#1645245 - 03/30/05 05:00 PM
Set order in practice...specially blues
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BluesWithoutBlame
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Registered: 11/12/04
Posts: 774
Loc: Oslo. Norway
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I got to wondering about this.
Anyone can of course answer, personally I am most interested in blues, soul, r&b groups because I think the dynamics of the style play a big part in this but...
I was wondering how you guys order your sets.
Specifically....say your absolute best, killer songs...do you save 'em up for the end, sprinkle them around in the set, use them to bolster songs that may not be up to the same level?
Do you start with a slow or fast song? Do you have any planned lulls in your set?
Bunch together dance songs, songs with more driving beats, then a lull for some slow blues, up to a climax?
Say you are doing 3 45 minute sets...how would a chart, if you made one that represented time, and excitement (or even just fast, medium, slow)
look for the three sets?
More like a mountain side peaking on the last sone, or more like a roller coaster?
It would be a help if anyone answering also included how well their sets seem to work, any stories about how one worked well, or terrible...
you know...the whole enchilada :-)
Thanks!
_________________________
==================================================== Check out my original music at http://www.soundclick.com/bands/jacker "In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but not in practice."
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#1645246 - 03/31/05 02:46 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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GZsound
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Registered: 01/17/01
Posts: 6074
Loc: Somewhere in Oregon
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Since we are a blues based band I can explain what we do.
Our sets are built on a sort of curve. Start medium, build through four or five songs, slow it down and then build back up to a strong finish.
We do an average of fifteen songs in a set and our average time between songs is 15 seconds..most of our show sets are non stop music with no breaks between songs at all.
We do a typical two set show for festivals and special events..one hour each. For clubs, we do a short thirty minute set without our lead singer, take a ten minute break and then bring her on for our two one hour show sets, and end the night with a variety set. Normal club gigs are four hours.
We strictly follow a set list until the last set at a club since everything is timed out. I usually call out the last set which is loosly based on a set list that has about twenty songs in it.
_________________________
Mark G.
"A man may fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame others" -- John Burroughs
"I consider ethics, as well as religion, as supplements to law in the government of man." -- Thomas Jefferson
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#1645247 - 03/31/05 07:55 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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cherri
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Registered: 09/10/03
Posts: 731
Loc: N. MI USA
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Usually start out with an instrumental jam / sound check. Our sets are about 10 - 12 songs long. Some sets start strong, have a couple slow songs grouped together, then finish with upbeat danceable stuff. But, sometimes we end a set with a long, slow grindage tune.
When I'm putting set lists together, I have to consider instrumentation as well as the vibe of the songs. We play in some open tunings, which we group together so we're not swapping instruments or stopping to retune after every song. I have mini sets that I use as a block of tunes - all the G songs, all the open E songs - that I keep together, again for smoothness of stage show.
Festivals, where we do one or one and a half hours, we power through all original songs. Bar gigs, with four 45 minute sets, I have more wiggle room.
As I always remind the sound tech - the set list is ONLY A GUIDELINE.
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#1645248 - 03/31/05 10:35 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Dave Martin
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Registered: 03/17/03
Posts: 959
Loc: Nashville
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When in doubt, play a shuffle...
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#1645249 - 03/31/05 10:37 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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BluesWithoutBlame
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Registered: 11/12/04
Posts: 774
Loc: Oslo. Norway
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Some really interesting replies!
Some really good information there, hoping more will be tempted to share their set theory, practice. Makes a lot of sense!
_________________________
==================================================== Check out my original music at http://www.soundclick.com/bands/jacker "In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but not in practice."
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#1645250 - 03/31/05 12:11 PM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Lee Flier
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Registered: 09/13/00
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Loc: Atlanta,GA,UNITED STATES
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For us it kind of depends on the venue, what kind of crowd it is and how many people are there at the start. If it's not a big crowd or it's more of a sit-down crowd, we'll start off with something mid-tempo and kinda build from there, then maybe slow it down in the middle and save the real barn burners for the end. If it's a rock bar and there's a lively crowd, we'll start right off with something that rocks, and get everybody's attention. Usually in that situation we'll do 3 or 4 pretty uptempo songs without stopping or any between song banter. Then we might slow it down a little or at least do some more mid tempo stuff, and build up again for the ending.
If we are doing multiple sets, we might have the really rocking stuff in the middle set and have the last one be more mellow, if it's that kind of crowd. We're always ready to change sets around on the fly though, in response to what the crowd is doing.
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#1645251 - 03/31/05 03:04 PM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Dave Martin
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Registered: 03/17/03
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Loc: Nashville
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Even though my group is a blues band, we try to have the set lean more to up tempo material rather than the typical 12/8 blues feel - partly because the singer said that a whole set of slow blues would make her want to take her own life. So a 12 song set, no more than maybe 2 or three of the tunes would be slow 12/8 blues tunes. The rest are mid-tempo to fast songs. And short, too - so many of my favorite records were released as 45's, that probably half of our songs are under 3 minutes. I dont encourage long and pointless solos...
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#1645252 - 04/02/05 06:44 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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LavaMan
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Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 234
Loc: Fayetteville, NC
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Start strong, End strong and have something good in middle like medley - keep breaks between songs as short as possbile and you can't go wrong!
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#1645253 - 04/02/05 10:23 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Dennyf
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Registered: 11/17/03
Posts: 1231
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
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Others have already made these points, but I'll reiterate 'em in terms of what we do.
Pacing: Setlists are constructed to peaks and valleys in terms of tempos and energy level. Can't just turn everything to ten and stay there all night, or OTOH risk putting people to sleep. Secondary to that, we try to evenly sprinkle the tunes that I sing throughout the night to give the lead singer a rest every now and then.
Judging the room: Although it's a common desire to come out swingin' and grab 'em by the throats (actually a little lower), if it's a slow night or a quiet place, sometimes it's better to ease 'em into it before bringin' out the big guns. Fer instance, in such cases we'll start with something like Tracy Chapman's "Gimme One Reason" or Bonnie Raitt's "Something to Talk About."
Along with room judgement comes staying flexible with your setlists, don't be too hidebound to change the order or sub in another tune to fit the room energy at the moment. IOW, if the high-energy stuff has 'em up and dancing, don't chase 'em back to their seats with a ballad just 'cuz that's next on the setlist.
Avoid dead air: This is the hazard of playing with your setlist, (and a major flaw with my band currently), but keep thinkin' ahead and avoid dead air as much as humanly possible. You give people time to take three steps back toward their table, and you've lost 'em. Try to "medley-ize" strings of tunes so their is NO gap. Yeah, I know, that kinda runs contrary to staying flexible. These are guidelines, not a rulebook.
And end each set with something as good as you got. You're only as good as your last song.
_________________________
band link: bluepearlband.com music, lessons, gig schedules at dennyf.com STURGEON'S LAW --98% of everything is bullshit. My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Jackhammer of Love and Mercy. Get yours.
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#1645254 - 04/03/05 04:01 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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BluesWithoutBlame
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Registered: 11/12/04
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Loc: Oslo. Norway
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All interesting viewpoints for tackling set lists!
I agree that you must have alternatives, gauging your set list to the audience. Must be able to adapt. I can see that there would be times when you want to start off slow, because there aren't many people there yet, and save the big numbers for the (hopefully) later hours when it is crowded.
Or at a festival with a large crowd already there, open big.
Lot's of great advice here, gives me a lot to think about.
_________________________
==================================================== Check out my original music at http://www.soundclick.com/bands/jacker "In theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but not in practice."
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#1645255 - 04/16/05 11:24 PM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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d gauss
MP Hall of Fame Member
Registered: 02/15/01
Posts: 3231
Loc: Somewhere in the Swamps of Jer...
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setlists?
we usually don't have 'em unless it's a high profile festival 1 set gig. and even then i won't write out the set for everyone 'cause if i decide to call an audible, some guys are still going by the list and it becomes a trainwreck. otherwise, i just call whatever seems appropriate at the time. we have about 200 songs to draw from so i try to keep it fresh for our own sanity.
now i often do the old b.b. king "live at the regal" trick and call each new song a key higher than the previous one until i'm back where i started. and of course the no wanking rule goes without saying 
-d. gauss
http://www.betteroffdead.com
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#1645256 - 04/17/05 12:05 AM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Strangerbytheminute
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Registered: 11/29/04
Posts: 190
Loc: Seattle
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I like fixed set lists. The setlist becomes like a big, long song in itself. I love to fine tune it. We are a blues oriented band but I'm a songwriter so I like to set not only the musical but the lyrical content of the songs to created a quality to the set we're playing. I think it cuts down on dead air between songs too....
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#1645257 - 04/18/05 03:33 PM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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Fendercaster
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Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 605
Loc: Milledgeville, Georgia USA
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I play in a couple of country/oldies/classic rock bands, and I try to have a set list for every job. We don't stick to it like glue, we get frequent requests, and try to accomodate them. We'll also juggle the set list around according to the mood of the crowd. At least by having a set list, this gives you a point of reference as to what is available to play, so you're not standing around for two minutes trying to think of a song you can do!
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#1645258 - 04/22/05 02:32 PM
Re: Set order in practice...specially blues
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SpookyKid
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Registered: 04/07/05
Posts: 150
Loc: Ft. Lauderdale
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Last year we were playing out pretty regularly with our Rock/original cover band. At the time, our list was about 40-50 songs. I think it's best to have at least 100 songs for a good cover band. This way you can change it up depending on the type of club. Is it a club that starts with a dinner crowd? Rock club? or do they just want to Dance? That's the first thing I think about.
I write the sets according to tempo, key and tuning. We followed it religiously until we realized we needed to be able to change according to the crowd. Once we did that, we found that we got more crowd participation...if they are dancing then your next song should keep them dancing. If we were out of danceable songs. We would make one up right there.
Usually, the first set is light depending again on the crowd and the second and third sets were always winners. By the fourth set the crowd thins out from the earlier break. Sometimes, we won't take a break because we don't want to loose them. It's hard especially on the singer but so worth it when they are buying CD's, T-shirts and tipping our Mohawk Planter Cow(Pretty funny).
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