Music Player Network
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
trouble with the beatles!
#511964 04/10/04 02:54 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
D
Delroy Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
D
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
im not sure if this is the right place to post this but it seemed the most appropriate.

hi, my name is Fabio, im 19 and studying a BTEC in music technology.

im currently doing an album analysis of SGT.Peppers.

everything is going well excelt i have been looking for the last week for an equipment list of what George Martin used and i cant find anything. i got some good suggestions from the sound on sound forums but i dont have any money to buy books so really it has got to be all net based.

i know this is asking abit much but im really in a jam and i have to hand this assignment in in 2 weeks.

if anybody could help a muso student bum, i would be most appreciative \:\) \:\)

thanks alot
Fabio

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511965 04/10/04 03:11 PM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 107
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 107
This studio: http://www.toeragstudios.com/cover.html is not a million miles away from what Abbey Rd had in the '60s.

I believe Abbey Rd even have a "museum" studio with AC30s etc identical to the set-up the Beatles used, check their website: http://www.abbeyroad.co.uk/ click on the history link. I may be imagining the "museum" studio, I know there was one at some point, not sure if it's still there, I think it was a mock-up of what they had.

Beatles used: Telefunken V76M preamps into EMI REDD consoles (same as Toerag). They also managed to sync Studer 4-tracks together to get upwards of 8 tracks. Abbey Rd also had custom-built echo chambers, which I believe still exist today.

My brain is a bit foggy today, if I think of anything else Ill post it here.

An idea would be to try the search function at this forum with the word Motown. Some of the Motown engineers visited Abbey Rd in the 60s and you often read references to A.Rs techniques in interviews with them, although Motown used different hardware. Also check out any Motown-related interviews on the web.

Cheers,
Justin

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511966 04/10/04 03:39 PM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 107
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 107
Some more info:

Small piece of info here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/features/vinyl/19601969.shtml

Some history here, particularly relating to the fact that the TG solid-state mixers were not used by the Beatles until later LPs:

http://www.tgmixers.co.uk/Frames/frameset.html

J

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511967 04/10/04 04:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
D
Delroy Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
D
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
wow!!!!

thanks a bunch man thats exactly what i needed.

ive been arsing about the house tryin to do do this damn assignment for days now but that was the key ingredient i needed.

thnaks alot man!

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511968 04/12/04 10:30 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 336
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 336
The V72S (the "S" version made for EMI, having 40dB gain instead of 34) amps were used on the first couple of LPs (REDD-37 desk). After that (late '63 or early'64) the REDD 51, which used EMI's own REDD-47 tube amps, was installed in studio two. A REDD-37 remained in studio three.

REDD = Record Engineering Development Department.

The transistorized TG desk (with comp/limiters on each channel) was used for "Abbey Road", and the mixing of "let It Be". I believe those two albums were recorded on a 3M 1" 8 track, though "Come Together" started on a tube 4 track and was later transfered to the 8. The TG was also used for the more recent Anthology re-mixes.

Here's a shot of the 51 desk, with Altec comps in the background. Don't they all look pleased as Punch....


Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511969 04/12/04 05:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
Quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

You can tell they are THRILLED to be using such great gear!


A WOP BOP A LU BOP, A LOP BAM BOOM!

"There is nothing I regret so much as my good behavior. What demon possessed me that I behaved so well?" -Henry David Thoreau
Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511970 04/12/04 07:18 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,689
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,689
well, yoko is in the room..

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511971 04/12/04 08:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
Quote:
Originally posted by halljams:
well, yoko is in the room..
yeah, it does seem like John is trying his best to make a day of it...


A WOP BOP A LU BOP, A LOP BAM BOOM!

"There is nothing I regret so much as my good behavior. What demon possessed me that I behaved so well?" -Henry David Thoreau
Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511972 04/12/04 09:11 PM
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27
Hi Fabio,

I actually wrote a similar paper last year. It was a comparitive analysis of Sgt. Pepper's and Pet Sounds. You can check it out at my website (http://www.reubenghose.com). It's in the "papers" section. Hopefully, you can find some useful information there. Also, check out the bibliography . . .there are some net sources there. Even though you can't afford books (I know . . . I'm a student too), you should check out your school or public libraries. I was able to find a lot of information there.

Also, go the http://www.theprojectstudiohandbook.com. In the "Mix Files" section, you'll find interview's with Geoff Emerick and George Martin.

Hope this helps,
Reuben

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511973 04/12/04 09:21 PM
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27
Sorry, I forgot to mention that the paper is about the technology used on the two albums and it's influence. That's why I think it would be useful to you.

Reuben

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511974 04/12/04 09:38 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
10k Club
Offline
10k Club
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
Mics were usually Neumann U47's, U48's and KM56's, with AKG D19's and Coles 4038's on drums. Altec and Fairchild limiters were commonly used. I believe the 4 track machines were Studer J-37's. Reverb was normally via the chambers at Abbey road - no digital boxes back then. Tape echo was used quite a bit though, as was ADT and flanging - both also done with tape decks.

By American standards, the gear in use in England throughout the 1960's was a little behind the times, and compared to what we have available today... ;\) but that didn't stop them from making some incredible records.

Best of luck with your paper.

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511975 04/20/04 09:34 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
D
Delroy Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
D
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3
just to say thanks to everyone who posted..

you guys really got me out of a tight spot!
i went to a few bookshops and i couldnt find anything at all that was relevant which i was personally really shocked by.

anyway im just adding the finishing touches to the project now so yeah.....thanks a bunch.
ill be sure to start coming back to this forum in the future cos tbh i had no idea where i was when i arrived i just posted.

u guys are so much more helpful than sound on soundi really didnt get anything particularly concrete off them.

take it easy lads speak to yall soon!

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511976 04/20/04 10:16 PM
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 14,459
10k Club
Offline
10k Club
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 14,459
Delroy, good luck on your project!

It would be intresting to read it when you're finished.



What do we want? Procrastination!
When do we want it? Later!
Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511977 04/20/04 10:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
10k Club
Offline
10k Club
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
Ditto that - please let us know when it's done, and consider sharing it so we can check it out. \:\)

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511978 04/20/04 11:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 155
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 155
Quote:
Originally posted by Ted Nightshade:
Quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

You can tell they are THRILLED to be using such great gear!
More like a drug induced coma

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511979 04/20/04 11:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
10k Club
Offline
10k Club
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 17,677
John, how many time do I have to ask you to GET YOUR FEET OFF OF THE BOARD!?! ;\) \:D

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511980 04/21/04 07:08 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 55
A
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
A
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 55
Quote:
Originally posted by woodlakesound:
Quote:
Originally posted by Ted Nightshade:
Quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

You can tell they are THRILLED to be using such great gear!
More like a drug induced coma
John was into heavy drugs at that time: heroin and Yoko...


andre t
Producer/Engineer
Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511981 04/21/04 09:58 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 336
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 336
Quote:
Originally posted by andre t:
Quote:
Originally posted by woodlakesound:
Quote:
Originally posted by Ted Nightshade:
quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

You can tell they are THRILLED to be using such great gear!
More like a drug induced coma
John was into heavy drugs at that time: heroin and Yoko...
And Paul was thinking about his solo album.

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511982 04/21/04 12:39 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 96
N
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
N
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 96
Quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

I mean, God bless Yoko and all that, but man, what an obvious buzzkill.

Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511983 04/21/04 06:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,649
Quote:
Originally posted by natpub:
Quote:
Originally posted by Bryson:
Don't they all look pleased as Punch....

I mean, God bless Yoko and all that, but man, what an obvious buzzkill.
To be fair, the screwed up business dealings and contractual mess killed the buzz for good... that's what really brought these guys down and broke up the band.


A WOP BOP A LU BOP, A LOP BAM BOOM!

"There is nothing I regret so much as my good behavior. What demon possessed me that I behaved so well?" -Henry David Thoreau
Re: trouble with the beatles!
#511984 04/22/04 03:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,231
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,231
don't listen to the myths posted above. the truth is, george martin and abbey road gear had NOTHING to do with sgt. pepper.

in reality, sgt. pepper was secretly recorded onto a 100 track digital recorder made out of spare TV and electric shaver parts by the beatles' electronics guru, "magic" alex mardas.

the beatles then spent the better part of a year with alex's "audio microscope and decorder ring" which allowed them to align each drum beat in exact time, and to perfectly tune each vocal note to pitch. (this device would subsequently be used with great success on yoko ono's solo recordings)

finally, "magic" alex employed his greatest invention, the "super distorto 2x4 dynamic disabler" for the mastering of the final mixes, and "bam", an audio classic was born.

and that folks, is how it really happened. \:\)

-d. gauss

Re: trouble with the beatles!
Delroy #3025918 01/26/20 08:40 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Offline
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
Wonder what direction this thread would have taken if the folks who originally posted had been able to hear the 5.1 mix with the original source track that came out a few years back.

Surprisingly, the mono mixes from that set really knock me out.

dB

Re: trouble with the beatles!
Dave Bryce #3025943 01/26/20 11:09 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 116
G
gd1 Offline
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
G
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 116
Originally Posted by Dave Bryce
Wonder what direction this thread would have taken if the folks who originally posted had been able to hear the 5.1 mix with the original source track that came out a few years back.

Surprisingly, the mono mixes from that set really knock me out.

dB


or if they had of had access to Brian Kehew’s Recording the Beatles - great resource that came out a few yrs after the op’s request.

Last edited by gd1; 01/26/20 11:10 PM.
Re: trouble with the beatles!
gd1 #3025945 01/26/20 11:29 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Offline
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
Originally Posted by gd1
or if they had of had access to Brian Kehew’s Recording the Beatles - great resource that came out a few yrs after the op’s request.

No doubt!

dB



Re: trouble with the beatles!
Dave Bryce #3026045 01/27/20 07:09 AM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 683
Likes: 42
Gold Member
Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 683
Likes: 42
Originally Posted by Dave Bryce
Surprisingly, the mono mixes from that set really knock me out.

dB

What's the surprise in that? For the vast majority (if not ALL) of the Beatles' career, stereo was an afterthought and could actually be quite jarring depending on which instruments got stuffed into which speaker.

Listening to the Beatles in mono is always (or nearly always) how the music was intended to be heard; I know that some folks go on at length about some of the stereo releases that were quite good, and I won't argue with them (hell, I'm one of those guys who considers the US release of Rubber Soul to be far superior as an album to the UK version), but to me, these records were meant for mono. I need to see if I can find the all-mono box set that came out some years back.

mike


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: trouble with the beatles!
Delroy #3026062 01/27/20 08:37 AM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Offline
4x KCFFL Champ
20k Club
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 21,494
Likes: 221
It’s surprising to me simply because after hearing the 5.1 mixes, I didn’t expect to be blown away by the separation and definition of the mixes in mono...but I was. Even more amazing to hear it done with the original non-bounced source tracks.

dB


Moderated by  gm 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4