OT: H.E.R. SNL

[EscapeRocks]

Now that we've gone down this rabbit hole, I leave with this final thought:

 

 

Why can't I just not like a song simply because I don't like it? Then when asked why, I'm tacitly told I'm wrong, and we go deeper and deeper down the hole until we hit things like misogyny, race, critic's age (get off my lawn), musically stunted/uneducated.

 

As far as HER, is she talented? Sure. The music is not bad, it just doesn't move me. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Adan]

 

 

Why can't I just not like a song simply because I don't like it?

 

You can, and it's easy. All you have to do is first demonstrate through a double-blinded test that had you not known the identity, age, race, gender, and hair products preferences of the artist, you would have felt exactly the same way.

[GovernorSilver]

it seems indistinguishable from well, Pop - albeit with Japanese lyrics. Did I miss something profound?

 

I watch a fair amount of anime, and so that's how I found the J-pop tunes I like. Nothing profound about the process. There's a lot of music in those shows, and only a minority portion of it actually gets stuck in my ear for some reason or another.

 

Here are some of those tunes that stuck. Some I like for the vocals, some I like for the chord progressions, some I like for the hooks - same reasons no doubt people in the US like US pop hits. The last one is straight up Beatles influenced but I find the imperfect English and wordplay to be quite endearing. I don't claim any of them to be deeper than any US pop tune:

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

[MAJUSCULE]

Anyway, the point is, you could substitute "the 3 chord song" for "sex" and it would be just as true.

 

From where I'm posting, a better analogy would be "every generation hates it when the next generation plays a three chord song because they forget how many three chord songs they danced to when they were just dancing and not posting on an internet forum".

 

Now that we've gone down this rabbit hole, I leave with this final thought:

 

 

Why can't I just not like a song simply because I don't like it? Then when asked why, I'm tacitly told I'm wrong, and we go deeper and deeper down the hole until we hit things like misogyny, race, critic's age (get off my lawn), musically stunted/uneducated.

 

As far as HER, is she talented? Sure. The music is not bad, it just doesn't move me. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

I agree with this for the most part, and again, would much rather people stick to debating musical elements. We could analyze each post in the thread and split hairs over how much her identity skews each of our opinions positively or negatively and whatever. It would be silly to not acknowledge that we all have internal biases aplenty guiding us through the world and our own personal interpretation of it. It would also be silly not to acknowledge the reality of the music industry today, particularly from a multimedia experience standpoint. Without trying to jab at you or anything, just read your own posts in the thread. I'd say the second one is more signal, the first is a little moreso in the noise category. Just my personal feeling.

[marino]

Why can't I just not like a song simply because I don't like it?

 

Thank

you.

 

You can, and it's easy. All you have to do is first demonstrate through a double-blinded test that had you not known the identity, age, race, gender, and hair products preferences of the artist, you would have felt exactly the same way.

 

I can't easily 'demonstrate' it obviously, but I'm 300% sure that I would.

[MathOfInsects]

Every.

 

Time.

[Mykhailo]

[GovernorSilver]

A couple more J-pop tunes i like - from the soundtrack to a show called "Ristorante Paradiso". Both are more jazz-influenced

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

[ProfD]

This thread has gone off road and into the woods. Nothing left to see here.

[GovernorSilver]

Here's the video that introduced me to H.E.R

 

[video:youtube]

[TommyRude]

ughhh my apologies folks. I posted this song because I really liked it, and I thought others might be interested. Was not expecting this to devolve, dang

[stillearning]

ughhh my apologies folks. I posted this song because I really liked it, and I thought others might be interested. Was not expecting this to devolve, dang

No apologies necessary from my perspective. It was a legit post. Pity it went south.

[Jim Alfredson]

H.E.R. is bad-ass.

 

[video:youtube]

[Jim Alfredson]

Her keyboardist is SNEAKY. Listen to what he's playing above. Hyper-focusing on the number of chords is entirely missing the point.

[zxcvbnm098]

ughhh my apologies folks. I posted this song because I really liked it, and I thought others might be interested. Was not expecting this to devolve, dang

 

I'm happy you did. Love her stuff......

[zxcvbnm098]

Her keyboardist is SNEAKY. Listen to what he's playing above. Hyper-focusing on the number of chords is entirely missing the point.

 

GREAT adjective to describe his sublime playing. Great stuff....

[stoken6]

I love the Tiny Desk vibe - will catch this later.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[GovernorSilver]

Agreed, Jim - great Tiny Desk set.

[Adan]

Her keyboardist is SNEAKY. Listen to what he's playing above. Hyper-focusing on the number of chords is entirely missing the point.

 

I noticed that myself on first listen. He's using the simple harmonic structure as a blank canvas and everything he does is masterful and inspired. Very different vibe than the SNL performance, and for obvious reasons.

 

I would just point out that much of the discussion in this thread was about songwriting, not performance embellishment. Changing the focus is perfectly cool, but let's acknowledge that's what we're doing.

 

I don't myself understand how the conversation became so freighted and tense. It should be possible to discuss these things without questioning peoples motives and biases (racial, gender, or otherwise). I thought that's what music forums were for. Maybe I was wrong.

[ProfD]

I don't myself understand how the conversation became so freighted and tense. It should be possible to discuss these things without questioning peoples motives and biases (racial, gender, or otherwise). I thought that's what music forums were for. Maybe I was wrong..

Brotha Adan, you're not wrong. Music forums should be open discussion even if opinions differ.

 

Just like politics and religion, discussions that devolve into race, gender, class, culture, etc., become a slippery slope.

[Paughrock]

 

I don't myself understand how the conversation became so freighted and tense. It should be possible to discuss these things without questioning peoples motives and biases (racial, gender, or otherwise). I thought that's what music forums were for. Maybe I was wrong.

 

It became freighted and tense because there are two, (possibly three) people in this thread who choose to respond to any reference to gender, race, or culture as if some mighty gauntlet of injustice is being thrown down. If you"re not allowed to talk about these things in music anymore, then I"ll gladly take your Patti Smith, Nina Simone, Kendrick Lamar, Public Enemy, Bob Marley, Peter Tosh, Elvis Costello, Bob Dylan, and Joni Mitchell records in a charitable attempt to spare you from the trauma that those records may impart upon your delicate ears.

 

There would be a whole lot of amazing music never made if musicians were too afraid to talk about these things back in the day....The virtue signallers on this thread make it impossible to have any kind of meaningful discussions, as they create a complete climate of fear. If you can"t talk about how gender, race and class have an influence on music, in a music forum, well, enjoy life in the gulag. Maybe that"s why we"re not really seeing any genuine protest music being made any longer. Young artists are simply too afraid of being cancelled lest they write something deemed too offensive.

 

Good times...

[AnotherScott]

virtue signallers

Funny, I had never heard of that phrase, until I saw it on a placard yesterday and wondered what it meant... and here it is again!

 

But your post in general reminds of the periodic posts (not so much here, but elsewhere) that musicians should just entertain and stay out of politics. Tell that to the 60s. And what a bizarre thought that art of ANY type should be devoid of controversial statement. Making a statement is often the point.

[Adan]

Interesting conversation, even if it has strayed far from the original topic. I would just point out that there are two very different things being discussed and maybe inappropriately intermingled. One is objectivity of music critique. Can/should a statement about the merits of a piece of music be evaluated in isolation from the identity and political/cultural perspective of the person making that statement? I think there's two sides to that argument and probably tomes that could be written about it.

 

The second thing being discussed is whether it's appropriate for the subject matter of a piece of music to address controversial topics about race, gender, culture, etc. That topic somehow popped up in this thread, but I'm not sure it is even contested. Does anyone here think music should only serve to entertain and never to comment.

 

My point is, I don't think these issues have to be linked together, and linking them together might just create more confusion than clarity.

[Paughrock]

agreed re:combining of two points could make confusion.

[AnotherScott]

One is objectivity of music critique. Can/should a statement about the merits of a piece of music be evaluated in isolation from the identity and political/cultural perspective of the person making that statement?

Also, the merits of a piece, and whether or not you personally like it, are not necessarily the same. Similarly, compositional sophistication is not always what someone is going for, a simple piece can have other merits.

 

On a personal level, I don't really care about music critique/analysis per se. First I determine whether I like something. Then I can analyze it and explain the likely reason I find it appealing or not, but I realize even that is based on my own personal preferences, rather than on some kind of theoretical objective of what defines quality.

 

The second thing being discussed is whether it's appropriate for the subject matter of a piece of music to address controversial topics about race, gender, culture, etc. That topic somehow popped up in this thread, but I'm not sure it is even contested. Does anyone here think music should only serve to entertain and never to comment.

 

My point is, I don't think these issues have to be linked together, and linking them together might just create more confusion than clarity.

Sorry, I didn't mean to derail, I was just saying that it reminded me of conversations elsewhere on that other topic. We can ignore it now. ;-)

[Paughrock]

Interesting Can/should a statement about the merits of a piece of music be evaluated in isolation from the identity and political/cultural perspective of the person making that statement? .

 

[video:youtube]

[TommyRude]

Enjoyed that, although I kept hearing the theme from Brokeback Mountain:

Nice one Moonglow!

 

It's probably just my perception, but to me that performance for some reason just doesn't feel "locked in" and I can't put my finger on why. It just feels like some elements of the groove are trying to pull ahead time wise.....to me it seems to have a nervous feel a lot of the time.....

I know what you mean area51... I think it's on purpose. It's part of what hooked me, kind of like "what's that? What happened there?" Just a little bit off, and then coming back together, then off a bit again. Perhaps the studio version will solve that mystery.