Any Alto TS-308 owners?

[jeffincltnc]

I am looking to get a set of small 8" powered speakers and have read good things about the Alto TS-308 speakers. They are very inexpensive compared to the alternatives from QSC, EV and Yamaha and might appear to from my research to provide a really good quality and bang-for-the-buck price as a small room PA for piano (particularly for practice and solo in a close outdoor area like a restaurant patio).

 

I have usually passed over a lot of the budget products from Harbinger, Gemini, etc. and there are fewer choices in the 8" size than the larger 10/12/15 sizes.

 

But the Alto TS-308 seems to tick a lot of the boxes. I don't have access to try them out in store because my GC only has larger sizes, but for well under $500 for a pair, this seems like a good set if they sound good.

[Docbop]

I'd double check on the return policy before buying. In actually use a 1x8" maybe lack the low end for a full piano sound if you're doing solo or duo work.

[bill bosco]

i'd demo one first . i like the alto stuff . i've a TS312 and i think it's great for everything , including piano , it

s warm , the high end is not harsh and the mid range is just right . recently got a 310 hoping for something

similar but smaller and was surprised the pianos just don't sound as good , midrange has that harsh bluntness to it .

wouldn't want to use it for that . my hx3 organ still sounds great through it though , but the bigger speaker is definitely more accurate

[VanZea]

I have one for rehearsals. Live I use a QSC K10 (or two).The Alto really comes near. I don't miss the K10 when I'm reheasing. Its amazing this thing only costs 1/3 of the K10 when performing near the K10.

[brenner13]

So are Harbingers pretty bad? I"m out of town and might have an impromptu jam tomorrow night. I was going to use it as an excuse to get the new tiny Vox keyboard amp but alas, no one in town has them in stock. Other choices are a giant Roland KB amp or a mid sized used Behringer KB amp...pass.

 

The Vox is novelty that I"m willing to pay for. Though it is tiny and gets moderately loud, really prefer something with more clarity, I think. Powered PA speaker seems to fit the bill. Just want to spend as little over 200 bones as possible.

[Bill H.]

There's an interesting discussion here in a sound forum I belong to about the Alto TS-310 that you guys might find interesting.

[Stokely]

Hmm, good thread. I've been considering getting a new powered speaker or two for gigs where I don't use my in-ears (which is when we don't run sound).

 

I haven't had good experiences with cheaper powered speakers like Mackie thumps or Behringers. Not sure if I ever tried a Harbinger. They tend to falter on piano. When I've tried the band's QSC k10.2s at practice, they sound great even with piano. If these are truly in the ballpark I definitely might have to try them out.

[ElmerJFudd]

The looking at the specs and reading/watching a few reviews. The 308 is priced great, it is light to carry and gets plenty loud. It doesn"t produce great volume below 62htz. Not important in a band, but if playing solo piano it"s nice to have a little more down low. You can of course live without it just fine.

[Reezekeys]

I can't add gigging experience or A/B listening with other brands to this discussion, but I did recommend these speakers to a community services organization I did some teaching at last year - and the price/performance ratio was the biggest determining factor, along with generally good reviews I saw at the time. I used them to amplify Casio DPs I also put on the list for them to buy. They sounded fine to me, although they weren't used in the context of a real gig. I think having some EQ to shape things would be beneficial as they did have a characteristic (to me, anyway) sound of the lighter plastic boxes â a little mid-rangy.

 

Sorry Elmer, I disagree that you need deep low end response for solo piano. Most piano samples are close-miked and have a proximity effect that does not represent how we actually hear a real piano. Even in the playing position, there is not that much bass energy going on. Look up "false fundamental" on Google to see how we can perceive even the lowest note of a 9' concert grand piano on a AM radio. I have done many solo piano gigs and I always have a high-pass filter engaged â I'm trying to get my virtual piano to sound like a real piano!

[area51recording]

The looking at the specs and reading/watching a few reviews. The 308 is priced great, it is light to carry and gets plenty loud. It doesn"t produce great volume below 62htz. Not important in a band, but if playing solo piano it"s nice to have a little more down low. You can of course live without it just fine.

 

Tell you what, I really can't remember the last time I played a piano sample, even solo, even on small studio speakers, and didn't have to roll out at least a moderate amount of low end, sometimes even more than moderate, to get it to balance and sound more like what I hear when playing the real deal.....

[MPN21]

Recently I bought two Alto TS-312s, and I love them. Now I am trying to decide between the TS308 and 310. Alto is getting a lot of love everywhere including on Thomann. I will end up buying the Alto TS312s subwoofer, too.

[bill bosco]

gave my 312 a good listen to yesterday ( it's never home ) with my modx . definitely sounds better than the 310 . the APs sound great , no EQ , as opposed to the 310

which this thing going on with the midrange . i'm debating now whether to try to fix the 310 with a small EQ pedal or trade it in for another 312

[Bill H.]

gave my 312 a good listen to yesterday ( it's never home ) with my modx . definitely sounds better than the 310 . the APs sound great , no EQ , as opposed to the 310

which this thing going on with the midrange . i'm debating now whether to try to fix the 310 with a small EQ pedal or trade it in for another 312

 

Thanks for taking the time to do this. There's nothing like a direct 1:1 comparison from a fellow forumite.

[sagetunes]

I have a pair of alto 308's. I usually use just one and go to the FOH thru the built-in DI. They are great--you won't be lacking in low end whatsoever. Go buy a pair and enjoy all the money you saved.

I had a qsc 12--these are better.

[brenner13]

I tried, but GC only had the TX208, which only has one XLR input. I looked online and even called the store the day before and was assured they had the TS308"s in stock. I was on a time crunch or I would have rather gone to Music Go Round that also told me on the phone that they had TS series in stock. MuGoRnd also had the Headrush FRFR"s which I was ready to get, too. I should have gone there after GC didn"t have what I wanted, but was out of time.

 

However, GC had a used Acoustic A40 tucked back under a shelf that I"d seen online while browsing. A really great price; nearly half off from new. Two XLR-1/4' combo inputs, an 1/8' trs aux in, 1/8' headphone out, a 1/4 effects loop, an XLR out with dedicated volume, pre/post switch and ground lift, and even Bluetooth. Also three band EQ with sweepable mid and even built in DSP effects. I"m a sucker for bells and whistles.

 

The guy let me take it to the KB room and hookup a DGX670 for a quick test. Plenty loud and fairly crisp. AC piano sounded surprisingly good as did the organ but had to roll off nearly all of the lows once it was really cranked, or that little 8' would start farting out with the low octaves. EP"s were a tad muddy, but turning up the high EQ to about three o"clock brightened things nicely. Strings and hornz lacked any pizzazz, though. Synth leads punched through pretty well but again, missed some sizzle. Interesting that the mid EQ was rather subtle, even at the extremes of the settings, and the sweep seemed to have even less persuasion.

 

Overall, it sounded better than the big Roland KB in the room and was less than a quarter the weight and price. Out of time, the Acoustic A40 was my best choice. Keys are not what the thing was designed for, but worked out fine in a pinch. I might eventually offer it up as a trade for something interesting amongst my friends, or finally get a decent pickup for my mandolin and go Americana. YIKES! I"d have to find a different forum, then.

 

edit: After A/B-ing with an old QSC K12 now that I"m back home, the Acoustic A40 sounds pretty poor for keys. Definitely up for sale or trade.

[brenner13]

Still hijacking this thread...

The auxiliary input on the Acoustic A40 bypasses the EQ and effects. Keys sound way better going that route. Still not what the thing is designed for, but a pretty good bang for the buck.

[Morrissey]

I have a pair of alto 308's. I usually use just one and go to the FOH thru the built-in DI. They are great--you won't be lacking in low end whatsoever. Go buy a pair and enjoy all the money you saved.

I had a qsc 12--these are better.

 

 

I have a genuine question (not intended to provoke, as I've recall strong positions on this topic): it is accurate to describe the XLR output on the TS308 as a "built-in DI"? Is plugging a keyboard into a TS308 input and sending a feed from the TS308 XLR "Mix Out" functionally the same as, say, using a Countryman DI box?

[Reezekeys]

Not sure how controversial this is, but since nobody's answered yet I guess I'll put my 2 pence in. I did a quick search but didn't find out whether the TS308 "mix out" is just paralleled from the input, or whether the volume controls on the TS308 feed it. I've connected to the house PA like this with both my Mackie SRM450s and my QSC K8s. With the Mackies, there was phantom power on the XLR line and it blew out the SRM's power amp. It took over a month to get it fixed (that's another story). I've done the direct-to-house from my QSCs successfully but first made absolutely sure there was no phantom power from the house board.

 

In general, a DI box is a better idea. Unless there's a transformer at the "mix out" of the Alto, it really is in no way a DI or anything like one. However, as long as you're positive that phantom power is off, it costs nothing to try. There is the potential for ground loops that might create buzzing. I kept an emergency "ground lifter" in my accessory bag for those occasions, to use on the AC power cord of the speakers. Again, not recommended but could save a gig:

 

[Al Coda]

On the backside of the Alto TS3 series speakers, the output is CALLED "Mix Out".

But in the tech specs and manual, it´s called "Link Output" !!!

 

The latter is what it really is,- what comes in goes out w/ the exception both inputs will be mixed to the (Mix-) Link - Output.

 

From User guide v1.1:

 

7. Mix Out: Use a standard XLR cable (not included) to connect this output to the input of another loudspeaker (i.e., another TS3 loudspeaker).

When checkin´ the setup examples in the manual, there´s NO example where the "Mix Out" is connected to any (FOH console´s) MIC Input !

 

A DI box typically converts unbalanced instrument level signals into balanced mic level signals (while there are some more specialized DIs existing in the market still),- offering "ground lift" and parallel "instrument level output" (to amp) in addition.

This is absolutely not (or never) the case w/ these "Mix Out" / "LInk-Out" connectors of active PA speakers.

These outputs are typically to connect satellite speakers,- or subwoofers not offering stereo inputs and link outputs themselves.

 

WHEN FOH offers dedicated balanced LINE inputs on their stagebox, the Link-Out is usable,- except you urgently need a solution to eliminate a ground loop.

 

The VOLUME Controls on the back of the speaker work on the Link-Out and that´s why it isn´t recommended to pass the Volume Control beyond 0dB WHEN connecting a satellite speaker !

 

In fact, Alto TS3 08, 10, 12 & 15 are PA speaqkers and the so called internal "mixer" is just only a helper when not using a real mixer.

You CAN use such cabs as a single speaker for a mic, an instrument or both,- but their main professional purpose is PA..

 

In the 80s, a tech service built a special tool for me,-

 

19", 1HU, 2 unbalanced TS LINE +4dB (!!!) inputs w/ parallel outputs on the back, 2 balanced Mic-Level (600 Ohms) XLR outputs on the front and together w/ individual ground-lift switches.

There are 2 transformers inside and the box is passive,- no power needed.

+4dB input level is max.,- it also works w/ -10dB ...

 

It was used to go from Roland M160´s 1/4" TS line level outputs to FOH while using the M160´s XLR outputs to run to the/ my amp rack (or later,- active speakers).

This tool was always a big helper when touring and works w/ everything mixer offering both, unbalanced and balanced LINE level outputs !

 

I still own and use.

 

 

A.C.

[Morrissey]

 

A DI box typically converts unbalanced instrument level signals into balanced mic level signals (while there are some more specialized DIs existing in the market still),- offering "ground lift" and parallel "instrument level output" (to amp) in addition.

This is absolutely not (or never) the case w/ these "Mix Out" / "LInk-Out" connectors of active PA speakers.

These outputs are typically to connect satellite speakers,- or subwoofers not offering stereo inputs and link outputs themselves.

 

WHEN FOH offers dedicated balanced LINE inputs on their stagebox, the Link-Out is usable,- except you urgently need a solution to eliminate a ground loop.

 

The VOLUME Controls on the back of the speaker work on the Link-Out and that´s why it isn´t recommended to pass the Volume Control beyond 0dB WHEN connecting a satellite speaker !

 

In fact, Alto TS3 08, 10, 12 & 15 are PA speaqkers and the so called internal "mixer" is just only a helper when not using a real mixer.

You CAN use such cabs as a single speaker for a mic, an instrument or both,- but their main professional purpose is PA..

 

 

 

Thanks, Al. Lots of good detail to confirm my instinct that these speakers don't do double duty as a DI box, although the features built into these powered speakers are remarkable technological progress compared to the type of extraordinary steps that were needed in the 80s like you described.