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Kurzweil PC4


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Thank you all. This is some awesome info, but now another question. When you routed the FX out to B, then to the neo, which original FX setting did you edit out the KB3A, and/or B? A single or double leslie? Did you keep 1 or 2 Chor/vib boxes? Does it matter?

 

Go here: https://kurzweil.com/pc3/#faqs

 

Then go to 'routing KB3 to aux outputs minus the internal leslie'. Follow the step by step instructions. If you are editing a program that has a double leslie, i.e. two KB3a and KB3b blocks, make the changes to both KB3a and KB3b blocks. Save this as a program so that you have a go to KB3 program without a leslie already to go.

57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn

Delaware Dave

Exit93band

 

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Dave, I can't believe your son is FIVE already. I guess he has outgrown that Sesame Street guitar I gave Him:) Save up your money because Berklee is not cheap.

 

Btw I still use your custom organ patches extensively & almost always receive compliments on the sounds. Thanks man for your continued hard work & generosity.

 

For anyone that doesn't have Dave's Kurzweil sets, just reach out to him. You'll be glad you did.

 

Cheers,

Larry

 

Ha he loved the Elmo guitar and still rocks it occasionally! Thanks again!

 

Happy to share my custom sounds with anyone from this forum, free of charge. Just shoot me an email. Includes stuff I've done for Broadway shows and acts like The Who and Brian Wilson. Just added my updated version of No Quarter to my PC4 set!

weiserdav@gmail.com

 

Sweet!

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I am planning on using the B3-X app on my iPad with my (pre-ordered) PC4-7 whenever it arrives and then running the headphone output into the 1/8th A/D input on the keyboard. I am thinking I can program KB3 programs to transmit midi to the iPad and assign the audio to the assignable secondary outs and then only use those outputs when I am not using the iPad.

 

From what I have read on this thread and elsewhere this should work in theory.

 

I am also wondering since the PC4 (&PC4-7) is class compliant for USB-Midi if I can use the camera connection kit and a USB cable to transmit data to and from the PC4-7 and iPad, or if I also need a midi interface and 5 pin midi cables. Ideally, the Kurz will send midi to the iPad to control the B3-X and receive midi program changes from the Band Helper app.

Studio: Motif XF8 / MacBook Pro / Apollo Twin X / M-Audio BX8a / Plug-ins

Live Rig A: Nord Stage 3 Compact 73 / Prophet Rev2 / Various FX pedals (Eventide, Strymon, Lounsberry, Neo Vent II)

Live Rig B: Yamaha MODX7 / Crumar D9-X / B3-X  (iPad)

Amp: MS KP-610s

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I'm trying to do the setlist app thing (MobileSheets on an Android tablet connected to the PC4 by USB), and as far as I can tell the tablet can only choose multi's if I 1) manually put the keyboard in multi mode first, 2) Set Global->MIDI->Local Kbd Chan to a channel and tell my app to transmit on that channel. Am I missing anything?

 

1) is mildly annoying but I can live with it. 2) is incompatible with the zone "Input Channel" feature which I'd like to use.

 

In general, I'd be curious to hear how other people automate setlists.

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I wonder how "Flash Play" is working for others. My SP6 has twice now got stuck in "Loading........" and never loads even after an hour so. Rebooting same issue. The only thing that I have been able to do is power it off and reboot while holding enter which puts it in update mode. I then have to reformat the flash and re-install the latest OS .KUF file and then reboot and restore it from back up I made. This process takes 15 minutes to 1/2 hour depending how long the OS install takes. Sometimes it is fast others it takes quite awhile to complete. All the diagnostic tests pass. This has happened twice in the last year and each at the worst time. I have started keeping a flash drive in the case. Has anybody else experienced this with Kurzweil?

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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I'm trying to do the setlist app thing (MobileSheets on an Android tablet connected to the PC4 by USB), and as far as I can tell the tablet can only choose multi's if I 1) manually put the keyboard in multi mode first, 2) Set Global->MIDI->Local Kbd Chan to a channel and tell my app to transmit on that channel. Am I missing anything?

 

Somebody on the "Mastering VAST" forums pointed out that I'd overlooked the "Program Change Mode"; if that's set to "Quick Access", then program change messages will select from QA Banks, and will automatically switch the keyboard to Program or Multi mode as necessary depending on whether the chosen QA bank entry is a program or a multi.

 

More specifically, sending (LSB, PC) equal to (X, YZ) chooses QA number Z+1 from bank number XY.

 

So, for example, sending LSB 1, PC 47 gives you QA bank number 14, entry 8.

 

No need for the "Local Kbd Chan" setting.

 

Maintaining the QA banks adds one extra step to the setup process, but I can live with that.

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I wonder how "Flash Play" is working for others. My SP6 has twice now got stuck in "Loading........" and never loads even after an hour so. Rebooting same issue. The only thing that I have been able to do is power it off and reboot while holding enter which puts it in update mode. I then have to reformat the flash and re-install the latest OS .KUF file and then reboot and restore it from back up I made. This process takes 15 minutes to 1/2 hour depending how long the OS install takes. Sometimes it is fast others it takes quite awhile to complete. All the diagnostic tests pass. This has happened twice in the last year and each at the worst time. I have started keeping a flash drive in the case. Has anybody else experienced this with Kurzweil?

 

When I first got my PC4 I started to do the OS update. But, it could not see the file on my thumb drive.

 

Then it looked like I had bricked it.

 

Turns out, the thumb drive was formatted NTSF. I reformatted to FAT32, and it saw and read the file no issue.

"In the beginning, Adam had the blues, 'cause he was lonesome.

So God helped him and created woman.

 

Now everybody's got the blues."

 

Willie Dixon

 

 

 

 

 

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When I first got my PC4 I started to do the OS update. But, it could not see the file on my thumb drive.

 

Then it looked like I had bricked it.

 

Turns out, the thumb drive was formatted NTSF. I reformatted to FAT32, and it saw and read the file no issue.

 

Yes, I had that happen on my old SP4-7 since then I always keep a FAT32 formatted flash with the latest OS and backup file. The issue on my SP6 bothers me because it happened after the last gig I played in 2020 which was in February.

I haven't played the SP6 that much since maybe 8 to 10 times, and now it just happened again almost a year to the date. I'm afraid its just going to stop working and I cannot afford to replace it.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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I"m just curious. Are you using an expression pedal that was made for this keyboard. Believe it or not, I was using an FC7 with an adapter that kept (I think) locking up my SP6.

Interesting: I used an FC7 with an adapter to switch the tip and ring on my PC3 for 3 years as the Kurzweil expression pedal requirements meet the "Roland" spec. With the adapter on the Yamaha I got a smooth 0-127. Then on a gig (after 3 years of use) each time I engaged the expression pedal it would reboot the PC3. Thinking that the original FC7 I had was faulty I then purchased another FC7 and it worked fine for 1 gig. The next gig after that the new FC7 started doing the same thing as the old FC7. Interesting though that the FC7 never exhibited this at my home, only at gigs. I then switched to a Roland EV-7 (similar long throw as the FC7) 7 years ago. No adapter is needed, a smooth transition from 0-127 and not a single issue in 7 years.

 

The question I could never explain is why the FC7 always worked at home and worked flawlessly for 3 years at gigs and suddenly it (and the new replacement) caused my PC3 to reboot upon engaging it (and only at gigs)? Never have been quite able to figure that out. I have read that FC7's have a tendency to build up static electricity which can cause havoc. I think that Guido (from GSI) had reported a year or two ago the same issue with an FC7 and what he perceived as a build up of static electricity. His solution was to put the FC7 on a rubber mat. I've never tried that to understand whether that is the source issue for me. It seems logical given that the pedal worked flawlessly for three years and then out of the blue started to exhibit issues as well as a new FC7.

 

Roland EV-7 for sale here --> link

57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn

Delaware Dave

Exit93band

 

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I"m just curious. Are you using an expression pedal that was made for this keyboard. Believe it or not, I was using an FC7 with an adapter that kept (I think) locking up my SP6.

Interesting: I used an FC7 with an adapter to switch the tip and ring on my PC3 for 3 years as the Kurzweil expression pedal requirements meet the "Roland" spec. With the adapter on the Yamaha I got a smooth 0-127. Then on a gig (after 3 years of use) each time I engaged the expression pedal it would reboot the PC3. Thinking that the original FC7 I had was faulty I then purchased another FC7 and it worked fine for 1 gig. The next gig after that the new FC7 started doing the same thing as the old FC7. Interesting though that the FC7 never exhibited this at my home, only at gigs. I then switched to a Roland EV-7 (similar long throw as the FC7) 7 years ago. No adapter is needed, a smooth transition from 0-127 and not a single issue in 7 years.

 

The question I could never explain is why the FC7 always worked at home and worked flawlessly for 3 years at gigs and suddenly it (and the new replacement) caused my PC3 to reboot upon engaging it (and only at gigs)? Never have been quite able to figure that out. I have read that FC7's have a tendency to build up static electricity which can cause havoc. I think that Guido (from GSI) had reported a year or two ago the same issue with an FC7 and what he perceived as a build up of static electricity. His solution was to put the FC7 on a rubber mat. I've never tried that to understand whether that is the source issue for me. It seems logical given that the pedal worked flawlessly for three years and then out of the blue started to exhibit issues as well as a new FC7.

 

Roland EV-7 for sale here --> link

 

When I first got my PC4, I tried to use an FC7 with in.

 

It went from off to full in about 1 inch or so of travel.

 

The people on the forum told me it was because the FC7 has a different value pot that the PC4 wants to see.

 

So, I bought a Kurzweil pedal, and it works perfectly

"In the beginning, Adam had the blues, 'cause he was lonesome.

So God helped him and created woman.

 

Now everybody's got the blues."

 

Willie Dixon

 

 

 

 

 

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Your FC7 experience is similar to mine. Worked fine at home, then on a gig periodically the SP6 would just lock up, requiring a panic reset. Never did figure it out. I just started using a pedal with the right tsr wiring.
CA93, MODX8, YC88, K8.2
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When I first got my PC4, I tried to use an FC7 with in. It went from off to full in about 1 inch or so of travel. The people on the forum told me it was because the FC7 has a different value pot that the PC4 wants to see. So, I bought a Kurzweil pedal, and it works perfectly

 

Your FC7 experience is similar to mine. Worked fine at home, then on a gig periodically the SP6 would just lock up, requiring a panic reset. Never did figure it out. I just started using a pedal with the right tsr wiring.

 

For the FC7 to produce a smooth 0-127 with the PC3 requires an adapter that swaps the the tip and ring (you can make one yourself) on one end of the plug. If you use the adapter you will get a smooth 0-127. Without the adapter you get about 0-100 in the first inch of travel and then 100-127 the rest of the way; the adapter fixes this issue. Why it worked flawlessly for 3 years and then after 3 years it started to cause the PC3 to reboot when engaging the pedal is still a mystery.

57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn

Delaware Dave

Exit93band

 

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I'm glad to see someone else having problems with the FC7 rebooting a PC3. I thought I was losing my mind when it first happened (okay I might be losing my mind anyway but...). I've read many debates/ analysis of expression pedals & all I can say is use what works consistently & feels good to you. Only my experience, but I keep coming back to the EV5.

 

Cheers,

Larry

Kurzweil Forte 7, PC3, PC4, Hydrasynth, Kronos 61, UltraNova, Rhodes, Clavinet D6, MiniMoog, GSI Burn, ELX112Ps, SpaceStation, Assorted Weapons
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Still trying to figure out how to do all my patch changes from a tablet:

 

In addition to the PC4, I have a DeepMind 12. I plug the tablet into the DeepMind, run a cable from the DeepMind's MIDI out to the PC4's MIDI in, and set the DeepMind to forward USB MIDI to MIDI out.

 

Now the problem is that every program change is acted on by both keyboards. I'd like to instead direct them individually to one or the other. The DeepMind can be configured to listen only on one channel. The PC4, surprisingly, can't--as far as I can tell.

 

Hm, I guess there's a solution: I just have to tell the tablet to send the messages in the right order: send the DeepMind's message first, and the PC4's second. The PC4 will change twice, but end up in the right place.

 

Kind of a hack, though.

 

This is all a lot more fiddly than I'd hoped.

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You can't just have the PC4 & DeepMind12 on different midi channels? I control my DeepMind12 from my SP6. Though I don't use a tablet. I just keep the "Favorites" menu up at all times on the DeepMind 12.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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You can't just have the PC4 & DeepMind12 on different midi channels? I control my DeepMind12 from my SP6. Though I don't use a tablet. I just keep the "Favorites" menu up at all times on the DeepMind 12.

 

The DeepMind has a global "RX Channel" that you can set. The PC4 doesn't have anything comparable I can find--seems like it always responds to program changes over any channel (well, as long as you're in "Quick Access" mode for program changes, anyway).

 

Understood, the PC4 and DeepMind both have some helpful setlist-like features of their own, I could end up going with that. I've found song transitions kind of stressful and error-prone, so if I can get it down to just one tap on the tablet screen, I'd like to.

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The DeepMind has a global "RX Channel" that you can set. The PC4 doesn't have anything comparable I can find--seems like it always responds to program changes over any channel (well, as long as you're in "Quick Access" mode for program changes, anyway).

Interesting. Also of note is that the MIDI Implementation Chart says that there is a "Basic Channel" which can be set to anything from 1 to 16, with a default of 1... but there is no other reference in the manual to a "Basic Channel" or how to change it. I wonder if that is supposed to be equivalent to the "Global" channel on some other boards, used in part to distinguish whether a Program Change is supposed to change an entire multi-channel setup, or only the sound for a single channel. (That may or may not be related to what you're running into.)

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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Hey guys, what do you think about the PC4's Virtual Analog oscillators and filter?

 

As I've mentioned in other threads, I have a K2000 which I love for its dark character; I had a K2661, but it was too bright...I just didn't like the sound.

 

Is the VA engine these days...is it beefy? Gritty? Soft? Sharp?

 

I haven't really found a demo that clearly demonstrated the raw tones and the VA filters (if you know of any, I'd love to hear/see them).

 

Thanks!

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Interesting. Also of note is that the MIDI Implementation Chart says that there is a "Basic Channel" which can be set to anything from 1 to 16, with a default of 1... but there is no other reference in the manual to a "Basic Channel" or how to change it. I wonder if that is supposed to be equivalent to the "Global" channel on some other boards, used in part to distinguish whether a Program Change is supposed to change an entire multi-channel setup, or only the sound for a single channel. (That may or may not be related to what you're running into.)

 

Huh, interesting, yeah, I'm not sure what that refers to.

 

So, first, the PC4 has two main modes, "Program" and "Multi". In program mode there are always 16 channels, each of which may have its own program associated. You can only play one of those 16 channels at a time from the PC4's keyboard, but you can pick that current channel with channel up/down buttons.

 

In Multi mode of course the MIDI channel behavior is more configurable.

 

The behavior of program changes depends on how you set the globals "Local Keyboard Channel" and "Program Change Mode".

 

The "normal" behavior, with both of those globals set to the default, is that a program change value refers to the ID of a program, and changes the program associated with the channel over which the program change message is sent. So, if you're only playing from the PC4 keyboard, you won't see the effect of the message until you change into program mode and change the current channel to the one that was affected.

 

"Local Keyboard Channel" defaults to None. If you instead set it to a channel, then it changes the behavior of program changes sent over that channel. Program changes sent over other channels will behave as normally, but program changes sent over that special channel will only set the program of the keyboard's *current* channel, if you're in program mode. If you're in multi mode, and get a program change over that special channel, then the program change value will be interpreted as the ID of a multi, and you'll be switched to that multi.

 

If Local Keyboard Mode is set to None, but "Program Change Mode" is set to "Quick Access", then program change values over any MIDI channel are acted on, and the MIDI channel they arrive over is irrelevant to the results. The value of the program change is no longer a program or multi ID, instead it is interpreted as a QA bank and a slot within that bank. That slot may hold either a multi or a program. If the program change refers to a program, then it will switch the keyboard into program mode and change the program associated with the keyboard's *current* channel. (The channel that the message was sent over is irrelevant.) If the slot holds a multi, then the keyboard switches to multi mode and the chosen multi.

 

I think. I'm still getting the hang of it. Annoyingly, this isn't all documented.

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OK, Now I need a some help here

 

One of my gigs is a duo, and I want to put together some rhythm tracks to play behind me. Just basic bass and drums, then I'll play along.

 

I'm one of those that prefers to use tracks written by myself.

 

So, I'm recording and editing the tracks MIDI using Sonar X3 Producer

 

What I need help with is getting the PC4 to sync up with the computer and record from the computer to the onboard sequencer.

 

I've been scouring the owner manual trying to find what I'm looking for, but to no avail.

 

What I would like is to be able to hit the record button on the PC4, then hit play on Sonar, and have both sync up and the PC4 to record the tracks.

 

I've been in global and made some adjustments there, and I've been in Sonar trying to make sure it is transmitting properly.

 

BTW - For reasons mentioned earlier, I am connected using my UNO MIDI Interface. I still cannot seem to get Sonar to recognize it using USB. I just today get it working with the sound editor and controller

 

 

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

"In the beginning, Adam had the blues, 'cause he was lonesome.

So God helped him and created woman.

 

Now everybody's got the blues."

 

Willie Dixon

 

 

 

 

 

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I am just going to try and research and get on to Kurz (not that they''ll help I daresay) and try and source sysex code for changing modes.

 

By the way, what I found:

 

F7 07 46 01 00 30 00 00 00 00 00 00 F7: chooses program mode

F0 07 46 01 00 31 00 00 00 00 00 00 F7: chooses multi mode

F0 07 46 01 00 11 XX YY F7: selects multi XX*128 + YY

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I love Kurzweil sounds, but that Medelli action looks atrocious for piano.

What are you seeing that makes it look atrocious for piano?

 

I wouldn't expect it to be great, simply because it is after all a semi-weighted action (unlike the fully weighted hammer Medelli action used in the PC4), but I didn't notice anything that makes me think it might not be as good as some of the other better SW boards... I'll be really curious to get my fingers on it.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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