/05 09:47 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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Registered: 08/23/03
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I didn't recommend SAWStudio, I recommended SAW Pro. SAWStudio is like, $2500. SAWPro, which is discontinued, was about $900 if I am remembering correcty. At $40, it is quite a deal. It was written/working at the time of the 733 and Win98 (though Bob always recommended WinNT)so it is perfect for the machine that you have. (Though I would still spring for some more memory). This looks to me as the least expensive option for building an audio computer for you out of what you have. It integrates well with, I beleive, Master Tracks, if you need MIDI.
You might also go to the PG Music site and check out their options.... again, well-coded software that offers low-budget solutions.
Of course, you can spend hundreds upgrading your computer and OS, but at that point you are better off buying an entry-level Dell for $299. It would include XP Home, a better sound card, a faster computer, etc, etc. A much better deal than trying to upgrade what you currently own.
So, on the cheap, buy software that was designed to run on your machine with the OS that you have. To upgrade, it is more economical to toss what you have than try to buy better components for what you have.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#1682708 - 07/03/05 10:13 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
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Registered: 05/23/00
Posts: 11866
Loc: NY Hudson Valley, USA
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Yeah...Ntrack is very inexpensive, but a solid little DAW.
Before I got Samplitude 7, I gave Ntrack a try.
I downloaded it, paid the $64(?) online to get the "pro" features...and had it up and running 1-2-3. 
Now, the 24-bit version costs $75...but still not expensive.
http://www.ntrack.com/
_________________________
miroslav - miroslavmusic.com"Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important."
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#1682710 - 07/03/05 04:08 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Philip O'Keefe
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Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 17674
Loc: Riverside,CA,UNITED STATES
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Have you tried inserting your original Win 98 installation disk into your CD drive? What you need is probably on that disk. 
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#1682711 - 07/03/05 07:39 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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AudioMaverick
Platinum Member
Registered: 05/19/01
Posts: 1790
Loc: Outskirts of Big Bear, CA,UNIT...
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olegu, I replied to your email. $100 for a 256MB PC133 SDRAM!? If mine will work in your system they are yours, my friend. I'd rather send them to someone who can use them. Except for one PC that is already RAM'd up, all my PCs are DDR.
Check out the links in my email reply. Normally, I'd be up for the new PC thing. But, I lways end up changing the setup until it hits $800 or $1000. If XP Home is under $100 there, this might get you a little time on the PC.
_________________________
"It's all about the... um-m-m, uh-h-h..."
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#1682712 - 07/04/05 05:22 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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olegu
Senior Member
Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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AudioMaverick,my gratitude is imeasurable (I think that is spelled somewhere near correct..)
I AM getting a new computer when I'm done here in the military, but there is still about 10 months left of my service. I am allso planning on buying a new car and a house, but the important things must come first.. :p
BTW, Congratulations to all americans on their independence day from little me down in the bunker at the NATO joint warfare centre in Norway
Here in Norway we've just celebrated our own independence day, 100 years as an independent nation after we broke the union with Sweden June 7th 1905, hurray.
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#1682713 - 07/05/05 02:23 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Philip O'Keefe
10k Club
Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 17674
Loc: Riverside,CA,UNITED STATES
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Congratulations on your country's centennial!
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#1682714 - 07/05/05 04:56 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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AudioMaverick
Platinum Member
Registered: 05/19/01
Posts: 1790
Loc: Outskirts of Big Bear, CA,UNIT...
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olegu... RAM is in the mail! Supposedly 5 to 7 days to get there. I'm glad you could get ahold of XP. I'll send an email with more.
Enjoy your Centennial!
_________________________
"It's all about the... um-m-m, uh-h-h..."
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#1682715 - 07/06/05 01:51 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Philip O'Keefe
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Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 17674
Loc: Riverside,CA,UNITED STATES
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That was very cool of you AudioMaverick! 
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#1682716 - 07/06/05 05:55 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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Bill@Welcome Home Studios
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Registered: 08/23/03
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And this brings up a point: what do we do with our old computer stuff?
Most of us waste it. I know at the Cultural Trust and at various corporations that I have done work for (like Westinghouse, ALCOA, etc...), they fill rooms (and eventually, dumpsters...) with used PCs, printeres, and displays and discarded computer gear.
I give mine to a fellow who puts computers together and donates them to old people. This allows these older individuals to get email to keep in touch with relatives, and basically just gives them something to do with their time.
Seems like a good idea to me. There is always a senior's center or church group nearby who could use our discards.
Bill
_________________________
"...it's easier than hitting the kids, and almost as much fun..."
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#1682717 - 07/06/05 10:19 AM
Re: I really need some advice...
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olegu
Senior Member
Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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well, there's allways the option of shipping it off to poor conscripts in Norway...
And yes, AudioMaverick is cool, the coolest.
-Olegu
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#1682718 - 07/06/05 12:33 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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AudioMaverick
Platinum Member
Registered: 05/19/01
Posts: 1790
Loc: Outskirts of Big Bear, CA,UNIT...
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Thanks, y'all... It feels good to know that something I had sitting around doing nothing for me is going to be useful to someone else. It's those little things in life -- family, friends, delicious food, good deeds, funny jokes, and great music! :rolleyes:
The adventure begins... Memomry with an American flag icon and the word Patriot on it begins its journey some 5,000 miles. And, the source & destinations both are celibrating their nation's independence on that same week. That's pretty cool... And, the trip is about the price of a Starbucks coffee! {Oops... wrong thread...}
Will it make it in a week, like the USPS says...? I can't wait to find out. Yesterday, it got stuck at 7,000 feet, due to a fire at about 5,000 feet, near an area full of youth camps. Let's hope that is the only obstruction.
The fire is contained, now. All is well in the Big Bear area. But, a lot can happen between now and November. Then, it's snow!
_________________________
"It's all about the... um-m-m, uh-h-h..."
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#1682719 - 07/06/05 01:02 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
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Registered: 05/23/00
Posts: 11866
Loc: NY Hudson Valley, USA
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Originally posted by olegu: [ Originally posted by miroslav: Yeah...Ntrack is very inexpensive, but a solid little DAW. Before I got Samplitude 7, I gave Ntrack a try. I downloaded it, paid the $64(?) online to get the "pro" features...and had it up and running 1-2-3. Now, the 24-bit version costs $75...but still not expensive. http://www.ntrack.com/ But still, I need to install the .net framework And as explained further up, that failed...
...it's time to move on from Win98, 'cuzit's only going to hammper you as you get deeper into other audio hardware/software...IMO.
_________________________
miroslav - miroslavmusic.com"Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important."
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#1682720 - 07/06/05 01:48 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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offramp
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Registered: 10/31/00
Posts: 5846
Loc: Golden, CO.
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Originally posted by bpark@prorec.com:
And this brings up a point: what do we do with our old computer stuff?
Most of us waste it. I know at the Cultural Trust and at various corporations that I have done work for (like Westinghouse, ALCOA, etc...), they fill rooms (and eventually, dumpsters...) with used PCs, printeres, and displays and discarded computer gear.
I give mine to a fellow who puts computers together and donates them to old people. This allows these older individuals to get email to keep in touch with relatives, and basically just gives them something to do with their time.
Seems like a good idea to me. There is always a senior's center or church group nearby who could use our discards.
Bill
_________________________
I've upped my standards; now, up yours.
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#1682721 - 07/06/05 06:14 PM
Re: I really need some advice...
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olegu
Senior Member
Registered: 05/01/04
Posts: 69
Loc: Norway
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Just a little update from the conscript:
I am now running XP! hurray, and I can't wait to get the new RAM, then it will run smoothly.
all hail to the über cool AudioMaverick
I've been trying loads of different Software demos / sharewares,
- Cakewalk sonar 4 (Yeah I know it's WAAAY out of my league but I just had to try it.
- N-tracks
- Pro Tools free
- Magix Music Studio
- Buzz
My big frustration is that all of my focus goes on trying out all these softwares, and I produce zero music. Until I sat down with the good old Buzz (www.buzzmachines.com) After just twenty minutes I had put down quite a cachy hook.
Brilliant!
Buzz is allmost the utlimate music prodution tool.
It has no limits on softsynths, effects and the routing posybilities are unlimited. It really has only one drawback... It is a tracker type sequencer, which I love for doing arpeggio style synth riffs, and drum programming. But it is really lacking in Midi and sync. And audio capabilities in the form we know from our favourite DAW are not present at all, making it impossibble to program THE bass track, and then record a long solo over it.
The solution, I know, is either syncing a DAW with buzz via midi (or maybe rewire, read something about buzz getting rewire capabilities) or dumping programmed tracks from buzz to audio and using them as loops in a traditional DAW.
But that will again take my focus away from the music and over to the technical side
Well enough complaining, In the end I will figure out a workflow that works for me, it'll just take some time to adjust to working with a traditional DAW interface aswell as my buzz interface.
-from the consript inside the mountain working the graveyard shift
-Olegu
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