Gibson acquires Mesa Boogie!

[KuruPrionz]

I'd lay money that he had a wah parked in a sweet-spot, acting like a sort of a mid-boost/treble-booster/EQ kinda sorta affair. He did that a lot, and it sounds like it there.

 

Mick Ronson is not available to answer our questions, we'll never know. I've done my share of "cocked wah" playing and while some of the guitar does sound like that to me, the solo doesn't, especially when he goes up into the higher notes.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the details.

 

My point was that amps (including Mesa amps) tend to get stereotyped. We hear the metal bands with their Rectifiers and the shredders with their Mark heads and there are LOTS of other sounds one can make with those specific Mesa amps and lots of Mesa amps that are capable of very different tones than the stereotypes would indicate.

 

Just as the solo on Moonage Daydream is not within the bounds of the stereotypical "Fender sound."

 

Very few amps are true "one trick ponies."

 

And, I agree with The Real MC that the speakers in the Lonestar amps are crap. I suspect they might improve after six months of high volume thrashing but there are better options.

I'm long since done with heavy gear though, I used to play through a Vox 4-12 cabinet with 2 EVM12L and 2 JBL D-120 speakers in it. It needed 2 large wheels and a trailer hitch, that thing weighed a TON.

With the MK III in "15 watt Class A" mode it was insanely loud. I only really ever got to crank it up once, at a large outdoor venue. The sound men hated me, so I turned it up more.

[Caevan O’Shite]

My point... amps (including Mesa amps) tend to get stereotyped. We hear the metal bands with their Rectifiers and the shredders with their Mark heads and there are LOTS of other sounds one can make with those specific Mesa amps and lots of Mesa amps that are capable of very different tones than the stereotypes would indicate.

 

Just as the solo on Moonage Daydream is not within the bounds of the stereotypical "Fender sound."

 

Very few amps are true "one trick ponies."

Agreed! More down to how many- or how few- tricks the given player has in his trick-bag, figuratively speaking.

 

And, I agree with The Real MC that the speakers in the Lonestar amps are crap. I suspect they might improve after six months of high volume thrashing but there are better options.

I'm long since done with heavy gear though, I used to play through a Vox 4-12 cabinet with 2 EVM12L and 2 JBL D-120 speakers in it. It needed 2 large wheels and a trailer hitch, that thing weighed a TON.

Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice.... and, huge and HEAVY... !!

 

One of the coolest and coolest sounding amps I ever had the pleasure of trying out was a vintage Vox AC50 head and 2x12 cab- loaded with "silver" alnico Celestions, if I recall correctly- all in the original tubular stand for the head and cab; now, THAT was PLENTY big and LOUD enough! And had beautiful clean tone. I'm sure it could have been further versatile, but that clean tone... beautiful, mesmerizing... I didn't b other going past that. Plus, it was quite loud, wasn't mine, and I only had a short time to try it out...

 

But, yeah, amp brands get pigeon-holed. Fuchs had this Viper amp model that was likely a phenomenal amp for Metal and such, but their brand has been so largely associated with other styles and sounds that an unfortunate bias (yeah, pun INTENDED... ! ) had set in, and their sales for the Viper line suffered badly. Should have been up there with MESA, Diezel, Marshall, etc....

 

And I'm sure that if I had been in some situation where I had only one of such "Metal amps" available, I could wrangle all manner of not-necessarily-"Metal" tones out of it for all manner of not-"Metal" styles, 100% fingerstyle, no less.

 

That's one of the beauties and strengths of tube-amps in general, and good tube-amps, in particular: versatility, response to ones "touch" and use of the amps controls and guitars and pickups and pedals and and and...

 

It's not so much the pony, but the rider that might have only one trick.

 

With the MK III in "15 watt Class A" mode it was insanely loud. I only really ever got to crank it up once, at a large outdoor venue. The sound men hated me, so I turned it up more.

Haah!

[KuruPrionz]

That's one of the beauties and strengths of tube-amps in general, and good tube-amps, in particular: versatility, response to ones "touch" and use of the amps controls and guitars and pickups and pedals and and and...

 

Tube amps I've owned - 9 Mesa (listed above), at least 7 Fenders - from a 53 TV Front Deluxe, a pair of Champ chassis with consecutive serial numbers, a Rivera era Concert etc..., Red Plate Blues Machine, Allen Accomplice, Emerysound Stage Baby, converted Hammond organ amp reconfigured as a modified Fender 5D3, converted vintage hi-fi amp rewired as the Top Cut channel of a 58 Vox AC15 with an EF86 preamp tube and a buttload of little Kay, Supro, Orpheus, Silvertone, Monkey Wards, Magnetone etc.

 

I also have a substantial stash of vintage US and European tubes, a Hickok tube tester and an inclination to find the best tube for V1 (biggest change in tone), the phase invertor (push pull amps only, second biggest change in tone) and the output tube(s). If there is a rectifier tube I am well equipped to "roll bottles" there too. All that to say - I am very familiar with tube amps and the sounds they can produce.

 

For all that, 2 problems remain for me personally. First and foremost, well over 2,000 gigs in the primary equipment failures I've been subjected to are tubes and guitar cords. Somebody stealing our SM58s does not count because we were done playing that night. Secondly, I am finally and blissfully in a band where we play at very reasonable volumes and let the PA do the heavy lifting. Our drummer keeps his volume very reasonable and the rest of us follow suit. With a good speaker in it, even a Fender Champ will be too loud by the time you get the output section cooking and rocking and that's where the tone really happens.

 

I still have the 2 custom build amps, I may end up keeping them but I don't/can't gig with them for reasons mentioned above. Current giggers are a Boss Katana 100 Combo and a Roland Cube 40gx. They sound really good (I would not say they sound "just like tubes" but they don't sound totally "solid state" either.

 

My favorite amps are now Peavey Vypyr VIP series, I have the 1 and the 3. I put a better speaker in the 1, a Scorpion 10". Properly adjusted, it sounds so close to tubes that it makes me smile every time I play it. You won't get that sound with the stock speaker, it is truly junk. The VIP 3 sounds bigger, 12" speaker and the stock speaker is good. I have a JBL G125-8 I want to try in there. The 3 will dial down to a 1 watt setting so you can fire up the Post Gain and start getting that "tube amp turned up really loud" tone at very reasonable volumes. I just need to stop being lazy and program them for gigging out.

 

Touch sensitive? Very much so and very much a response one expects from tubes. Check out Hartley's white papers, I think #3 is Transtube. He's been working on this idea for over 25 years, it is a success in my book. One of the great unheralded accomplishments in guitar amplification, ever.

 

So far, nobody on here seems to believe what I'm saying. Probably that stereotyping again, Peavey guitar amps are most definitely stereotyped and not all of them are great. I get it.

 

That's OK, I'm gonna do it anyway. Small, light, reliable amps that can get as close to "the tone" as I'll ever need for live work are my new ish. I won't miss the lugging or the "mystery silence".

 

Edited to add:

DBM reminds me that I also owned 2 Music Man RD50 amps, both combos - a 1-10" and a 1-12. Those were good amps. I also owned a Fender Pro Junior, one of the early Made in USA ones.

And a bunch of bass amps, mostly Peavey plus a GK head. Long ago and far away I had a McGowan tube PA head with a 6-12" cab I made in Dad's woodshop. And a Peavey LA400 - 210 watts RMS into a 12" Black Widow speaker.

And a Peavey Reknown 1-12" combo with a Scorpion Plus speaker. Yep, quite a few solid state amps in there. Probably some other stuff I've forgotten, I know I bought some amps just to sell them.

[desertbluesman]

Tube amps I've owned - 9 Mesa (listed above), at least 7 Fenders - from a 53 TV Front Deluxe, a pair of Champ chassis with consecutive serial numbers, a Rivera era Concert etc..., Red Plate Blues Machine, Allen Accomplice, Emerysound Stage Baby, converted Hammond organ amp reconfigured as a modified Fender 5D3, converted vintage hi-fi amp rewired as the Top Cut channel of a 58 Vox AC15 with an EF86 preamp tube and a buttload of little Kay, Supro, Orpheus, Silvertone, Monkey Wards, Magnetone etc.

A complete list of amps I have owned since 1964

1) Fender Black Face Bassman 1960's with 2-12 Cab with stock speakers

2) Fender Black Face Deluxe Reverb 1960's with stock speaker

3) Marshall Hundred Watt Plexi head with Sunn 6-12 Bass cabinet

4) Fender Silver Face Twin Reverb with 2- JBL K 120 Speakers

5) Fender Silver Face Pro Reverb with 2- JBL K 120 Speakers

6) Fender Silver Face Deluxe Reverb with stock speaker

7) Peavey Hundred watt 2-12 hybrid amp (I don't remember the model number)

8) Peavey Fifty watt 2-12 hybrid amp (I don't remember the model number)

9) Peavey two Hundred watt hybrid amp head (I don't remember the model number or speaker combination)

10) Music Man Hundred watt hybrid Combo with stock speakers (I don't remember the model number)

11) Music Man fifty watt hybrid Combo with stock speakers (I don't remember the model number)

12) Fender 30 one twelve combo (Rivera Era) With stock speaker. (This is one of my all time favorites)

13) Seymour Duncan hundred watt head Model unknown with the preamp modules that could be changed

14) Mesa Boogie Mark II C+ 80 watt head which was a Mark II B, then C, Then C+ With a 1-12 cab with an EVM 12L in it.

15) Mesa Boogie Quad Preamp with Strategy 400 Power amp with 4 -1-12 cabs with EVM 12L's in them

16) Mesa Boogie Mark IV 80 watt combo (with the OEM EVM 12L speaker from the Mark II C+ that I still have but did not sell with the amp).

17) Gallien Kruegar Micro Lead ML250

18) Galilien Kruegar later model Micro Lead (Model unknown)

19) 2 Fender Frontman 15 Gs with a modeler pedalboard in front for stereo practice.1

20) Fender Hot Rod Deluxe combo with an Emeience Cannabis Rex 12" speaker. (I still have it, It is my all time favorite amp with a pedalboard in front of it)

21) Bogner Alchemist 50 watt tube 1-12 combo, (did not like it, sent it back)

22) Mesa Boogie Hundred watt Lone Star Classic head. (did not like it, sent it back)

23) Fender Super Champ X2 15 watt combo with Eminence Lil Buddy 10" speaker (Sold it and regret selling it)

24) Ibanez TS 15 Head (did not like it, sent it back)

25) Egnater Tweaker 15 Watt Head. into an EVM 12 L 1-12 speaker cab (It is my second all time favorite amp with a pedalboard in front of it)

26) Epiphone 5 watt Valve Junior Head which I sent to my kiddo as a gift.

 

I sold or traded or gave away all of the amps I mentioned above except for the Hot Rod Deluxe and the Tweaker 15 watt head.......

[RABid]

I own a nice Mark 5 12" combo. I don't know whether to be sad because Gibson will screw this up, or happy that in 5 years Mesa will be gone and I can sell it for good money.

 

Edit - I guess Gibson cannot do any worse with Mesa/Boogie than Fender did with Genz-Benz. I never did understand that, but I am holding on to my two Genz-Benz bass amps.

[Chip McDonald]

So they'll make the mom and pop dealers be required to do gargantuan opening orders of guitars AND amps now I guess?

 

Gibson should just make a GA-40 clone, sell it for Hot Rod Deluxe prices, and then voila - they're competing.

 

This is not even going sideways, it's just Mesa owned by someone else. Unless they decide to start tinkering with Boogie's design aesthetic, which would be dumb.

[GuardiansGuitar]

I talked to some Boogie insiders recently, and they are extremely jazzed about the future. The Gibson team seems passionate about music and doing the right thing, and they claim they will leave Boogie alone. Randy himself reportedly told Gibson, if you mess with the staff, they ARE Mesa/Boogie. In addition, Gibson will likely provide Boogie with the investment to do some great things for their own brand and Gibson custom amps, as well. The Gibson of today is NOT the Gibson of Henry J. I'm actually very excited about where this can all go.

[Caevan O’Shite]

I talked to some Boogie insiders recently, and they are extremely jazzed about the future. The Gibson team seems passionate about music and doing the right thing, and they claim they will leave Boogie alone. Randy himself reportedly told Gibson, if you mess with the staff, they ARE Mesa/Boogie. In addition, Gibson will likely provide Boogie with the investment to do some great things for their own brand and Gibson custom amps, as well. The Gibson of today is NOT the Gibson of Henry J. I'm actually very excited about where this can all go.

 

Good! Thanks!

[Larryz]

+1 Thanks for the info Guardians! I wish Gibson and Randy success with the venture...

[KuruPrionz]

I talked to some Boogie insiders recently, and they are extremely jazzed about the future. The Gibson team seems passionate about music and doing the right thing, and they claim they will leave Boogie alone. Randy himself reportedly told Gibson, if you mess with the staff, they ARE Mesa/Boogie. In addition, Gibson will likely provide Boogie with the investment to do some great things for their own brand and Gibson custom amps, as well. The Gibson of today is NOT the Gibson of Henry J. I'm actually very excited about where this can all go.

 

I hope for the best, thanks for some insight.

Both iconic brands, could be magic it gets going. Henry J had his moments - early 90's Les Paul Studios with the ebony fretboard are a treasure. I've owned a few of them but always end up with my 86 ES-335 Studio.

Those were not bad years for Gibson overall.

 

On the other hand, I started getting a bit wary of Mesa amps around the time they started using tiny switches. Those can be fairly fragile, my Express 5:25 was a great amp but it had too many tiny switches.

Well, thumbs up!

[CEB]

F*** Gibson. They are doing legal crap Henry"s regime wouldn"t have even thought about like legal harassment of my old friends at Hertitage for abiding by the 1984 spin off agreements. KKR are jerks. They control things now. We will know soon how this is going to roll.

[KuruPrionz]

F*** Gibson. They are doing legal crap Henry"s regime wouldn"t have even thought about like legal harassment of my old friends at Hertitage for abiding by the 1984 spin off agreements. KKR are jerks. They control things now. We will know soon how this is going to roll.

 

 

Ugh, they should just leave Heritage alone!!! A good friend collects Heritage guitars, they are excellent.

[hurricane hugo]

*bump* good review for their latest:   https://www.premierguitar.com/gear/reviews/mesa-boogie-mark-vii