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#33738 02/21/02 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Stanley wrote:
I do love Bill Evans and have recorded much acoustic piano in his style..


Any of these recordings on the web?

Sound, Studio, and Stage Island
#33739 02/21/02 02:36 PM
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"John Coltrane licks, so can I, So What!"

........Uh......huh!

.....not to be mean.............

.....Nobody can or ever will be able to play like Trane.

John Coltrane is to Tenor Saxophone What Jimi is to Guitar

Jazz is American Classical music........Period!


Cheers,

La Vida Musica
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#33740 02/21/02 03:48 PM
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I was sent a link to this page and it seemed to fit into the forum as an historic perspective. Who says there's no class in the sticks?

Hoosier Hot Shots Listening Room

Maybe some of the "senior" members of this forum will get a kick out of this stuff. I did !

Anybody want to talk about advances in recording technology?


=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

ME: "Nobody knows the troubles I've seen!"

Unknown Voice: "The Shadow do!"
#33741 02/21/02 03:54 PM
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To Iross
check out several versions of" hope for peace pieces"..they are pretty much in that Bill Evans style..also maybe jazz piano nocturne..all on that mp3.com/Stanley_Sagov
web page..Also liked your ist reggae piece..and have one I did with my sister in London on the web page called Margo's ragga mix or MARG,Marco,roots rock reggae..will listen to more of your music soon....

#33742 02/21/02 10:55 PM
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Huge Jazz fan here. Everything from Bop to Fusion. Miles, Trane, Rollins, Mingus, Dolphy, Monk, McLaughlin, Coryell, Ernie Ranglin, Monty Alexander, Pastorius, Corea, Clarke... I could go on for days. Me and a buddy of mine have been improvising together for years. (Guitar & Bass) Have some stuff on mp3.com if anybody's interested...

http://www.mp3.com/TheSolarChurch

#33743 02/21/02 11:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chip McDonald:
I've got a mix cd that has the following on it:

Jeff Beck's "Cause We've Ended as Lovers"
Pink Floyd/Gilmour's "Marooned"
Holdsworth's "Home"
Vangelis' "Memories of Green"

... and Coltrane's "Naima". Fits perfectly IMO. Music is music, not genres.
That sounds like a cool mix CD. I remember when FM radio stations took chances and this could have been a set list on some of the more progressive stations.

Ah well... You must appreciate the genre and the talent(s) within the genres. That Vai is not Holdsworth is not Van Halen is not Stevie Ray Vaughn is not Hendrix comment kinda says it all IMHO.

RobT


RobT

Famous Musical Quotes: "I would rather play Chiquita Banana and have my swimming pool than play Bach and starve" - Xavier Cugat
#33744 02/21/02 11:16 PM
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Stanley,

I just checked out the "Hope for Peace Pieces" and also "What Is This Thing Called Bebop". This is more along my taste in jazz. I love Bill Evans, Bud Powell, Oscar Peterson, and people like that. Monk is probably as far 'outside' as I want to go. I know I'm old fashioned but I just can't help it, although Benny Green is a great young player I'm into these days.

Anyway I still have a problem with the programmed drums. Have dealt with sequencing so I know how much work you must have put into it but for me it's just not the thing for jazz. Ever now and then I hear a very slight groove but nowhere near the real thing. I'm very spoiled when it comes to drummers. Even with a live drummer if he's not right on it kills the whole thing for me. Hard to relax and play my horn when the drummer is even a slight bit off. The bass might be missing a bit or even the piano but if the drummer is swinging I can still make it. :0) That's just me. Got to go now but will get back to your stuff soon.

#33745 02/21/02 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by junior4242:
Huge Jazz fan here. Everything from Bop to Fusion. Miles, Trane, Rollins, Mingus, Dolphy, Monk, McLaughlin, Coryell, Ernie Ranglin, Monty Alexander, Pastorius, Corea, Clarke... I could go on for days. Me and a buddy of mine have been improvising together for years. (Guitar & Bass) Have some stuff on mp3.com if anybody's interested...

http://www.mp3.com/TheSolarChurch
I listened to the first tune on your page...the bass and guitar are nice. I enjoyed it...my only criticism is that you seem to rush at times, but I really can't complain because I have the same problem sometimes. \:\)

Nice choice of notes on the bass solos.

#33746 02/22/02 12:01 AM
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Hi Henry,
Can't find your e-mail in your profile, I am very interested in buying some of your work(CDs) can you e-mail me? My e-mail is in my profile, thanks! \:\)

#33747 02/22/02 04:37 AM
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
riginally posted by junior4242:
Huge Jazz fan here. Everything from Bop to Fusion. Miles, Trane, Rollins, Mingus, Dolphy, Monk, McLaughlin, Coryell, Ernie Ranglin, Monty Alexander, Pastorius, Corea, Clarke... I could go on for days. Me and a buddy of mine have been improvising together for years. (Guitar & Bass) Have some stuff on mp3.com if anybody's interested...
http://www.mp3.com/TheSolarChurch
-----------------------

Am enjoying your music... particularly urban legend,and still groovin.. it is sincere and has a lovely feel,,, thanks for loving Jazz and putting your music out for us...

#33748 02/22/02 04:59 AM
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Unfortunately I'm not going to be able to mix the tunes I wanted to post here until next week.

These aren't really Jazz though they're more Jazz than Rock, the jamfree stuff is all completely improvised with no pre-conceived ideas:

"Sample from Tommy's B-Day Jam"
"Rhodes and Drums Duet"

http://www.artistlaunch.com/jamfree

Or some other Jazzy stuff:

"Notes" (jazz fusion)
"Beauty" (mostly sequenced...drums are real, I was 16)

http://www.artistlaunch.com/sleblanc

Or you could just ignore this spam of my music:)

#33749 02/22/02 05:06 AM
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QUOTE] [/QUOTE] [/I] [I]Anyway I still have a problem with the programed drums. Have dealt with sequencing so I know how much work you must have put into it but for me it's just not the thing
mp3.com/Stanley_Sagov

So here is one done with "real bass and drums.. maybe a bit too "out" for your taste but see what you think.
Thanks for the honest response...

The secrets of Swing_copy" General Jazz
Lo Fi Play (dial-up)
Hi Fi Play (broadband)
Download (2.7 MB)
WinRip Enhanced
Download - What's This?
Add to My.MP3
Email Track to a Friend
1-Click Sync™ to all my PCs

another collaboration with John VoiGt & Lawrence Cook (bass and drums) with Stanley Sagov playing keyboard ..actually a WD Coakley Fazioli Piano Sample...A wild and crazy "Virtuosic" jazz rhythms demo!!!i

MP3.com CD Blues Fragmento - Buy it!

Credits SAGOV,VOIGT,COOK

Story Behind the Song
Another interaction through Jon's innovative free play-along free Jazz CD..his e mail is lohnvoigt@medione.net

More Free Music by this Artist
[

#33750 02/22/02 05:22 AM
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Unfortunately I'm not going to be able to mix the tunes I wanted to post here until next week.
These aren't really Jazz though they're more Jazz than Rock, the jamfree stuff is all completely improvised with no pre-conceived ideas:

I have enjoyed some of these before

some spam is good for us \:D
looking forward to next week's mixes

#33751 02/22/02 05:31 AM
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Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com
Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/

/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien
#33752 02/22/02 06:04 AM
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What I'm sayng is that it's moot. Sorry if I mis-represented what you said. I pulled what you said and Steve into one. I didn't mean to. But the "up yers" comment I don't have the time for and I think is uncalled for. I try to respect people. I'm not calling in to question your ability to apply or descern differences and if you read that I'm sorry. What I'm saying is that "music is music" is obvious. I agree with this. What does that observation leave me with? In a practical sense I have to know how to play these various musics. Because learning harmony, scales, modes, arpeggios and reading don't teach me that. If I'm playing reggae I have to know that generally the backbeat is on three and 9 times out of 10 the guitar plays this. If I'm playing polka music the guitar plays this. Music is music but there's a world of difference between Chopin, Webern, Buck Owens, Leadbelly, Louis Armstrong, Janet Jackson, George Gershwin or Snoop Dog. I'm not saying one is better than the other. I have my preferences. Music is Music and I love all music too. There are some musics that strike me more profoundly and require a lot more work, attention and devotion to detail. I'm talking me, no one else.

Listen I understand your point only too well. I was 5 years tied to a record label who could only view the category they WANTED me to fill. I didn't fill it and I refused because I was defining my own category.


All the best,

Henry Robinett
#33753 02/22/02 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sagov@bellatlantic.net:
Am enjoying your music... particularly urban legend,and still groovin.. it is sincere and has a lovely feel,,, thanks for loving Jazz and putting your music out for us...
Thankyou very much! There's much more where that came from!

http://www.mp3.com/TheSolarChurch

#33754 02/22/02 06:16 AM
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Quote:
So here is one done with "real bass and drums.. maybe a bit too "out" for your taste but see what you think.
Thanks for the honest response...

Sorry for all the typo's on my last post but I was rushing.

You are right this one bends my ear a bit too but it's still a WHOLE lot better with the real players. If the drummer had locked up a little bit more with the bass man who was holding down the groove nicely I might could have given you three and half stars on this one. Personally I'd like to hear an Elvin Jones type drum sound on this one although Lawrence sounds a zillion times better than any drum machine. Maybe if he were up a bit more in the mix it would feel a little better to me.
You sound good on the keys although I would have enjoyed a few more melodic hard bebop type lines sprinkled in there with the atonal offerings but again I like what you are doing much better with the trio.

By the way do you know Bill Evan's son Evan Evans. He's an extremely gifted film composer and has a site on mp3.com also.

http://www.mp3.com/evanevans

JAZZ LIVES

#33755 02/22/02 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve LeBlanc:
[QUOTE]
Yeah...I don't follow Wynton much but last I did he was spouting stuff that seemed to belittle what Duke did...he's into way older stuff than Duke isn't he?

Anyway...I think Wynton has relegated himself to Pompous Historian...from my POV he never had what it took to be an innovator musically. I never liked the way he played, especially in his early career when he tried to play bebop...it was kinda embarrassing because his brother was so good at it.

Also, I watched a lot of the Ken Burns jazz series on PBS and was highly put off by Wynton's take on things. He was attempting to talk from a position of authority on music that to me it seemed obvious he didn't get. Miles Davis used Wynton as the perfect example of someone who doesn't get jazz (or at least Miles' definition(s) of jazz \:\) ).
\:D
Steve
Just to come back to this for a second because it`s a significant correction:
Wynton M. hosted a series on National Public Radio called, (I think), This Is Jazz. I listened to almost every installment,
and wynton spent virtually the entire series making the point that what Duke did was cool and what Miles did was not. The two are both great artrists who have made significant contributions to the music. But Wynton seemed to have this notion that all the attention that Miles got for his innovations from the younger set was somehow `stolen` from Duke, and he was on a mission to set things right. He practically said so in so many words. What a selfish appropriation of an otherwise informative and interesting series.

#33756 02/22/02 05:14 PM
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That's right, as I read it. Wynton's main man is Duke. He has done a series of wonderful Septet recordings where the writing is very Duke-ish. New Orleans-Duke, much of it sans piano. And his incredible "Blood On The Fields". I had to give it to him there.

The thing I like about Wynton, and it's taken me a long while, is his researching into history. He's anti-innovation, which is a bit refreshing actually. But with it has come a tired neo-conservative movement that is killing us. What I don't like about him is his arrogance and disrespect he pays to more recent masters. It's as if he's the reincarnation of Sidney Bechet and is gonna put all these young whipper snappers like Miles Davis, especially and Ornette, in their place.


All the best,

Henry Robinett
#33757 02/22/02 05:23 PM
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Quote:
wynton spent virtually the entire series making the point that what Duke did was cool and what Miles did was not.
I heard something through the grapevine a while back that might account for Wynton's apparent additude.
Miles's band was playing somewhere and Wynton walked on the stage supposedly unannouced and univited. The crowd went off when they saw Wynton but Miles then cut the band off and walked off. ouch!!!

I suspect Wynton will mellow out as he matures seeing that it's almost natural for a young player with so many great accomplishment under his belt to be highly opinionated. It's as if the pressure of such success tends to make one feel that the world almosts expects you to be an authority on everything in your field and you feel obligated to obligue. Personally I think he is a great player and very knowledgeble about the history even though he's a bit of a 'motor mouth' and certainly not the last word about anything. It's not easy being a star from such a young age especially in jazz.

#33758 02/22/02 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chip McDonald:
The thing is, 100 years from now, THERE WON'T BE THESE DELIENATIONS.
Yeah, hopefully it won't be like the movie where the pop songs were old commercial dittys.......


Down like a dollar comin up against a yen, doin pretty good for the shape I'm in
#33759 02/22/02 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by lrossmusic:
[QUOTE] I suspect Wynton will mellow out as he matures seeing that it's almost natural for a young player with so many great accomplishment under his belt to be highly opinionated.
Wynton's not the youngster he was. He barnstormed on the scene back in 1982 and that was just his debut recording. He was big stuff before that with Art Blakey. Come on, that's 20 years. If he ain't matured yet he ain't gonna.

The first anti-Wynton sentiment, as far as I'm concerned, came in a 1983 interview with Wynton and Herbie Hancock in Musician Magazine. In it, this upstart kid, Marsalis disses both Miles AND Herbie, to his face in an international publication. He says that Herbie is playing BS and so was Miles when they turned their back on acoustic jazz. Ever since he and Miles had a tempestuous relatiobnship. This explains, in at least a public way I might be privy to, Miles' walking off stage.


All the best,

Henry Robinett
#33760 02/23/02 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Come on, that's 20 years. If he ain't matured yet he ain't gonna
You got a point there. I guess only time will tell. How old is he now anyway? I don't think he's getting his AARP issue of "Modern Maturity" quite yet.

#33761 02/23/02 06:08 AM
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Thanks for the correction...I did qualify my BS a little by stating that I really don't follow Wynton and don't know much of what he believes. I specifically found comments he made (on the Ken Burns Jazz series) about the BeBop era very insulting to people I see as the great innovators of the last century. That alone was enough for me to see a possible hidden agenda in what he has to say.

The story about Miles and Wynton is true...if memory serves it happened at Newport Jazz festival (I could be foggy here:))...Wynton walked on stage uninvited to start jamming with Miles...Miles stopped the band, turned to Wynton and said "Get off the stage boy".

Miles also criticized Wynton's playing on more than one occasion, slamming him pretty hard in his AutoBiography (a must read for any Bop fan IMO).

Wynton slammed his brother in the press several times for playing with Sting...totally uncalled for, I heard rumors that they didn't talk for years because of that.

None of this matters of course...Jazz is a broad term...lots of different stuff can be called Jazz.

#33762 02/23/02 08:35 AM
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Who cares what Wynton SAYS? He's jazz's Yngwie; it doesn't matter, do you like what he plays?

I think he ripped with Blakey. The gloves were off then; he was going for it, trying things, not afraid to play fast and ripping because it's not "tasteful" or whatever.

THEN, he started a solo career and got wacked out.

I saw him around... '93 in a medium-sized club. Great show (hometown trombonist Wycliffe wasn't with him then, though...)...

... BUT, what made it great was the encore. When he finished his set, all of the crowd politely shuffled out and got in their Cadillacs and Mercedes and went "where ever".

Myself and some friends stuck around - about 15 of us. Wynton comes back out and just SHREDDED, just totally went for it, all sorts of wild glissandos, crazy phrases, crazy timbres, careening fast run runs... He actually *sweated*. It was GREAT! It was the *real deal*; it really set me off, was a really inspiring thing because I knew he was capable of it from the Blakey era but it seemed like he had put that aside for more "mature" pastures. He played almost another entire hour for us, the whole band went off, really stretched out - *they got dangerous*. REAL JAZZ! Man, it was great, great band.

He hadn't; he *hid* it. I don't blame him, he was getting buried like Yngwie was in the press for having a rambunctious attitude. It's a shame, though - it's exactly the *real* attitude he should have. I wish he'd ditch the neo-retro religion crap, though. On the other hand, one could surmise he's holding it in check for the "true believers"; I found it curious he chose to come back out and play for such a small crowd, but it was pretty obvious we were all musicians (the uniform: long hair and black t-shirts) and intently listening. Maybe he doesn't get that as often as one would think? Oh well....

Haven't bought one of his recordings since his second Marsalis Standard Time cd. If he'd made a record of that level of hard core playing I'd buy it.

Hmm. Hard core jazz. Yeah.


Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com
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#33763 02/23/02 05:13 PM
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Good points about Wynton. I can respect that he can hold that much in check. Almost everyone I know who has that level of chops can't hold back that much. I've seen in about three times in similar, small club, no amplification except the bass, clubs. It was wonderfully intimate and I enjoyed it. But he's no Freddie Hubbard, before Freddie got wacked out. And I feel about him similarly. He doesn't BURN. It his style and it's unfair trying to make a person fit some other predetermined mold, BUT if he's is being promoted as the Messiah he's gonna have to take his lumps, dude. His shoes just ain't that big.


All the best,

Henry Robinett
#33764 02/24/02 01:49 AM
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I'll let Sir Duke (Duke Ellington) speak for me;

"There are only two kinds of music; good and bad."

"If it sounds good, it is good."

I think he was on to something! ;\)

Peace all,
Steve


><>
Steve
#33765 02/24/02 02:19 AM
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Amen Steve!

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IMO, if you`re going to position yourself as a music educator as well as a musician, it DOES matter what you say. There are lots of great players who don`t have a lot to say, and I appreciate them greatly for their gifts, I don`t need to listen to them talk. But Mr. M. goes to schools, leads seminars, participates in a lot of projects that people pay attention to. Whatever personal crap he has with one fellow player or another has NO place in those endeavors. Leave the public slams to the hip-hoppers, I say.

#33767 02/24/02 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by henryrobinett:
And I feel about him similarly. He doesn't BURN. It his style and it's unfair trying to make a person fit some other predetermined mold,
But he *can* if he wanted to. I don't think he's being true to himself. The real Wynton is the young guy trying to cut your head with Art Blakey. He's obviously figured out how to bend with the wind and come across "cultured" now, but it's ridiculous (again) that he should have to consider such things. I'm sure he now would NEVER do a cd of just raging, burning bop tunes - but he could, and it would be great. Instead - lip service to the ghosts; ghosts who I'm sure would kick his butt for being so stagnant if they were still around. I mean - how many tunes has Wynton penned now? I want to hear an all-Wynton composition hard-core sounding cd. Can he do it? Does he *care*? I would think at this point in his career he would be concerned about delving into the writing side of things - not the long drawn out pseudo-theatre things, but simple straight up "tunes". Oh well.


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/ "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien
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