* WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant!

Posted by: 02R96

* WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/22/13 02:47 PM

I just received an Email flyer for PRS Spalted Maple Private Stock guitars.

$9000.00

WTF? Who is buying these things and really, other than their appearance where is the value? Do they actually sound THAT much better than say a 2K guitar?

I think I know the answer to my own questions but this just got on my last nerve. Must be the migraine I had today... facepalm
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/22/13 03:16 PM

I have seen new guitars that cost 3 times that.

Some of it is materials. Some of it is aesthetics- usually the result of intricate and expensive hand craftsmanship. Some of it is the name on the headstock.

Some of those factors DO translate into changes- both good and bad- in the sound coming out of your amps...but a lot of it is about the guitar itself as art.
Posted by: Lokair

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/22/13 04:06 PM

Ok I hear you man , My father inlaw has a huge chunk of spalted maple from an antique table(that was ruined in the 70s) made in the late 1800s to the early 1900s that he gave me. Its so cool looking, and I could turn that into a guitar or three(and I may at one point) . But to say make it a 9k guitar it should have 4 wheels and get me to work on time. A good sized piece sell on the bay for around 250 to 500 dollars. Guitars are getting out of hand. Just my two cents worth.

Lok
Posted by: simus35

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/22/13 04:16 PM

for me 9k guitar is not better than a 1k.
is not because I will have a guitar at this price I will play better and i saw some guitar player will play with a cheap guitar and the guitar will sing like a 9k guitar
Posted by: russclan

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/22/13 05:50 PM

Originally Posted By: 02R96
I just received an Email flyer for PRS Spalted Maple Private Stock guitars.

$9000.00

WTF? Who is buying these things


People with more money than sense.

IMHO, somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500-2k is about right for a well-made quality instrument that will last a long, long time. I make it a point to avoid flashy guitars with flamed, quilted, spalted, whatever type woods. Doesn't make them sound better. Fancy inlays? You're paying for the artist's time and expertise, mostly. Not for me, thanks.

A fool and his money, soon go their separate ways...
Posted by: Fred_C

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 05:21 AM

Originally Posted By: russclan
Originally Posted By: 02R96
I just received an Email flyer for PRS Spalted Maple Private Stock guitars.

$9000.00

WTF? Who is buying these things


People with more money than sense.

IMHO, somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500-2k is about right for a well-made quality instrument that will last a long, long time. I make it a point to avoid flashy guitars with flamed, quilted, spalted, whatever type woods. Doesn't make them sound better. Fancy inlays? You're paying for the artist's time and expertise, mostly. Not for me, thanks.
A fool and his money, soon go their separate ways...


+1 on the $1500-2000 price point offering a quality instrument. IMO, for that money you can get nice flamed or quilted wood and beautiful inlay from several manufacturers. The wood on my Carvin is absolutely drop dead gorgeous as is the block abalone inlay.

With regard to the "Who buys these guitars" question, I am aware of two observations that directly address this.

1. "It's only expensive if you can't afford it."

2. "There's a sucker born every minute and two to take him".
Posted by: whitefang

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 06:40 AM

I wouldn't pay nine grand for a guitar even if it was personally autographed by every "Guitar Hero" since Duane Eddy!
Whitefang
Posted by: Fusker

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 08:55 AM

+1

At a certain point, it becomes art/status. You could make similar arguments with cars, bikes, houses, etc.

How many square feet does a family of 3 need? Of course, if you get extreme, you'll be living in a trailer...not that there is anything wrong with that!
Posted by: Larryz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 09:00 AM

-1 While watching Antiques Roadshow they have had Strats and LP's estimated at $40 grand...so if you can buy it for $9 grand and sell it for $20 grand, count me in (no matter who signs it).
Posted by: Bartholomew

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 09:07 AM

If anyone wants to give me $7,500 for my 68 tele it's gone.

Prices are ridiculous out there in eBay land - I would keep most of the $$$ and buy a roadworn.

Don't really like cookie-cutter relic finishes but for jam sessions & gigs @ $900 per unit it works for me.
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 09:33 AM

I'll be the first to admit that if I had that kind of money to blow- and I do mean blow, not just "to spend"- I'd buy something ridiculous.

For instance, I know a Somogyi starts at $20k. I'd want to experience what California Guitar Trio did when they bought matching ones...

And yes, I do have a list: Parker, Moog, Chrysalis, Crimson, Jersey Girl, Myka, Edwinson, Ryan...*

Because, to me, a guitar IS (potentially) functional art, and I love art. But most art is not for touching. Guitars are art that only comes to full glory when touched.







* and yes, I do have particular models in my crosshairs.
Posted by: Eric Iverson

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 11:20 AM

Well, other instruments can be expensive, too. Try buying a professional quality cello.... which might be a necessary professional investment for some people, if the difference in sound is really noticeable.
Posted by: Fred_C

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 11:33 AM

Originally Posted By: Dannyalcatraz

Because, to me, a guitar IS (potentially) functional art, and I love art. But most art is not for touching. Guitars are art that only comes to full glory when touched.


+1. A beautiful guitar is an auditory, tactile and visual work of art.
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 11:40 AM

Originally Posted By: Eric Iverson
Well, other instruments can be expensive, too. Try buying a professional quality cello.... which might be a necessary professional investment for some people, if the difference in sound is really noticeable.


I own one, bought for me for @ $2500 in the mid-1970s by my parents. And that would be considered an entry-level pro instrument. Sweet sound, that one.

My last cello teacher, OTOH, had a 500 year old cello that utterly put it to shame. Not only did it sound better, it projected volume MUCH better- an open C on that thing could rattle objects sitting on his piano a few feet away.
Posted by: Terrell

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 11:59 AM

I vote : Status Posers, Rich Enthusiasts and Collectors

Players buy instruments to play, drop and scratch and their status comes from the tone in their hands and the sounds they make.
Posted by: BadLife

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 02:49 PM

Ouch I am not sure I like the sound of the drop and scratch technique. None of my guitars have a scratch on them and the only one that was dropped was not dropped by me. And yes I play them all the time. I just never did buy into that idea that you should be careless with your instruments. Needless to say I don't let many others mess with my equipment. On the other had some of my favorites are not high end. i really like my Epiphone Dot which i got to see if I wanted to go for the Gibson or not. I like it and don't see the need to get the Gibson yet.
Posted by: p90jr

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 08:26 PM

My mom's cousin was a studio and touring guitarist and did some production and had a hand in some hit songs a couple of decades ago. I remember him telling me that his accountant would call him at the end of the year and tell him he needed to go buy $20,000 worth of guitars or amps or outboard gear or something "work-related" to write off and avoid handing that amount over in taxes.

I always think about that when I see these very expensive, limited edition things.

On the other hand, it's insane how little you can pay for a solid, gig-worthy guitar these days.
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/23/13 08:38 PM

The joys of accounting!
Posted by: picker

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 05:42 AM

I hate to admit it, but if I had the money, there would be a large number of high-end guitar and amp makers with my name of their personal Christmas card list...
Posted by: Winston Psmith

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 06:51 AM

I'm not a fan of Spalted Maple - just an aesthetic thing, but I don't like the look of it, at all.

Getting back to the OP, however - I think we tend to discount the real cost of finely crafted tools, including guitars, in part because we've been spoiled by the availability of inexpensive, but otherwise serviceable tools/guitars/what-have-you, like Chinese guitars. OTOH, I also think we tend to be suspicious of high-priced instruments, because we've seen so much marketing BS associated with them. Remember the $25,000 EVH Frankenstein reissues, complete with cigarette burns? I'd take the $9000 Spalted Maple over the $25,000 Frankenstein, thanks.
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 08:43 AM

A bit of perspective:

http://www.normansrareguitars.com/gibson-1960-les-paul-standard-original-hang-tags-and-case.html
Posted by: Fred_C

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 08:54 AM

One of my Jewish friends taught me a Yiddish saying,

"It's a Shanda * (a shame) not to separate a Schmuck from his money.

* I am uncertain of the correct spelling of Shanda
Posted by: Larryz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 09:06 AM



I'll pay $9,000 cash for it and pick it up in person as soon as the offer is accepted...

on second thought, make that offer $25,000... cool
Posted by: Fred_C

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 09:17 AM

Originally Posted By: Terrell
I vote : Status Posers, Rich Enthusiasts and Collectors

Players buy instruments to play, drop and scratch and their status comes from the tone in their hands and the sounds they make.



Well said, Terrell!

If I am jamming with a guy who can afford a ridiculously expensive guitar (Danny's $300,000 + LP comes to mind) but can't play worth a damn, I'm probably going to sound better than he does on my sub-$2k instruments.
Posted by: SEHpicker

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 09:26 AM

Originally Posted By: Dannyalcatraz
A bit of perspective:

http://www.normansrareguitars.com/gibson-1960-les-paul-standard-original-hang-tags-and-case.html


Wow - beautiful guitar - but it's very value makes it almost worthless for any practical purposes.
Posted by: Scott Fraser

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 10:27 AM

Originally Posted By: SEHpicker
Originally Posted By: Dannyalcatraz
A bit of perspective:

http://www.normansrareguitars.com/gibson-1960-les-paul-standard-original-hang-tags-and-case.html


Wow - beautiful guitar - but it's very value makes it almost worthless for any practical purposes.


An unplayed guitar from the 60s? I'd want to see some bulletproof authentication on that. Seems a perfect candidate for a counterfeiter.
Posted by: Minte

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 10:31 AM

It's all relative. Last Christmas my wife was hinting around for a new Louis Vuitton handbag. I did get it for her,but I still am amazed at how a simple purse maker can justify thousands of dollars for 3 pounds of leather and a small bit of gold.
Posted by: GriffinatorGlobal Moderator

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 12:14 PM

Originally Posted By: Minte
It's all relative. Last Christmas my wife was hinting around for a new Louis Vuitton handbag. I did get it for her,but I still am amazed at how a simple purse maker can justify thousands of dollars for 3 pounds of leather and a small bit of gold.


At today's gold prices, that adds quite a bit to the raw cost. grin grin grin
Posted by: skipclone 1

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/24/13 09:02 PM

I would have no interest in a $9,000 guitar, regardless of whether it`s justified and even if I could afford it.
Damage is not the issue-at that price I`d see to it that it lived an impact-free life.
The problem is, that I`d be on the hit list of every thief within the state line. I would need a sidearm. And a guard with a sidearm. Church gigs would be about the only venue I could play in-and I`d have to do a background check on the church.
Posted by: whitefang

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/25/13 06:35 AM

Another way to look at it; Back in 1968, I fell in love with a Gibson Les Paul Goldtop at Hewitt's music in Dearborn Mich. At the time, it retailed for $500.

What does it cost now? $2,000? $2500? And there are guitars out there now that retail for more, as standard issue. Not the custom, specialty instrument we're discussing here. What's the price going to be in another 46 years? Some shredder/hacker is going to be BRAGGING about the SG he picked up for ONLY $11,000! And that $9,000 thing you're griping about now will be the price of a HEART TRANSPLANT!
Whitefang
Posted by: Lokair

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/25/13 10:39 AM

Even better will be the guys who discover the low cost Squires and Epiphones in a closet or under a bed, never played 50 years from now. Someone will buy it for thousands I am sure , its 50 years old it must be good.

Lok
Posted by: CEB

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/25/13 12:25 PM

In 1968 ...
Gasoline was $0.34 per gallon
The average cost of a NEW house was $14,950.00
Average cost of a new car $2,822.00
US Hourly minimum wage $1.60 per hour

The inflation multiplier is looking pretty low on that Les Paul. grin
Posted by: Dannyalcatraz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/25/13 03:44 PM

I'll throw another at y'all:

In 1967, a 1 carat D grade flawless brilliant cut diamond was $1000.00.

1 ton of the semiprecious stone value chalcedony was $1000.00.

By the mid-1990s, that diamond was worth $16,000...and the blue chalcedony was $1,000,000.00.

Remember, kiddies, that while economics says that price is determined by the intersection of the supply curve and the demand curve, only the supply curve is determined predominantly by real world, rational, calculable factors.

Demand is determined largely by the chaos of human psychology.
Posted by: Dr. Ellwood

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/27/13 10:45 AM

Does it really matter? you either buy it or you don't, the market will tell the tale!
Posted by: p90jr

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/27/13 06:56 PM

Originally Posted By: CEB
In 1968 ...
Gasoline was $0.34 per gallon
The average cost of a NEW house was $14,950.00
Average cost of a new car $2,822.00
US Hourly minimum wage $1.60 per hour

The inflation multiplier is looking pretty low on that Les Paul. grin


yep
Posted by: skipclone 1

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/27/13 08:34 PM

Well IMO the vintage thing is a bit separate. A lot of vintage guitars are not sold by the people who made them. It`s not their work that went into it. When someone is charging a lot for something new, that was made by them or their company, there is more of a `Yeah? another guitar BFD-what`s up with that price` thing.
But having said that, one way to look at it is, that even if you have no interest in dropping that kind of cash on a guitar, there should be guitars out there like that simply by virtue of the guitar being a serious instrument- especially electrics. Whatever else the guitar is to me, it is not a toy. I am not at all impressed by people who think beating up a guitar is cool. To me it expresses where I`m at as a person. I regard anything that allows me to do that as something to be taken seriously. The music business and everything around it, that`s another matter. But someone who puts their heart and soul into their playing should be able to spend as much cash as they want and get a cost no object, ultimate axe-from someone who takes it as seriously as they do.
Posted by: harvey

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/28/13 05:52 AM



Looks like a dud if no one has wanted to play it much over the last 50 years

wink
Posted by: whitefang

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/28/13 06:59 AM

If that dude gets that price for the LP, it might cause others to start wrapping their new guitars in plastic and burying them like some did with Deloreans.
Whitefang
Posted by: Larryz

Re: * WARNING* Another Guitar Price Rant! - 01/28/13 08:47 AM

Originally Posted By: Lokair
Even better will be the guys who discover the low cost Squires and Epiphones in a closet or under a bed, never played 50 years from now. Someone will buy it for thousands I am sure , its 50 years old it must be good.

Lok


http://www.askmen.com/top_10/entertainment/top-10-legendary-guitars_4.html


Reminds me of Billy Gibbons finding his 59 Suburst LP under an old ranchers' bed story... cool