What Would it Take For You to Switch Platforms?

[Anderton]

If you're a Windows user, what would get you to switch to the Mac? And if you use Mac, what would it take for you to switch to Windows? I used to use the Mac exclusively. What got me to switch to Windows was at the time, there were no decent stereo digital audio editors for the Mac. Since then, the Mac hasn't offered enough compelling advantages for me to switch back, so most of my audio work has been done on the PC. So I was thinking what it would take for me to switch to the Mac again, and OS 10.1 looks pretty convincing. It seems Apple has put some real effort into the audio -- low latency, MIDI services, that sort of thing -- and I expect the performance with tweaked applications will be outstanding. That's something positive drawing me toward the Mac, but there's also the negative of Windows XP's copy protection. On the other hand there are no Mac programs that do digital audio, MIDI, and looping a la SONAR... So once again: If you're a Windows user, what would get you to switch to the Mac? And if you use Mac, what would it take for you to switch to Windows?

[Alndln]

OS 10.01 does look promising but like you it's the software.No Giga,no Fruity loops,no Acid ect.I was going to say Free experimental VSTi's and plugs but that's starting to even out.If MS keeps up with the spy stuff and the reregistering eveytime you change hardware(XP)I will start looking in that direction.It's a shame because for once MS comes up with an OS that's done right for a change.I'll probably switch to 2k soon and hold out until I see what happens.I have no prejiduces either way,just complaints about both(Mac/Pc).The only thing I can never get used to is the closed hardware situation on the Mac side,that would drive me nuts.

[soapbox]

[quote]Originally posted by Alndln@hotmail.com: [i]No Giga,no Fruity loops,no Acid ect.[/i][/quote] In those few areas in which the Mac platform has lagged behind, the gaps are closing fast. Steinberg's HALion, available on both Mac and PC, now offers import of Gigasampler libraries, as well as just about everything else. Gigasampler itself may become dual platform now that Tascam owns the program. Bitheadz Phraser also offers import of Acid loops. Phraser still has a bit of catching up to do with Acid itself. However, Acid's development seems to have slowed, so this should be doable in short order. Of course, programs like ProTools and Digital Performer are compelling reasons enough for me to stick with Mac. I think Apple would have to go under for me to switch.

[steven dunston]

I'm considering adding a Mac to my 3-PC studio because several of my clients do their projects exclusively in Digital Performer. It would simplify project and file transfer. But I will continue to do most of my work with SONAR, WaveLab and Gigastudio.

[alphajerk]

the apocolypse maybe. not a chance i would use a pc for my audio brain. just crashes way too much. the way the os functions is horrible. im moving way too much shit around on my mac to be bothered with regestries and such nonsense the pc hiccups over. getting ready to buy a dual800 G4 and cant fucking wait. plus, no digital performer on the pc. but for my design shit, i cant wait for that new sony where you literally draw on the screen to perfect its technology.

[Uh Clem]

I was seriously looking at Mac earlier this year after a PT Tour I went to - so impressive. The lack of commmitment from Waves adn other plug-in people for Win2K or XP version was the main reason. I'm a PC user since they came out and having worked for one of the largest ISVs in the World for severals years, I was just a little biased toward Windows. Now that I'mm a user, I almost have come to think of all that as a necessary evil needed to get a job done. Now with UAD coming out with good stuff on their card and native PC processing coming along and apps like Sonar and Nuendo really putting for a serious foot forward, I think I've managed to avoid the Mac/PT thing and so far I have no issues with needing to impress anyone with PT that I work with. There's just too much of a user base in Windows and money to be made for good Audio ISVs to ignore it and over time, there'll be no need at all to do Mac. Maybe even MOTU will fully join the party. Windows XP will help alot with one OS architecture and driver model for ISVs to write for and there will be less and less Win9x/ME/2K specific stuff that only runs well on one of those versions. That and the added stability of the NT kernel going mainstream will solve a lot of issues Window has today. My current PC I was able to build and save $$$ too and now I'm in the position to upgrade as I need to for small incremental $$$. That and the $30K hit for an equivalent PT system will probably keep me on Windows. What would it take for me to change to Mac or anything else - superior hardware and software at a competive price. If PT would not have been so damned expensive, I'd probably have done it this summer - but the window(no pun intended) for that has closed for the moment. There's no way I want to tinker with OSX, for example, out of curiosity or for fun - don't really want to do that with XP, but I need some of the new features, so I will.

[dansouth]

I like Windows for some things, although I've been 100% on Mac for the last six months. If Apple went under, I would look for some sort of Be or Linux solution, first. Windows for audio would be my last choice. I used a Win 95 laptop as my mobile computer for the last three years - prior to buying a Ti G4 - and tried and tried to get music programs to run on it. What a miserable hassle! My stomach hurts just thinking about all the time and money I've wasted.

[Uh Clem]

Oh yes, if someones hands me a loaded up PT system, then I'll switch.

[steven dunston]

Alphajerk wrote: >not a chance i would use a pc for my audio brain. just crashes way too >much. I built my audio PC for $700. I can run 80 stereo 24-bit tracks, several soft synths, and a bushel-full of plugins and it doesn't crash any more. It took a while to get it configured, but you don't have to do that yourself. Several companies are building turn-key PC systems for studios. By the way, the last two times I was in a studio to record on a Mac, we had to reschedule the session because the computer crashed.

[Master Zap]

For me to Switch to mac? All that would really be needed is that it ran all the software I already have..... but thats a LOT of junk.... Any Mac SONAR? /Z

[fuzz]

a brand new os written just for audio that ran on any machine.... or if i get this gig doing sound design for an hbo pilot...then i might have to get a mac again cuz i am sure that slowtools is the software of choice [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif[/img] but for now my homemade pc rocks....and my mac sits in the basement. [b]~°¤o§þÅ¢£ ߪ$§o¤°~[/b]

[D. Gauss]

<> an announcement on the PA system that my Amtrack train is now coming in on a different track than originally posted... -d. gauss

[davemc]

Well I switched from PC TDM to mac as there were and still are not many plugins around. I wanted McDsp, DUY, full version of channelstrip etc. I look at it as a box is a box, my mac probably crashes more than my PC did. If you do not load junk on a PC and use it for audio only they are fine. I agree 2 track editors are pretty bad on a mac I tried Spark and Peak and they both crash with a lot of vst plugins, still cannot find one that works with FreeFilter. I could get Logic/Cubase for this although they are not as good 2 track editor as PT, although I miss my VST plugins for mastering. just my 2 cents. (under 1 cent in Austrlian cents) ------------------ Bye Dave www.indentmusic.com.au

[Philip OKeefe]

[quote]Originally posted by stevepow: [b]Oh yes, if someones hands me a loaded up PT system, then I'll switch.[/b][/quote] Ditto that! [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Actually, I have both types of machines, but my Mac is so old that it's not even in use right now (Old Power PC 6115). I love the Mac OS, and things tend to run more reliably on it, but the PC hardware is significantly less expensive, and there's lots of PC only software that I'd really miss if I went to a Mac and only a Mac, such as Sound Forge, Vegas, Acid, Sonar, etc. On a related note, I'd probably switch to PT, which to me means Macintosh, but there's two gripes I have. 1) I've spent way too much $$ on DX plug ins and they are not supported in PT, and not all of them have comperable RTAS or TDM equivalents. And the ones that DO will cost a small fortune to crossgrade. 2) I can't really understand why Digi won't offer a TRUE native version of PT. With CPU's getting faster and faster all the time, and many great audio interfaces available (I love my Frontier cards) it seems like they're burying their heads in the sand regarding the way things are going. 3) (bonus gripe) I am a little disappointed re: Digi's decision to pull out of the AES show (even though I am not going, and had planned on not going even before 9/11/01) and the way they handled the announcement. So for now I'll be sticking with my PC setup, and cursing Bill Gates as the antichrist several times per day. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gif[/img] (Nah, I don't [b]really[/b] think he's the antichrist, but I hate the versions of Windoze I've been running - 98se and ME). I sure hope that Win XP is better... but I hate the draconian registration / authorization and privacy issues it is going to come along with. Too bad there isn't a great cross platform OS that works great on all machines, uses little in terms of the host's resources, runs fast and reliably, and supported all the "legacy" software from both the Mac and PC. And everything worked on it - everything. Without crashes or conflicts. Toss in zero latency THRU the software. Hey, I can dream, right? Phil O'Keefe Sound Sanctuary Recording Riverside CA http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html pokeefe777@msn.com

[aeon]

For me to switch from Macintosh to PC, I would require:

[*]ProTools TDM on PC with the 3rd-party support and stability of the Mac implementation. [*]MOTU Digital Performer on PC. [*]Cycling ’74 MAX and MSP on PC. [*]Prosoniq sonicWORX Studio 2 on PC. [*]Korg SynthKit on PC. [*]Some way to put my Lexicon NuVerb into a PC and have Lexicon NuVerb software ported to the PC. [*]Ports of all the little-known but too-cool Mac audio apps like SoundHack, Argeïphontes Lyre and SuperCollider. [*]The appearance of certain high-quality audio tools and plug-ins that currently do not exist on the PC that I cannot imagine working without...this means Metric Halo Labs ChannelStrip and SpectraFoo, McDSP CompressorBank and Filterbank, BombFactory native, etc. [*]Adobe After Effects on PC with the 3rd-party support of the Mac implementation. [*]Artwork Systems ArtPro on PC. [*]An integral, system-wide color management implementation. [*]The same degree of rich, standardized typographic support I get on the Mac in terms of glyph editing, application tie-in, typeface vendors and designer user community. [*]The equivalent of VirtualPC for the PC, i.e., VirtualMac...because there is green grass on both sides. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] [*]The removal of challenge-response copy protection from the current version of Windows.

[soapbox]

I think another factor for many of us is what choices other members of our community have made. Choosing a PC in my environment would be like choosing a Mac in a corporate setting filled with PCs, and that means swimming against the current. Obviously, there are a lot of people using PCs to make music with. I just don't know any of them (except through this site). In my world, the reality of the rest of the world is flipped: 95% Macintosh, 5% PC. Those who use PCs in my world do not use them for making music. In this setting, I have confidence that, using my Mac, I will be able to easily exchange files with anyone I know. For someone else, surrounded by PC users, I imagine life would be easier with a PC as well. This message has been edited by soapbox on 10-06-2001 at 04:54 AM

[videoeditor1]

I don't use computers in the creative process of music making. Nor recording. But I do use computers to control other devices (HDR for example). I anticipate in coming months I'll be adding software (or machines with the appropriate software) to my arsenal. For now, I'm watching the developments with Apple's 10.1 ver to see how it pans out. Like most others, I see a distinct benefit in having both Mac's & PC's in my environment. NYC Drew

[Deathtoallwhoopposeme]

I use PC and MAC...Mac for the serious digital audio ala Pro Tools and video/DVD stuff, and PC for Giga, Acid, and other apps...It's the best of both worlds but the elegance and ease of operation that a Mac Affords will always keep it my Main audio/video. Mac is WAY ahead in catering to the thinking of Creative professionals. Pc does have it's place but it takes more effort to get it to work as smoothly as a MAC...I'm speaking of years experience on both...My opionions..Thanks

[offramp]

For me to switch? Bill Gates to be visited by the ghost of GUI's past and have a sudden change of heart about how he runs his chunk of the software pie. PC's to develop 'personalities'. For some reason, I can't get around the idea that every Mac I've had or worked with has a noticeable personality. More seriously, it would take either a) me being able to figure out how to rewire my brain so that the PC made sense, or b) the PC being as easy to setup, operate, and modify as a Mac. As for the lists of programs that people say are only available on PC that they couldn't see being without: Just how many programs DO we really need? Call me disgustingly old-school, but last I remember, in order to make recorded music, you need a multitrack program, editing functions, a mastering program, and a way to make a CD from it (read: console, Studer, razor-blades, 2-track). I'm sure they're neat, all these Fruity Loops and such, but I tend to want to focus on the music being made, and not how many windows I can get open and crammed into my screen. So, to that end, everything that's available to do what I want is available on the Mac, the Mac is easy (and fun) to use, and I'm set. After that, nice digs and a stunning administrative assistant. There would have to be a celestial shift of magnaimous proportions in order for me to switch. That, and a patient teacher.

[strat0124]

Money...... : )

[lovesinger]

[quote]Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com: [b]I used a Win 95 laptop as my mobile computer for the last three years - prior to buying a Ti G4 - and tried and tried to get music programs to run on it. What a miserable hassle! My stomach hurts just thinking about all the time and money I've wasted.[/b][/quote] This, many other posts, and my experiences have made me seriously consider a MAC laptop for my needs. Seems it all comes down to how you work, in one sense. If I [b][i]always[/i][/b] only did a track at a time with no pressing deadlines, either may do. For one thing, "time is progress" (and/or money, in a client/me and how-much-i-end-up-making-per-hour context). Both can do great stuff, but if I have to reboot, recover (unfinished work in progress at crash time), maybe redo from scratch fifty times more with one (probably Win) than the other, it's a no-brainer. All that's needed is filtering out each platform's loyalists' partisan praises that under-report problems and finding out what the [i]real[/i] record is. From all I've seen, MAC has the stability. Maybe the reason I've never owned one is I trust [b]neither[/b] for pure tracking [though I'm about to test that - with tape backup - after great responses to my "DAWS that never crash" thread recently] and a PC has been always cheaply available for trying out & editing with the many PC-based apps. I've always felt that artist-clients don't want to hear my "I'm sorry"'s for glitches and crashes. I'd keep a PC for the plethora of graphics and other apps Macs don't have, but my eyes have seen the glory of a Mac for music use.

[lovesinger]

Of course fully learning Linux (with its reported its low overhead stability and rather simply configurable multiple sound card support) might make me ditch BOTH [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

[lovesinger]

Another thought: if (it would take a miracle) MS REALLY got its act together and unbloated Windows, deleting all the control-freak .dll's and other proprietary-kingdom-keeping non-necessary elements, i might stay a PC-guy another 20 years. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

[Hippie]

It would take a lottery winning for me to switch from PC to Mac. I have a sizable investment in PC (Microsoft) based audio/MIDI software, DX plugs, etc. And, I finally have the OS/audio,MIDI/interfaces all playing nice together,(well, as good as to be expected). I'm gonna leave well enough alone, for now. (Win98SE, Cakewalk 9.03, MOTU 2408) My next upgrade will probably be Sonar 2, or Cakewalk PA-11, or whatever the hell they are going to name it. -Matt

[seclusion]

Even though I sorta knew windoze was finiky bout audio apps way back in 92' when I started this madness, I still went with it cause as every musician in the world, the Mac was too much $$$$$$$.. But now that things seem to be as equal in the Os's as far as I'm concered still it's cheeper to get a PC.. Sorry Mac but PC is just too accesible as far parts etc.. I'd never go with a Mac.. Now with gigastudio exclusively on PC, I bet alot of Mac guys are gonna come onboard to PC.. Welcome aboard guys.. Brian

[soapbox]

[quote]Originally posted by seclusion: [i]Now with gigastudio exclusively on PC, I bet alot of Mac guys are gonna come onboard to PC..[/i][/quote] If we were going to do that, we would have done it years ago when Gigasampler came out. Now with HALion (and others to come) as a viable Mac platform Giga substitute, I doubt many will switch. Mac users generally are an exceptionally loyal group of people! Some would call us fanatics!

[Beagle1]

#1-Investment in current software, #2-Cost of hardware. I would expect these are the two most important factors for people deciding whether to switch platforms. I use Logic Audio on the Mac, and even though Emagic has a Windows version of Logic, their development on the Mac side has always been superior. If Emagic shifted their emphasis to the Windows version of Logic then I would seriously consider switching platforms. But as it is, they have Logic 5 for OS X scheduled for release on Jan 7 (MacWorld SF 2002) and it should be awesome. They had previously set the release date for Sept/Oct this year but pushed it back so that they could really get things right. And yes, Apple’s hardware is expensive! It galls me that I just spent over $2500 on a Dual 800 G4 that in 3 years may not be much more than a doorstop (especially with MP G5's around the corner). I’m sure for about half of that I could have gotten a custom PC which offers equivalent or better performance and then spent the rest on something that holds its value better (e.g. mics, preamps, guitars, etc). But for me, the superior plug and play on the Mac is worth the extra $$$. I know that once you get a Windows machine configured properly for audio it can be very stable, but I don't feel like wasting my time messing with IRQ settings and registry edits. Most stuff on the Mac just plain *works* with little or no configuration. From what I've seen so far of OS X v10.1, plug and play is better than it ever has been on the Mac. I've been using 10.1 on a seperate partition of my Powerbook G4 for the past week and it is everything Apple promised it would be: fewer bugs, better peripheral support, and performance that exceeds MacOS 9.x. I'm finding more and more that I hate having to boot into 9 for some things--when Logic 5 comes out there will be no going back. I know many people look at OS X and think it is mainly a lot of 'eye-candy,' but underneath the fancy GUI there is so much cool stuff built in as standard: Apache web server, Perl scripting, multi-processor support, full Java support, core audio and MIDI services, SMB support (access files on Windows machines), and the list goes on. Even better is no stupid product activation/registration. Give OS X a try--you will be impressed!

[Froggytwanger]

[quote]Originally posted by Anderton: [b]If you're a Windows user, what would get you to switch to the Mac? And if you use Mac, what would it take for you to switch to Windows? I used to use the Mac exclusively. What got me to switch to Windows was at the time, there were no decent stereo digital audio editors for the Mac. Since then, the Mac hasn't offered enough compelling advantages for me to switch back, so most of my audio work has been done on the PC. So I was thinking what it would take for me to switch to the Mac again, and OS 10.1 looks pretty convincing. It seems Apple has put some real effort into the audio -- low latency, MIDI services, that sort of thing -- and I expect the performance with tweaked applications will be outstanding. That's something positive drawing me toward the Mac, but there's also the negative of Windows XP's copy protection. On the other hand there are no Mac programs that do digital audio, MIDI, and looping a la SONAR... So once again: If you're a Windows user, what would get you to switch to the Mac? And if you use Mac, what would it take for you to switch to Windows?[/b][/quote] I really can't say on this one because I have both and I also have a Tascam D- 38 1 in. format, a 3-M like the Beatle's used with 2 in. format, Now if there was a way to put them all together ? Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmm The Frog

[spokenward]

[quote]Originally posted by NYC Drew: [b]I don't use computers in the creative process of music making. Nor recording. But I do use computers to control other devices (HDR for example).[/b][/quote] I think that Drew's post suggests another way to consider the platform question. In other areas of computing we manage to use networked machines to perform complex tasks. With audio and other time-based media we haven't really developed a way to accommodate these processes. And yet many of us have gone through the same platform bounces that Craig described. (I migrated from SDII to Sound Forge.) now, with a unix core underneath OSX, and gigabit ethernet and FireWire -why do we have to stick with the same model of having one powerful machine and our few chosen favorite applications? I want to have the benefits of the stuff that runs, or runs better, on PCs [b]and[/b] the stuff that works on Macs. I would like to see a Mac controlling a modest network of something like Gigasampler or Halion and VSTi's and all the attendant instruments, studio devices and storage media. Somehow MIDI worked by building a lightweight networking scheme. Part of the appeal of MIDI was to compensate for instruments and devices that didn't have enough voices or effects to build a studio around. Do you think that anybody is considering this approach? (and why aren't they?)

[PlugHead]

For me to switch - you'd have to hold a gun to my head! Of coure I am a loyal Mac user - have been since starting on a computer just 4 years ago. I like a computer that starts up out of the box, the company makes it complete from A to Z: hardware, software, OS - now that's a turnkey system - only apple makes A to Z. Sure you can get a preconfig turnkey PC music system, but as you add pgms, software, you can spend more time trying to get it to work than you do on your music (read: business!), which is the reason for my computer in the first place. Until Gates, and his evil empire cease to monopolize the OS for PC's, I will not move to a PC, tho cheap seems nice, sometimes spending a bit more has it's advantages, KIA vs. Porsche in my mind. Besides, when I bring my projects to other studios to continue production, I universally see only one player in the major production facilities - hint; it isn't a PC. my .02 cents Jay