YAMAHA

[Muad’Dib]

Sort of like the time I wanted too look at the KORG Wavestation and was steered towards the Yamaha SY-22!

[Song80s]

I have had a number of salesmen steer me towards Yamaha, even though I was never really enamored with them. It"s that since the DX-7 onwards. The design hasn"t changed much. From the SY line, the Motif, Montage MO. Then there was the S-Series of keyboards. Oh sure, they, had the AN1X the CS1x CS2X and CS6X, plus the VL-7. Plus a few that fell by the wayside. The V-50 and EX5 and 7. Although the released the Reface series similar to the Boutiques from Roland. But I haven"t really seen anything that made me go WOW! That"s a synth!

 

Then again, they are designed for the gigging musician.

 

As a multi track song writer, I find the MODX to be an exciting partner.

 

I am new to it, but I would guess many songs were inspired, composed on a Motif [ SEQ}, then finished off in a DAW or in a expensive recording studio.

[Outkaster]

I think after owning the S-80, S90 and S90 XS I can say that they are pretty consistent. Their high end pianos are even getting a lot of acceptance in the classical world a tuner was telling me.

[Docbop]

I'm new to piano coming decades of guitar, bass, and working other side of the glass in audio world, from that always view Yamaha as the top of the line gear. Now that I'm moved into the piano world my view of Yamaha is all over the place. As someone else said their lower tier stuff is excellent and lot of bang for the buck I started my piano journey on a P35? and keys were a good size and feel to me for starting. Then got my first good piano a Roland RD-2000 and love the keyboard on that as well as all the sounds. Now I want to get a workstation to do some creating tracks, getting more into synth side, and have different sounds than my RD-2000. I doing my research it boiled down to Yamaha and Korg. One person I talk to who owns both Montage and Kronos puts it the Kronos is his deserted island board it does everything it is a recording studio in one board, but has a huge learning curve to go with it. The Yamaha comments about Montage and other Yamahas is the keyboard sounds aren't as good as others, but they sounds of other acoustic instrument is fantastic. I know Yamaha makes everything but piano are a big part of their business so I find it odd people say their sounds all need to be tweaked to sound good. Then the keybed aren't that great. My local GC they have a MODX8 only workstation board they have so I've played it a number of times including two weeks ago (my first time to GC since the pandemic) and the keybed left a lot to be desired to me and people say it it much better than the keybed of the MODX 6 and 7. Once the pandemic calms down again I plan to drive into Hollywood and try a Montage to check out it's keybeds as well as other brands.

 

So the Yamaha name is no longer an automatic "they're great" anymore for me. In general they do still seem to be good values along with Roland and Korg. Nord is so expensive in the US hard to include in the comparison great products but you going to be paying the price for them. I will say for the money the MODX is a great value especially if you're using more for composing and part of a rig with multiple keys and controlling it with another keybed.

 

Still being a noob I am learning that when reading comments about workstations and keyboard gear in general really need to know what the persons use model is. Discovering a keybed good to a "composer" type user and to a "pianist" user are very different. Also those that want to sound design on gear versus ones that use the built-in sounds and tweak them. Last my RD-2000 was a good choice it really is a good stage piano but also a good controller board with all it's in's and out's.

 

So that's my noobi

e view of Yamaha in the year 2020.

[Mr. Nightime]

The primary thing I did not like about my MM8 was the method to access the different sounds. Lets say that I was on AP, and wanted to go to an EP. Unless I had a preset created, I would have to press buttons and turn dials to get to the sound I wanted. There was no way to just call up a patch number, And since I always had the display covered by my Hammond, it made it a very time consuming and inexact process.

 

Yes, it has really good sounds, but they are too difficult to access in live performance.

 

One of the reasons I chose the Kurzweil PC4 is there are multiple ways to access the sounds, You can easily set up a default sound for each category, you can set up lists where one button, or pedal press, and you go to another sound in the list, or you can punch in the patch number.

 

If something like that had been possible with the MM8, I would have been a really happy guy.

 

On a separate note, I bought a Yamaha board, and the cover on the power supply transformer came off. So now I have to break out the Gorilla Glue to fix it.

[Song80s]

I'. I know Yamaha makes everything but piano are a big part of their business

 

so I find it odd people say their sounds all need to be tweaked to sound good. Then the keybed aren't that great. My local GC they have a MODX8 only workstation board they have so I've played it a number of times including two weeks ago (my first time to GC since the pandemic) and the keybed left a lot to be desired to me and people say it it much better than the keybed of the MODX 6 and 7. 0.

 

I don't fuss much over opinion collecting, since opinions tend to be subjective,

and possibly whatever the issue is, is not a big deal, or a deal breaker.

 

MODX sounds , pianos are a little bright, with a touch too much reverb. Thats a 3 second tweak.

I suspect those are the facts you have read, and its not a big deal to tweak instruments on these expensive keyboards.

 

There is nothing essentially wrong with the MODX 8 key bed. It has a somewhat light feel for an 88. Again ,

there are varied opinions about dislike.

 

The MODX8 key bed is similar in feel to my Kronos 88 RH3.

I didn't say exactly the same. In the same ball park.

I wouldn't worry about after touch, since you are new to this stuff.

 

I had to adapt to the RH3 nine years ago. I have adapted to the MODX 8 key bed.

 

I don't mind some key bed adaptation. I don't need another controller as that becomes un wieldy.

 

Since you are a beginner, I think you are diving into a lot of complexity .

Both MODX and Kronos are big elephants to eat.

 

You might consider a simpler start, and be happy with that for 1 or 2 years.

 

Thats my standard recommendation for anyone new to keyboard w/s or

'performance synthesizers '.

[AnotherScott]

I started my piano journey on a P35? and keys were a good size and feel to me for starting...My local GC they have a MODX8 only workstation board they have so I've played it a number of times including two weeks ago (my first time to GC since the pandemic) and the keybed left a lot to be desired to me

The MODX8 uses the same kind of action (GHS) as the P35, though it does seem that that action itself can feel different from one model to another. But it is their entry level hammer action, and something that (as you put it) feels fine for someone starting, and also has the virtue of yielding a board with light travel weight. It is not surprising that you preferred the action of the RD2000... a higher end, more expensive (and heavier) design. But to compare apples to apples, the Roland that best competes with the MODX8 would be the FA08, and it is less clear who has the better action at that point. The Korg would be the Krome EX, ditto. Whether Yamaha's actions at a given price point for a given type of board functionality are better or worse than their competitors is subjective, but they are at least competitive.

 

and people say {the MODX8 keybed is} much better than the keybed of the MODX 6 and 7.

Not true. It's like saying a hammer is better than a screwdriver. Well, it depends on what you're trying to do. The hammer is a better hammer than the backside of a screwdriver, but is far worse for putting in screws. Similarly, the MODX8 action is better than the 6 and 7 if you're playing piano on it, but far worse than the 6 and 7 if you're playing organ on it. It's not a matter of better or worse, then, it that it's an entirely different design, better for some things, worse for others. You can't compare hammer actions like the 8 to non-hammer actions like the 6/7 and simply say one is better or worse than the other.

 

Now I want to get a workstation to do some creating tracks, getting more into synth side, and have different sounds than my RD-2000. I doing my research it boiled down to Yamaha and Korg.

Will you be keeping the RD-2000, and using both boards? Or will you be selling/trading in the Roland?

 

ETA: For "creating tracks, getting more into synth side" the Kronos is probably the board of choice here. The Yamahas and other Korgs will lag the Kronos either on the sequencer side or the synth side.

[Bif_]

I would guess many songs were inspired, composed on a Motif [ SEQ}, then finished off in a DAW or in a expensive recording studio.

 

I recently did exactly this process, working out the song on the Motif then recording on my Tascam digital recorder. This enabled tweaking the sequenced parts then adding some live tracks from my Forte and Receptor. First time I tried it and that's how I'll record my next song. Great process and result.

 

 

ETA: For "creating tracks, getting more into synth side" the Kronos is probably the board of choice here. The Yamahas and other Korgs will lag the Kronos either on the sequencer side or the synth side.

 

While I have no direct experience with the Kronos sequencer I've seen enough to know that it's a good tool. If you want to spend some infuriating time learning something, the Motif sequencer will do the trick. While it's very powerful, it is not intuitive. Fairly steep learning curve. When I first got it, I marveled that it lacked some features of the sequencer I had on my Ensoniq VFX (far older tech). One example of the 'logic' used is that some editing functions appear in 'song' mode, but not 'pattern' mode, and vice versa. Badmister's (Yamaha Guru Phil Clendeninn on the Motifator site) explanation was that you could easily transfer data from song mode to pattern mode to accomplish the needed task. While that was true, it required extra steps and isn't intuitive and is even a bit cumbersome.

 

Yamaha's slogan should be 'Designed by Engineers, For Engineers'.

[Song80s]

I would guess many songs were inspired, composed on a Motif [ SEQ}, then finished off in a DAW or in a expensive recording studio.

 

I recently did exactly this process, working out the song on the Motif then recording on my Tascam digital recorder. This enabled tweaking the sequenced parts then adding some live tracks from my Forte and Receptor. First time I tried it and that's how I'll record my next song. Great process and result.

 

 

ETA: For "creating tracks, getting more into synth side" the Kronos is probably the board of choice here. The Yamahas and other Korgs will lag the Kronos either on the sequencer side or the synth side.

 

While I have no direct experience with the Kronos sequencer I've seen enough to know that it's a good tool. If you want to spend some infuriating time learning something, the Motif sequencer will do the trick. While it's very powerful, it is not intuitive. Fairly steep learning curve. When I first got it, I marveled that it lacked some features of the sequencer I had on my Ensoniq VFX (far older tech). One example of the 'logic' used is that some editing functions appear in 'song' mode, but not 'pattern' mode, and vice versa. Badmister's (Yamaha Guru Phil Clendeninn on the Motifator site) explanation was that you could easily transfer data from song mode to pattern mode to accomplish the needed task. While that was true, it required extra steps and isn't intuitive and is even a bit cumbersome.

 

Yamaha's slogan should be 'Designed by Engineers, For Engineers'.

 

good to read of a keyboard regular that is successful at the craft of recording a full on song.

 

Everything you said about Motif/MODX is accurate.

 

The Kronos SEQ is my song writing partner, and I have created/recorded 80 songs, 100% Kronos and its SEQ.

I am pleased with the recording quality, and the work flow is very comfortable, of course, since I have 3 yrs

recording on it. And 9 years owing Kronos.

 

MODX recording/creating work flow is very different but I don't mind.

I have a MODX buddy who is coaching me thru the hoops/learning curve.

 

Yamaha has done a very good job providing a recording environment.

[Mighty Motif Max]

I grew up with a Yamaha Clavinova at age 2, then a nicer one from age 5. My first gigging board was a cheap Yamaha, and my current main keyboard is a flagship Yamaha (Motif XF8). I also use instruments from Roland, Korg, and Kurzweil. Here's what I will say about Yamaha and why I prefer them for my main board. It's mainly about sound quality - I have routinely heard for years that when I'm playing with a band and using my Motif that people either think that there are other musicians present playing strings/brass/orchestral/bass/bell/guitar stuff, or that we are using backing tracks with real instruments. I often use electric bass - Yamaha is the only brand that, in my opinion, has actually gotten a pretty nice result for electric bass sounds. Even their $549 MX49 smokes my Korg Krome and Kurzweil PC3, not to mention the Kronos and FA-series, when it comes to pads, bass, and guitar patches. If I'm going to be playing non-piano instruments live, as I often do and have fun doing, I don't want them to be distinguishable from the real thing. That defeats the point IMO. Yamaha's professional soundsets get me 95% of the way there, even if I have to play in mono. Their sounds are recognizable as the instruments they're supposed to be, and a lot of people can't tell the difference. Even if I'm playing some obscure tambura part or other ethnic instruments. To me, they only have two holes in their soundset - really good orchestral sounds (Kurzweil has the best IMO), and Hammond B3 organs. Everything else is pretty good, and can be supplemented by third-party libraries if needed.

 

I know I'm in the minority here, but I prefer Yamaha's user interface to any other brand. It can take a bit to learn, but in their high-end boards, you will find that there is very little that you actually can't do. And they make really good controllers. They also have a good service department, and have really good customer service as well, something I can't say for Roland.

 

So basically, to sum it up, their soundset sounds authentic live, they have great service and customer service departments, and on the high-end models, really high-quality components.

[Mighty Motif Max]

One person I talk to who owns both Montage and Kronos puts it the Kronos is his deserted island board it does everything it is a recording studio in one board, but has a huge learning curve to go with it. The Yamaha comments about Montage and other Yamahas is the keyboard sounds aren't as good as others, but they sounds of other acoustic instrument is fantastic. I know Yamaha makes everything but piano are a big part of their business so I find it odd people say their sounds all need to be tweaked to sound good.

 

The desert island comment is probably because Korg didn't scrap their recording features and sequencer in the Kronos, unlike Yamaha with the Montage.

 

It's interesting what you say about the keyboard sounds on Yamaha boards. As much of a Yamaha guy as I am, I am not fond of the new CFX and Bosendorfer pianos that Yamaha put in the Montage and MODX. They have a bizarre metallic bite at high velocities that really makes them less-realistic than the previous-generation S6 and CFIII pianos used in the Motif XF. I'm not sure what route Yamaha has been trying to take with those. It's like they took a page out of Korg's playbook, as my issue with Korg pianos was always the dynamic realism. But going from the last generation Yamaha boards, they were pretty good. Yamaha clavinets are still the best of the "big five" (Yamaha, Korg, Roland, Nord, Kurzweil) in my opinion, at least live. Their electric pianos aren't bad; Korg is better with the Kronos and even the Krome for Rhodes, but Yamaha is better for Wurlitzers. It comes down to the velocity switching on the Yamaha Rhodes patches. Yamaha's organs have a really decent base drawbar tone, but their rotary simulation is somewhat lacking in the factory presets. It can be improved with tweaking and/or third-party patches, but it's still not quite as strong as Kurzweil or Korg.

 

Otherwise their acoustic instruments are really great, though Kurzweil wins for some orchestral/broadway type stuff (as expected). Other than Yamaha and Kurzweil, other brands don't have as good of a handle on non-keyboard sounds.

[uhoh7]

Yamaha is a strange outfit, almost nothing they don't make.

 

What has put me off Yamaha electronic instruments is learning the "Yammicepts". They don't help much with other instruments.

 

I crave a Genos, I admit. Lucklily they are too expensive, and like the Montage, the hardware is 2012.

 

While I'm not a apple fan, being asked to sign once too many times, they do put the latest hardware in their phones. Yamaha's latest penny pinching penchant is forget to install aftertouch on either MODx or YC61, which shows no actual players are involved in feature set design approval.

 

"Aftertouch? That's another $20 bucks! My bonus!"

[EscapeRocks]

They"re not Roland.

 

 

I take it your not a fan of Roland?

They lost a life long fan and customer when they refused to sell me a new pitch bend assembly for the one that failed in my VR09. They no longer sell parts to the general public. Every Roland I own has some piece or part that is broken and the only choice to fix them with new parts is to pay shipping for the whole synth, both ways to and from a 'certified' Roland repair shop and pay them half the worth of the unit or more to replace a simple $50 piece.

 

Admittedly Roland has some desirable instruments, but I"ve actively avoided all Roland purchases for the last seven years. I will likely NEVER buy another Roland unless they revert their policy so their customers can buy new parts for their products that arguably have defective design.

 

Yeah, this is a stupid policy, especially those of us with very old boards. I needed the same pitch bend assembly for my old Fantom X6 they I bought used. They wouldn't sell me one, and said I had to take ti to the local authorized Roland service center (at $80/hr).

 

Fine. I found one at Syntaur for 45 (at the time), and replaced it myself.

 

Roland claims they do this to prevent us from opening the boards and seeing proprietary stuff (bullshit)...

[Markyboard]

 

Roland claims they do this to prevent us from opening the boards and seeing proprietary stuff (bullshit)...

 

What? So now they own the market on screwdrivers as well?

[EscapeRocks]

from Roland's site

 

PLEASE NOTE: Due to liability and intellectual property protection reasons, parts requiring internal access to our products are not available direct to consumers and must be installed by an

 

Roland Authorized service center.

 

It wasn't always like this. I used to be be able to order parts directly that couldn't be found elsewhere.

[Markyboard]

from Roland's site

 

PLEASE NOTE: Due to liability and intellectual property protection reasons, parts requiring internal access to our products are not available direct to consumers and must be installed by an

 

Roland Authorized service center.

 

It wasn't always like this. I used to be be able to order parts directly that couldn't be found elsewhere.

 

Oh I remember and I knew they changed their policy a while ago. I just wasn't aware it had anything to do with intellectual property.

 

They give themselves way to much credit.

[ProfD]

As I mentioned in the poll thread, I have owned more Yamaha KBs than any other manufacturer. Their KBs always seemed to hit the right spot musically.

 

Admittedly, a Yammy KB is no longer my go to for EPs. But, I do have some FM in my spice rack. I can sprinkle that sh8t on anything and make it sound great.

[Bif_]

 

good to read of a keyboard regular that is successful at the craft of recording a full on song.

 

 

Here's your chance to be the judge of that. Breezin' Through

[StanC]

They"re not Roland.

:like:

[Song80s]

 

good to read of a keyboard regular that is successful at the craft of recording a full on song.

 

 

Here's your chance to be the judge of that. Breezin' Through

 

yes ! Nice chord work and stellar recording. In the pocket every measure. Those Motif pianos and other instruments sound superb.

 

Here is my Soundcloud profile/spotlight;

 

 

I have my own hybrid approach. Originals doesn't fall into the usual generic categories.

100% Kronos.

[Muad’Dib]

I found out a lot of famous people use a Yamaha grand piano. Elvis did, John Lennon, Elton John, Paul McCartney etc..

[Docbop]

I found out a lot of famous people use a Yamaha grand piano. Elvis did, John Lennon, Elton John, Paul McCartney etc..

 

A lot of recording studio do to, because their bright punchy sound records really well. Same with rock musicians for live the Yamaha sound mic's up well and cuts thru with a band.

[Bobby Simons]

Probably not helpful to anyone, but since I've returned to almost exclusive piano playing/practice, I spend all my time either upstairs on the P-515 that I got about a year ago, or downstairs on my KX88 that I got in the mid eighties. I'm pretty content on either.

[cp-the-nerd]

Yamaha is a jack of all trades manufacturer and they have a solid reputation in pretty much everything. Anyone who says nothing from the whole brand appeals to them probably didn't look hard enough. They're not my favorite brand (and I didn't vote for them in the poll), but yamaha products always find their way into my searches because they're good products.

 

I'd love to get a YC-61 to replace my clunky old YPG (which served me well for a long time), and it's going to be a coin flip between getting a yamaha or mackie mixer for my rig. With that said, hardcore brand loyalty would be a bizarre thing for a keyboard player, you're just handicapping yourself. IMO the more brand variety in a rig the better because all of them have different specialties and sounds.

[AnotherScott]

Yamaha grand pianos have long been very widely respected. Not just because of quality, but also because of consistency. Traditionally, if you shopped for, say, a Steinway, you'd want to play the EXACT unit you were getteing, because even while a certain model might tend to have a certain character, each Steinway was a little different. With Yamaha, you could say "get me a C7" and you'd know exactly what you'd be getting, because every C7 was virtually identical.

[Mr. Nightime]

After 20 years of faithful service, my Mackie mixer finally failed.

 

I bought a Yamaha

[Marzzz]

Yamaha grand pianos have long been very widely respected. Not just because of quality, but also because of consistency. Traditionally, if you shopped for, say, a Steinway, you'd want to play the EXACT unit you were getteing, because even while a certain model might tend to have a certain character, each Steinway was a little different. With Yamaha, you could say "get me a C7" and you'd know exactly what you'd be getting, because every C7 was virtually identical.

That"s both a positive and a negative. I certainly like the consistency of the Yamaha, but after playing several Steinways, finding the right one and then tweaking it to perfection is sublime.