AROIOS Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 I'm a sucker for tasteful dominant and (half-) diminished chords in Jazz, Blues and Gospel. This brother's explanation of "Churchy harmony" is a bit unconventional. But boy does it sound good. [video:youtube] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yannis D Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 Backing up preachers is an Art in itself and i always look with envy! These guys are born into this tradition, even the way they change chords under the voice is unique. Thanx for sharing Quote Be grateful for what you've got - a Nord, a laptop and two hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 Awesome job. On a side note. He"s using Midiculous from Gospel Musicians so we can see the notation and keys. Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 They always get away with inefficient fingering. Mostly the firth finger. That said their way of looking at the keyboard compared to Rock and pop guys is way different. Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docbop Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 It's the Jazz and Neo Soul sounds that have been moving into gospel for awhile now all those passing chords keep getting more sophisticated. Most learned keyboard from church developing their ears right from the beginning while watching others play. It's like how the early Jazz musicians learned it was all by listening and going back to the woodshed to emulate what they heard the night before. You hear about how the especially the old Jazz cats won't answer questions, it's not that they wouldn't they played you an answer. If you can't hear it then your ears aren't ready for it. Also they played answers because people came from different musical background that call thing different names, so if they play an answer then you can label however you want. Both Jazz and Gospel have the attitude is, if you can't hear you can't play it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 3, 2021 Author Share Posted January 3, 2021 Backing up preachers is an Art in itself and i always look with envy! These guys are born into this tradition, even the way they change chords under the voice is unique. Thanx for sharing Glad you enjoyed it Yannis. Given how bad Pop music has become over the last 25 years and how tone-deaf it had made the millenials and GenZ, I'm grateful for the musical standard Gospel folks managed to maintain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphollis Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 Thanks for sharing this. I'm adding these to my bag of tricks Quote Want to make your band better? Check out "A Guide To Starting (Or Improving!) Your Own Local Band" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 3, 2021 Author Share Posted January 3, 2021 Awesome job. On a side note. He"s using Midiculous from Gospel Musicians so we can see the notation and keys. Thanks Elmer. Jamal is a true blessing for us musicians and fans of Gospel music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 3, 2021 Author Share Posted January 3, 2021 It's the Jazz and Neo Soul sounds that have been moving into gospel for awhile now all those passing chords keep getting more sophisticated... For me personally, how much Jazz, R&B and Gospel influence each other is kind of a chicken and egg question. But the undeniable fact is how much our African brothers and sisters have contributed to the enrichment of traditional Western music. I'm forever grateful for the deeper soulful connection they helped create between me and music. ...If you can't hear it then your ears aren't ready for it. Also they played answers because people came from different musical background that call thing different names, so if they play an answer then you can label however you want. Both Jazz and Gospel have the attitude is, if you can't hear you can't play it. You nailed it on the importance of "hearing". The sounds and emotions they provoke are what ultimately matters, notations and theory are secondary and incidental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 3, 2021 Author Share Posted January 3, 2021 Thanks for sharing this. I'm adding these to my bag of tricks It's my pleasure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 Problem is with this genre is you have to live in this world and I have found they weren't guys that liked to share. Same with playing Caribbean music. You have to search it out and teach yourself at some point. Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 4, 2021 Author Share Posted January 4, 2021 Problem is with this genre is you have to live in this world and I have found they weren't guys that liked to share. Same with playing Caribbean music. You have to search it out and teach yourself at some point. I was complaining about the exact issue you had brought up, in another post earlier: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3067080/sorely-lacking-of-good-keyboard-courses#Post3067080 Besides the many valuable inputs from our forum members in that post, Gospelmusicians.com and Hearandplay.com are two excellent sources of Gospel learning materials. I've also noticed that with the growth of Youtube over the last 10 year, lots of Gospel cats have share their secret sauce online. The amount of Gospel education we can get from free Youtube videos is something I could only dream of 15 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill bosco Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 there's a ton of stuff out there on youtube , you've got to keep searching , keep listening , you come across stuff here and there , kind of like piecing it together , something that gives you some kind of foundation and you build on it , but yea, you've got to hear it alot , just like most other stuff , it's a folk music , handed down . and fueled by alot of passion , it's big part of it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 It is handed down and there is also a thing called cultural protectionism. I have experienced it a lot. Yes YouTube helps but like all instructional videos the application is the hardest and you have to play well enough to infuse it well. I have been on these forums for 20 years and very few gospel cats will post here if ever, It was the same on Harmony-Central in the early 2000's. People want that Gospel sound so bad, especially a lot of Rock keyboard players and it's just not that easy. Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 It is handed down and there is also a thing called cultural protectionism. People want that Gospel sound so bad, especially a lot of Rock keyboard players and it's just not that easy. It's really not cultural protectionism. As mentioned, Gospel music was handed down like early Jazz. Musicians learned it in the woodshed (church). Technology has opened the doors a bit. I wonder if Country music is culturally protected because I don't see too many "outsiders" playing it. Nashville has built an economy around Country music. Jazz, Blues, Rock, Funk, Soul, Reggae, Hip-Hop, etc., were "shared" or figured out and exploited by folks who didn't create it. The Gospel music in question is the only form of music that hasn't been shared, figured out, codified and exploited by others. Hopefully, it will never happen. IMO, Gospel musicians posting videos and tutorials mean well but they are doing themselves a huge disservice in the grand scheme of things. Quote PD "The greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love and be loved in return."--E. Ahbez "Nature Boy" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Yes I agree but there is very much culture protectionism in the Caribbean. I have also experienced in the Martial Arts after 41 years Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyMoe Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Thanks for sharing. Love it! Quote Montage 7, Mojo 61, PC-3, XK-3c Pro, Kronos 88, Hammond SK-1, Motif XF- 7, Hammond SK-2, Roland FR-1, FR-18, Hammond B3 - Blond, Hammond BV -Cherry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Williams Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 They always get away with inefficient fingering. Mostly the firth finger. Which finger is firth? Quote -Tom Williams {First Name} {at} AirNetworking {dot} com PC4-7, PX-5S, AX-Edge, PC361 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 fifth finger, you know what I meant. Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Yes I agree but there is very much culture protectionism in the Caribbean. I have also experienced in the Martial Arts after 41 years Rightfully so when you think about how that culture has been exploited and enriched others. For example, The Police, a Rock band made a fortune using Reggae music. Sting is probably worth more than Bob Marley's entire estate. The movie industry has made billions of dollars using Martial Arts. Fortunately, Asians have invested enough in that industry both directly and vertically to see a return on their investment. Usually, the creators of art, music, sport and entertainment do not reap the rewards exponentially of their talent and creativity. Rather than look at it as cultural protectionism, consider that it could be a form of self-preservation and heritage. Quote PD "The greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love and be loved in return."--E. Ahbez "Nature Boy" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MathOfInsects Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Rather than look at it as cultural protectionism, consider that it could be a form of self-preservation and heritage. ....Coupled with some sense of thwarted entitlement by a population that wishes to harvest that heritage as it wishes, and does not abide being reminded occasionally that it might lack the power to do so. Quote Now out! "Mind the Gap," a 24-song album of new material. www.joshweinstein.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threadslayer Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 They always get away with inefficient fingering. Mostly the firth finger. Which finger is firth? I honestly thought this was an intentional portmanteau word. If you count the thumb as the first finger then it's fifth, if you start with the index finger then it's fourth. Quote Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -Mark Twain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threadslayer Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Reading the comments about cultural protectionism and such, I'm reminded of some of the videos I've seen of little kids just playing their ass off in church. It seems like they learn it through their pores by osmosis, and may not know How to teach it, even if they wanted to. By contrast, the guy in the OP video seems to be a born teacher. Quote Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect. -Mark Twain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 They always get away with inefficient fingering. Mostly the firth finger. Which finger is firth? I honestly thought this was an intentional portmanteau word. If you count the thumb as the first finger then it's fifth, if you start with the index finger then it's fourth. Unless Madea is saying it, that still doesn't explain the typo. Quote PD "The greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love and be loved in return."--E. Ahbez "Nature Boy" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Lobo Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 ... when you think about how that culture has been exploited and enriched others. For example, The Police, a Rock band made a fortune using Reggae music. Sting is probably worth more than Bob Marley's entire estate. .And think of all the white rock stars who made a fortune using Black music. Quote These are only my opinions, not supported by any actual knowledge, experience, or expertise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 5, 2021 Author Share Posted January 5, 2021 Thanks for sharing. Love it! My pleasure, KeyMoe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AROIOS Posted January 5, 2021 Author Share Posted January 5, 2021 They always get away with inefficient fingering. Mostly the firth finger. Which finger is firth? This finger, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uhoh7 Posted January 5, 2021 Share Posted January 5, 2021 Problem is with this genre is you have to live in this world and I have found they weren't guys that liked to share. Same with playing Caribbean music. You have to search it out and teach yourself at some point. I was complaining about the exact issue you had brought up, in another post earlier: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3067080/sorely-lacking-of-good-keyboard-courses#Post3067080 Besides the many valuable inputs from our forum members in that post, Gospelmusicians.com and Hearandplay.com are two excellent sources of Gospel learning materials. I've also noticed that with the growth of Youtube over the last 10 year, lots of Gospel cats have share their secret sauce online. The amount of Gospel education we can get from free Youtube videos is something I could only dream of 15 years ago. Big fan of KC here, and I also joined gospelmusicians when I first got my RT3 organ. I have a pile of great videos from them. I'm nuts about the music which gets played all the time in Cogic Churches. Of course we all know about Cory Henry, who like a number of the great young players, learned from a very young age. Teaching the organ and piano is a serious and long developed business in this community. The roots of the COGIC church are very interesting and few are aware of the huge influence of William Seymour on 20th century Christianity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azusa_Street_Revival This was an integrated church, probably the first real one, which drew pilgrams from all over the world and founded Pentacostalism. By the late 20's the white side of the church led by Sister Aimee and others, began to segregate and these days the factions seem to sort by color to some degree, but the COGIC side welcomes everyone. They famously censored Mattie Clark for her appearance on the grammys, and forbade her to do so going forward. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Clark_Sisters Before the grammy appearance: [video:youtube] Both Mattie and her daughter Twinkie was/is awesome on the Hammond. The controversy was about commercializing gospel music though, not about race. In the 60's letting your work be heard in advertising was taboo for any self-respecting musician, of any color. How far we have fallen. The Cogic church was in the core of the civil rights movement in the 60's. The Clark sisters at Aretha Franklin's funeral Celebration in 2018: [video:youtube] Eddie Brown is another incredibly impressive musican and teacher deep in this tradition: [video:youtube] Like Barry Harris, Eddie Brown grew up steeped in Detroit gospel music. Barry went "commercial", but at his core you see the great organ playing music teachers of the African American Churches. Bach's day job, really. Use that organ to make the choir ring. Now I need to go spin my tonewheel Quote RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2 Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4 MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nadroj Posted January 6, 2021 Share Posted January 6, 2021 During a livestream Q&A I once asked Cory Henry how to get into proper gospel harmony and music when you"ve absolutely no access to that culture or background, and his reply was simply: 'Go to YouTube.' 'Skilledmusician' does excellent free streams and lessons on his channel. Some an hour + long. I"ve found them to be the most helpful, practical and accessible so far, but there"s so much good stuff all over YouTube. Also, just listening. I picked so much up transcribing Billy Preston and George Duke. Quote Hammond SKX Mainstage 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzpiano88 Posted January 6, 2021 Share Posted January 6, 2021 During a livestream Q&A I once asked Cory Henry how to get into proper gospel harmony and music when you"ve absolutely no access to that culture or background, and his reply was simply: 'Go to YouTube.' 'Skilledmusician' does excellent free streams and lessons on his channel. Some an hour + long. I"ve found them to be the most helpful, practical and accessible so far, but there"s so much good stuff all over YouTube. Also, just listening. I picked so much up transcribing Billy Preston and George Duke. For me, it's all about listening. You hear the tri-tone without knowing what a tri-tone is. The theory is just a means to describe what's going on and is not needed (nor was it used when Gospel was created). Quote J a z z P i a n o 8 8 -- Yamaha C7D Montage8 | CP300 | CP4 | SK1-73 | OB6 | Seven K8.2 | 3300 | CPSv.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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