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Thoughts on current best stage piano + clonewheel options?


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Hammond, anything else is just a clone.

 

Sort of kidding. Hammond and Farfisa is all I"ve ever played. Compact, B3, B3000 (don"t ask), XB2, XK3c/XK33c and this thing. Service from the crew in Addison used to be top notch but lately it"s lacking. I played Hammond because no one could touch the service at Addison. I"m within driving distance. But now I can"t even get parts there. I have to go to Bill Brown. It"s okay Bill is great but it"s an extra step in the chain. Korg support on the other hand is great right now. Super responsive and they get parts out to my tech overnight.... like when our male rapper spilled Fireball on the ribbon controller and it had to be replaced.

 

Just piano and just organ, right now I would still go out with this organ over a Kawai MP7se. You need the right stand. I"m using a On-Stage two tier Z that will ride the Hammond on top. The Hammond gives you two playable manuals in a fairly compact light unit. Beware when I got this the high trigger point was NOT the default. In my Blues band I"m using the K2-88 and the SKx. But Really like Kawai.

 

2qcAb7j.jpg

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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My current rig is a CP4 and an HX3 Expander Module triggered by a Nord Electro 4D. I love how it sounds and plays (although I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action). I like the HX3 internal sim and only used the Vent 2 with the HX3 on one gig. Although the Vent 2 sounded a little bit better, for me it"s not necessary since I"m happy with the HX3 internal sim.

 

For jazz organ gigs I use a dual manual Mojo.I only bring this up on this thread to say that while I love the Mojo organ sound, I don"t love the internal sim and, therefore, always add the Vent 2 when playing the Mojo.

 

To my ears, the Mojo sounds more like my A100 in the room and the HX3 sounds more like the sound I hear when I mic my Leslie 145. I prefer the HX3 if I"m playing rock, blues, or R&B.

 

If I were starting from scratch now I"d probably get a CP88, Although I have no reason to doubt other suggestions in this thread, I find it seamless to transition from the acoustic piano I practice on to the Yamaha Stage Pianos on gigs. This transition was uncomfortable and distracting for me when I had a Nord Stage HA88.

 

For the top board there are many good choices today. SK Pro, Viscount, Mag all sound great to me. But I don"t know how they play because I haven"t had the opportunity to play them. Add Mojo to the list if you like it"s internal sim (as so many people do).

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Where it sits pricewise will depend on what part of the world you are in, but for my money, the MAG C1 (single-manual) or C2 (dual-manual), with the HX3 engine and available with inbuilt Mini Vent as an option, is the frontrunner [among current clonewheels].

Ah, I didn't know there was a single manual MAG (and I was assuming the OP wanted single manual). Another interesting possibility, but I'm not sure what availability is like for the U.S..

 

I bought mine direct from MAG. It took 10 days by FedEx from MAG in Prague, Czechia to me in Adelaide, Australia (a few days longer than usual because of COVID delays at the time), and the personal service from Max Ghirardi at MAG is exemplary.

 

Paul, did you get the programmer option? MAG website refers to it, but I can"t find pictures or the price.

____________________________________
Rod

Here for the gear.

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Hammond XK5 and Yamaha CP88....

Don't disagree; but the SKPro is now in the same ballpark; I would probably lean in that direction (to save a few bucks) and the SK Pro also offers some other voices that the XK5 doesn't offer. Appears to me to be a better bargain with slight compromises (multi-contact keybed being one of them).

57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn

Delaware Dave

Exit93band

 

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I bought [my MAG organ] direct from MAG. It took 10 days by FedEx from MAG in Prague, Czechia to me in Adelaide, Australia (a few days longer than usual because of COVID delays at the time), and the personal service from Max Ghirardi at MAG is exemplary.

 

Paul, did you get the programmer option? MAG website refers to it, but I can"t find pictures or the price.

 

My MAG organ sounded great out of the box; however, the HX3 engine has many customizable parameters, and I did spend some time tweaking them to my taste, but I didn't get the plug-in programmer unit, I just plugged in my computer and used the free HX3 editor software.

 

For info and pricing, contact Max at MAG (max@magorgans.com).

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I'm using a NS3C with a SL88 Grand controller. I must admit I also have an Hammond XK5 (A3 system), but I generally only use that for rehearsals at home studio. When I want super light and easy, I just take the NS3C. When I need two keyboard with an 88 key piano, I use the NS3C with the SL88 Grand. When I want to have it all (and hurt my back) I take everything and the Moog! Mainly, I want the option to take one very light keyboard (i.e., NS3C) that will cover everything needed well enough.

NS3C, Hammond XK5, Yamaha S7X, Sequential Prophet 6, Yamaha YC73, Roland Jupiter X

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I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action).

 

Can you elaborate on this process please? How did you do that? What springs did you use? Most Electro"s I"ve played don"t feel good until they"re beaten to death ;)

www.dazzjazz.com

PhD in Jazz Organ Improvisation.

BMus (Hons) Jazz Piano.

my YouTube is Jazz Organ Bites

1961 A100.Leslie 45 & 122. MAG P-2 Organ. Kawai K300J. Yamaha CP4. Moog Matriarch. KIWI-8P.

 

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Thanks for the ongoing conversation - it's very helpful and intriguing. I've been investigating things which aren't that well known to me, like the MAG organs and the Crumar/Viscount pianos.

 

@doerfler, your rig on the Invisible stand looks so similar to the right I pictured above with the S90 + NE2. I still have several Invisible stands and that's probably what I'd use on any future "rootsy" piano + organ rig options. I appreciate eveyone!

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I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action).

 

Can you elaborate on this process please? How did you do that? What springs did you use? Most Electro"s I"ve played don"t feel good until they"re beaten to death ;)

I bought the spings from Syntaur. My contact was Sam Mims. Sam"s email is sales@sytaur.com. For me, the KYSP27 springs did the trick. Sam sent me some sample springs and after some testing and measurements I found the KYSP27 springs provided action very close to the action on my dual manual Mojo (which was my goal). I learned how to open up the Electro following a YouTube video. It was quite a while ago and I don"t recall the exact video but I"m sure you can find a good video. You just need to be careful with the ribbon cables that connect the PCBs as these cables are somewhat fragile.

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Can you get a MAG in the US? Shipped direct from Czech Republic, or they have a dealer in the US? What would a C-1 set us back?

 

The MAG website has a link "Are MAG organs available in the US?", which goes to Max's email address (max@magorgans.com).

 

The site lists non-EU pricing as:

- P2 (dual-manual flagship): EUR 2,967

- C2 (dual-manual compact): EUR 2,385

- C1 (single-manual compact): EUR 1,980

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My current setup is the PX-5S on the bottom Arturia Keylab MK II 49 on top running into Vb3M, or Galileo depending on how simple or complicated I want it :) on the iPad.

There is no luck - luck is simply the confluence of circumstance and co-incidence...

 

Time is the final arbiter for all things

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I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action).

 

Can you elaborate on this process please? How did you do that? What springs did you use? Most Electro"s I"ve played don"t feel good until they"re beaten to death ;)

 

FWIW, I've done this exact procedure. It requires modest bench skills at the level of doing PC upgrades and board swaps, for example.

 

To prepare, I would suggest searching the Nord User Forums for guidance and bread crumb trails posted by users who have worked on their own Electros and Stages. Pablo Mastodon has posted incredibly helpful advice on DIY repair projects in various places, including here:

 

https://www.norduserforum.com/nord-stage-forum-f3/ns2-73-compact-eliminating-creaking-t7647.html#p48534

 

Following the steps I gleaned from reading posts by Pablo and others on the Nord forums, I was able to swap the springs on my E4D in about 90 minutes, using these tools:

 

Torx T20 screwdriver

1/8" or 7/64" hex key

small needle-nose pliers

7mm hex nut driver

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I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action).

 

Can you elaborate on this process please? How did you do that? What springs did you use? Most Electro"s I"ve played don"t feel good until they"re beaten to death ;)

I bought the spings from Syntaur. My contact was Sam Mims. Sam"s email is sales@sytaur.com. For me, the KYSP27 springs did the trick. Sam sent me some sample springs and after some testing and measurements I found the KYSP27 springs provided action very close to the action on my dual manual Mojo (which was my goal). I learned how to open up the Electro following a YouTube video. It was quite a while ago and I don"t recall the exact video but I"m sure you can find a good video. You just need to be careful with the ribbon cables that connect the PCBs as these cables are somewhat fragile.

 

https://syntaur.com/Items.php?Item=KYSP27

 

I looked into the this not too long ago but they were out of stock then too.

Gig keys: Hammond SKpro, Korg Vox Continental, Crumar Mojo 61, Crumar Mojo Pedals

 

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I had to swap the E4D keyboard springs for lighter springs before being at peace with the action).

 

Can you elaborate on this process please? How did you do that? What springs did you use? Most Electro"s I"ve played don"t feel good until they"re beaten to death ;)

I bought the spings from Syntaur. My contact was Sam Mims. Sam"s email is sales@sytaur.com. For me, the KYSP27 springs did the trick. Sam sent me some sample springs and after some testing and measurements I found the KYSP27 springs provided action very close to the action on my dual manual Mojo (which was my goal). I learned how to open up the Electro following a YouTube video. It was quite a while ago and I don"t recall the exact video but I"m sure you can find a good video. You just need to be careful with the ribbon cables that connect the PCBs as these cables are somewhat fragile.

 

https://syntaur.com/Items.php?Item=KYSP27

 

I looked into the this not too long ago but they were out of stock then too.

 

I also tried to buy some about 3 years ago, and they were also out of stock then. I called them then and found them to be rather cagey about where they got them and if they'd even get any more in? No real answers....

 

Almost exactly a year ago I just randomly checked and they had more in stock! I grabbed two sets, one for my Kurz Artis 7 and one for my E5D. Of course I have not managed to make time to actually put them in either, but I would recommend calling them, but even if you get stonewalled just keep checking in on the site. That was my experience at least.....

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I called them them and found them to be rather cagey about where they got them and if they'd even get any more in? No real answers....
I don't think they know. I think they scavenege them out of used not-worth-repairing boards as they acquire them.

 

I grabbed two sets, one for my Kurz Artis 7 and one for my E5D

I'm not sure those two boards use the same springs.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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I'd just get a Nord Stage 3

 

Boom. Thread comes full circle. Since I already have a NS3 (two of them, in fact), perhaps it is time for me to be happy with this and move forward!

 

I still stand by my recommendation of a Kawai MP7SE + Hammond SK Pro, but you could also combine your NS3 with an SK Pro. But if you like the Nords that's the cheapest option ;)

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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But if you like the Nords that's the cheapest option ;)

 

 

This surely is the first time anyone has uttered this sentence!

:laugh:

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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The suggestions (as good and valid as they are) are all over the place, because it really depends on your priorities.

 

operational ergonomics? (simplicity/directness)

vintage style aesthetics?

weight limits?

budget limits?

what sounds matter? both acoustic and electric pianos? any other sounds besides actual piano and organ sounds?

only currently available stuff, or is used an option?

does everything have to be self-contained, or could you get some sounds from a module/smartphone/tablet/laptop?

 

even if you don't care about trying to keep the manuals close together as I do. ;-)

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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I'd just get a Nord Stage 3
Boom. Thread comes full circle. Since I already have a NS3 (two of them, in fact), perhaps it is time for me to be happy with this and move forward!
I've very happily played a "vintage" gig with my NS2 and a piano-action controller. Four live buttons assigned to AP, Rhodes, Wurly, clav downstairs, organ upstairs. Bliss.

 

But I figured Eric wanted to taste of something different.

 

Cheers, Mike.

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