#1647714 - 04/15/04 03:12 PM
Materials FAQ?
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MurMan
Senior Member
Registered: 11/17/03
Posts: 370
Loc: San Diego
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Ethan/Andre,
There's obviously a great deal of interest in DIY absorption projects. This forum is doing an excellent job in bringing up the group's knowledge level.
Seems like the biggest problem most people are having is deciding on the absorption material and finding/communicating with a supplier. Andre has done us a service by compiling specs, but over time it will become hidden in various threads.
Would it be possible for the two of you to create an "Acoustic Materials" FAQ that has materials, specs, manufacturers, and distributors? I hate to ask you to contribute more free time, but I can see a lot of reinventing the wheel as newcomers discover this forum and go through the same discovery process. It might save you time in the future.
thanks and keep up the good work,
Murray
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#1647715 - 04/15/04 04:09 PM
Re: Materials FAQ?
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Ethan Winer
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 06/12/00
Posts: 5407
Loc: New Milford, CT, USA
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Mrray,
> Would it be possible for the two of you to create an "Acoustic Materials" FAQ <
The main Acoustics FAQ is second in the list on my Articles page:
http://www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html
The problem for now is this forum's software does not support "sticky" and "announcement" posts that stay at the top. I understand there will be new forum software one of the days...
--Ethan
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#1647716 - 04/16/04 09:57 AM
Re: Materials FAQ?
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Andre Vare
Senior Member
Registered: 03/13/04
Posts: 125
Loc: Hamilton, ON Canada
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Seems like the biggest problem most people are having is deciding on the absorption material and finding/communicating with a supplier. Andre has done us a service by compiling specs, but over time it will become hidden in various threads.
Would it be possible for the two of you to create an "Acoustic Materials" FAQ that has materials, specs, manufacturers, and distributors?
Disregarding for the moment Ethan's excl lent point the lack of "stickies" which I address briefly later. The nature of the insulation business and the readership here make any specifics very localized and irrelevant for most readers. Taking the second point first, the readers here are from around the world. Except for where a specific product reference is applicable, like when referring to test data for that product, the use of the generic phrases is much more helpful.
I think you will have read my reply to Dan C in "This may be useful." Dan is quite new to acoustics and somewhat overwhelmed with the information. He has read the FAQ numerous times, yet still, several of the products he asked about (and at least provided initial links to the product) were not in the range of densities that Ethan details in the FAQ!
Because of the general tone of his posts I chose to some research to help him. It turns out that RXL 40 is a product that Roxul makes for the Canadian market only. Why on earth this is, I have no idea. Alaska and the Canadian north are just as cold, Minnesota winters match Manitoba etc, both countries have similar industries etc. Digging further it turns out that Roxul has several 4 pcf type products that they sell in the States and they all have similar acoustic properties. Keeping to the national component for the moment, their product is only sold to the commercial and industrial markets, not the residential.
On an international level they have a product range designated RW xx, with xx being two numbers. Consider for a moment the terrible habit of people not using complete correct product designators. I was involved with a thread where one person referred to 603 microphones. I had to do some digging and found out that the actual designation was 603S. If the manufacturer had had several microphones from that series, as Neumann has had in their km80, 100 and 180 series, I would have been lost. My interests include the Yamaha DM2000 console. I have seen this console in posts described as DM2000, 2000, 2k, DM2k, DM2m you get the idea. This is meant as an indication of the vagueness used in the music industry for describing a product with one name. Now think of that in terms of Roxul's product names. They market in north America a RW40 which is 4 pcf. In Europe they have a RW2 where the number designates density in kg/m^3. If the Specific Roxul descriptors were used in a post for one part of the world, you can be almost 100% certain that because of that post someone will get the product series mixed up.
From what I have read on various forums, there are numerous manufacturers of insulation across the continent. I have found out just by following threads OFI and Fibrex, both of which have plants in Ontario. That is in addition to the Owens-Corning and Roxul plants I was already aware of. Because shipping insulation is mostly shipping air, it is logical that plants, and by extension the viability of various companies, is great. This makes it impractical to give information other than general guidelines on manufacturers, much less distributors. On every companies' site I have been on, I have seen links for "where to buy" or "contact us" etc.
If for whatever reason someone is posting on th web but does not have sufficient access, Ethan detailed that this not a retail product and to look under insulation in the yellow pages. If the person for whatever reason has no lick under that heading, they should be able to think "commercial product, commercial applications, hmm, heating? air conditioning? furnaces?" and make some local phone calls.
How often have you read here "I read about 703 in the FAQ but Home Depot doesn't carry it."
The problem for now is this forum's software does not support "sticky" and "announcement" posts that stay at the top. I understand there will be new forum software one of the days.
More importantly, it will help many people.
I hate to ask you to contribute more free time, but I can see a lot of reinventing the wheel as newcomers discover this forum and go through the same discovery process. It might save you time in the future.
thanks and keep up the good work,
Your Welcome
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#1647717 - 04/16/04 12:22 PM
Re: Materials FAQ?
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Ethan Winer
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 06/12/00
Posts: 5407
Loc: New Milford, CT, USA
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Andre,
Thanks. As soon as the forum software supports stickies I'll gladly add anything you care to contribute. 
--Ethan
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#1647719 - 04/16/04 03:17 PM
Re: Materials FAQ?
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Andre Vare
Senior Member
Registered: 03/13/04
Posts: 125
Loc: Hamilton, ON Canada
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Thanks Ethan. I'll digest it shortly.
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