ASM HydraSynth 1.5 update available.

[Zalman Stern]

https://www.ashunsoundmachines.com/post/new-1-5-os-now-available

 

"This is a major update with many new features including many new filter types, support for microtuning, a distortion effect, expanded Step LFO's, MIDI CC control map and many more."

 

-Z-

[ElmerJFudd]

These guys aren"t messing around. An amazing first effort. If I was hot for a digital it would be my first pick. They hit a great price point, too.

[Dave Bryce]

Cool! I'm on it.

 

Thanks, Zalman!

 

dB

[Stokely]

If there was any chance for an upcoming live gig I might consider this. It would be at the expense of organ, as it would be in tandem with my modx7....long-term, I could see a final rig of nord stage compact and this guy (or a prophet).

[MikeT156]

I must be one of the few people that do not care for the sound of this synth. It sounds "too digital" to me. I may get flamed for my opinion, but it wouldn't be the first time.

 

Too each his own.

[Stokely]

I think that was everyone's first impression, since most of the demos were wavetable-based strange sounds...it was almost as if, why make boring old sawtooth sounds when you can do the crazy stuff

 

Later demos though started convincing me otherwise, though I have never actually heard/played one in person. I'm pretty sure it could do the analog thing well enough for my live needs, not so sure for a studio person looking for a really vintage tone (maybe others here could address.)

[psionic11]

If you focus on just the classic analog waveforms (saw, pulse), the Hydrasynth can get very decent Roland and Oberheim sounds.

 

It naturally has a bright, strident, confident sounds, but there are plenty of tools to make it what you want. Sound designer's paradise.

 

But if you need sounds now, there are quite a few preset packs available. Major OSC has done some nice ones, among others.

[synthetic]

I had the same first impression, but it keeps getting better and the demos have won me over. I love the oscillator mangling you can do before sound hits the filters, and I've always wanted something that could get PPG/VS tones. The filter demos I've heard aren't blowing me away but don't sound bad either. (This thing with analog filters and an extra octave would have been killer but also double the price.) This is going to be the first new (not vintage) synth I've bought in over 20 years.

[psionic11]

I agree that the Hydrasynth has a certain digital quality that is hard to shake. Here are 3 versions of 1984, on the Hydrasynth, on the Prophet Rev2, and on the Kronos. Notice how on the HS version the low note rezz sweeps cap out at the top (couldn't get it to go any higher). Also notice when the song gets to the high E major chord on the analog strings, how it's harsh and a bit unpleasant to listen to... there's just something about the intonation of the HS that is harsh.* Because the HS doesn't restrain the sound designer into just sweet spots, there are plenty of yucky sounds you can get out of it, and the full spectrum, piercingly high digital end is one of those danger zones.

 

In this HS demo, I tried to tame the high end by putting the Lo-Fi Decimator at the end of the chain (low pass filter, 6.9kHz cutoff, 22kHz sample rate). That gives it the slightly boxy effect, but believe me, the high end sizzle of the low rezz part is now much easier on the ears.

 

1984 Hydra

 

Now for a direct comparison to another digital synth, here's 1984 on the Kronos. The upper analog strings were almost an afterthought here, as I wanted to emphasize the low end rezz part. But notice how overall there is a sweetness to the sound that the HS lacks.

 

1984 Kronos

 

Finally, here's an analog version on the Prophet Rev2 doing the low rezz part. Even though it has the same Curtis chips as the original OB-Xa had, it doesn't quite nail the sound, much as I tried.

 

1984 Rev2

 

Here's the original for reference. Notice the voice count cutoffs due to polyphony.

 

[video:youtube]

 

 

 

 

* Although the new microtonal options are great (and you can import your own!), they didn't include what I'd consider to be more common sense tunings -- like Just major or minor chords in any key other than C, stretch tuning options, and any of the well-tempered tunings like Werkmeister. There's something about the raw, loud tones that are grating and ultimately fatiguing to the ear. Thankfully the Hydrasynth is such a deeply programmable and flexible synth that you can work to minimize the tuning issues and instead focus on its strengths.

[DrSynth]

I agree that the Hydrasynth has a certain digital quality that is hard to shake. Here are 3 versions of 1984, on the Hydrasynth, on the Prophet Rev2, and on the Kronos. Notice how on the HS version the low note rezz sweeps cap out at the top (couldn't get it to go any higher). Also notice when the song gets to the high E major chord on the analog strings, how it's harsh and a bit unpleasant to listen to... there's just something about the intonation of the HS that is harsh.* Because the HS doesn't restrain the sound designer into just sweet spots, there are plenty of yucky sounds you can get out of it, and the full spectrum, piercingly high digital end is one of those danger zones.

 

In this HS demo, I tried to tame the high end by putting the Lo-Fi Decimator at the end of the chain (low pass filter, 6.9kHz cutoff, 22kHz sample rate). That gives it the slightly boxy effect, but believe me, the high end sizzle of the low rezz part is now much easier on the ears.

 

1984 Hydra

 

Personally I wouldn't use the LoFi Decimator for taming the 'edge'. I've found the Hydrasynth 'analogs up' better using warm mode & the Drive pre-filter (in the range of 50-75), then using the EQ at the end of the chain. With a little wrestling I can get it very close to the Montage in filter character.

 

Also I tend not to use the Analog Feel parameter much, I prefer to 'roll my own' starting by varying all the Osc detunes and the Pitch Keytrack. I don't think I have the pitch keytrack set at 100% for any of my 'analog' style patches. Then a little slow, smoothed S/H LFO for pitch drift on one Osc, and a slow Sine LFO to another Osc, the rates and depths of both controlled by a little keytracking and velocity. Doing that kind of thing with a PWM string pad & the LP 3-Ler filter can give some pretty lush results:

 

Hydrasynth PWM String example

 

Manny

[jerrythek]

Really nice, Manny!

 

I agree that the Hydrasynth has a certain digital quality that is hard to shake. Here are 3 versions of 1984, on the Hydrasynth, on the Prophet Rev2, and on the Kronos. Notice how on the HS version the low note rezz sweeps cap out at the top (couldn't get it to go any higher). Also notice when the song gets to the high E major chord on the analog strings, how it's harsh and a bit unpleasant to listen to... there's just something about the intonation of the HS that is harsh.* Because the HS doesn't restrain the sound designer into just sweet spots, there are plenty of yucky sounds you can get out of it, and the full spectrum, piercingly high digital end is one of those danger zones.

 

In this HS demo, I tried to tame the high end by putting the Lo-Fi Decimator at the end of the chain (low pass filter, 6.9kHz cutoff, 22kHz sample rate). That gives it the slightly boxy effect, but believe me, the high end sizzle of the low rezz part is now much easier on the ears.

 

1984 Hydra

 

Personally I wouldn't use the LoFi Decimator for taming the 'edge'. I've found the Hydrasynth 'analogs up' better using warm mode & the Drive pre-filter (in the range of 50-75), then using the EQ at the end of the chain. With a little wrestling I can get it very close to the Montage in filter character.

 

Also I tend not to use the Analog Feel parameter much, I prefer to 'roll my own' starting by varying all the Osc detunes and the Pitch Keytrack. I don't think I have the pitch keytrack set at 100% for any of my 'analog' style patches. Then a little slow, smoothed S/H LFO for pitch drift on one Osc, and a slow Sine LFO to another Osc, the rates and depths of both controlled by a little keytracking and velocity. Doing that kind of thing with a PWM string pad & the LP 3-Ler filter can give some pretty lush results:

 

Hydrasynth PWM String example

 

Manny

[psionic11]

I agree that the Hydrasynth has a certain digital quality that is hard to shake. Here are 3 versions of 1984, on the Hydrasynth, on the Prophet Rev2, and on the Kronos. Notice how on the HS version the low note rezz sweeps cap out at the top (couldn't get it to go any higher). Also notice when the song gets to the high E major chord on the analog strings, how it's harsh and a bit unpleasant to listen to... there's just something about the intonation of the HS that is harsh.* Because the HS doesn't restrain the sound designer into just sweet spots, there are plenty of yucky sounds you can get out of it, and the full spectrum, piercingly high digital end is one of those danger zones.

 

In this HS demo, I tried to tame the high end by putting the Lo-Fi Decimator at the end of the chain (low pass filter, 6.9kHz cutoff, 22kHz sample rate). That gives it the slightly boxy effect, but believe me, the high end sizzle of the low rezz part is now much easier on the ears.

 

1984 Hydra

 

Personally I wouldn't use the LoFi Decimator for taming the 'edge'. I've found the Hydrasynth 'analogs up' better using warm mode & the Drive pre-filter (in the range of 50-75), then using the EQ at the end of the chain. With a little wrestling I can get it very close to the Montage in filter character.

 

Also I tend not to use the Analog Feel parameter much, I prefer to 'roll my own' starting by varying all the Osc detunes and the Pitch Keytrack. I don't think I have the pitch keytrack set at 100% for any of my 'analog' style patches. Then a little slow, smoothed S/H LFO for pitch drift on one Osc, and a slow Sine LFO to another Osc, the rates and depths of both controlled by a little keytracking and velocity. Doing that kind of thing with a PWM string pad & the LP 3-Ler filter can give some pretty lush results:

 

Hydrasynth PWM String example

 

Manny

 

Those strings sound excellent! Very present and yet no harshness whatsoever. Thanks for the tip on the 50-75 for pre-filter Drive.

 

Agreed it's probably a better idea to use EQ instead of the Decimator. I'll go back and change that now.

 

As for the Warm Mode, I slap it on because it's there, but I prefer another method for rounding off the edge.. If I have a mutator to spare, I found using the FM-lin with 0 Depth and 50/50 Wet/Dry really warms up the tone, and is clearly visible on a spectrograph as well. The Feedback parameter then boosts the the low mids in a way I like (beefs it up), but probably not good in a mix context.

 

By the way, I listened to your podcasts on your FM tutorials, your approach is much appreciated! They helped me decide to get a TG77 knowing how fond you were of your SYs. I wanted to have another point of reference for comparing FM between my MODX7 and MOD7.

 

Anyway, the Hydrasynth really is a great synth, esp for a first release. It's got a lot of unique abilities, and covers a lot of ground. And for a decent price.

[GovernorSilver]

Cool! I'm on it.

 

Thanks, Zalman!

 

dB

 

I guess this means an update to the Gear Lab review thread?

[DrSynth]

I agree that the Hydrasynth has a certain digital quality that is hard to shake. Here are 3 versions of 1984, on the Hydrasynth, on the Prophet Rev2, and on the Kronos. Notice how on the HS version the low note rezz sweeps cap out at the top (couldn't get it to go any higher). Also notice when the song gets to the high E major chord on the analog strings, how it's harsh and a bit unpleasant to listen to... there's just something about the intonation of the HS that is harsh.* Because the HS doesn't restrain the sound designer into just sweet spots, there are plenty of yucky sounds you can get out of it, and the full spectrum, piercingly high digital end is one of those danger zones.

 

In this HS demo, I tried to tame the high end by putting the Lo-Fi Decimator at the end of the chain (low pass filter, 6.9kHz cutoff, 22kHz sample rate). That gives it the slightly boxy effect, but believe me, the high end sizzle of the low rezz part is now much easier on the ears.

 

1984 Hydra

 

Personally I wouldn't use the LoFi Decimator for taming the 'edge'. I've found the Hydrasynth 'analogs up' better using warm mode & the Drive pre-filter (in the range of 50-75), then using the EQ at the end of the chain. With a little wrestling I can get it very close to the Montage in filter character.

 

Also I tend not to use the Analog Feel parameter much, I prefer to 'roll my own' starting by varying all the Osc detunes and the Pitch Keytrack. I don't think I have the pitch keytrack set at 100% for any of my 'analog' style patches. Then a little slow, smoothed S/H LFO for pitch drift on one Osc, and a slow Sine LFO to another Osc, the rates and depths of both controlled by a little keytracking and velocity. Doing that kind of thing with a PWM string pad & the LP 3-Ler filter can give some pretty lush results:

 

Hydrasynth PWM String example

 

Manny

 

Those strings sound excellent! Very present and yet no harshness whatsoever. Thanks for the tip on the 50-75 for pre-filter Drive.

 

Agreed it's probably a better idea to use EQ instead of the Decimator. I'll go back and change that now.

 

As for the Warm Mode, I slap it on because it's there, but I prefer another method for rounding off the edge.. If I have a mutator to spare, I found using the FM-lin with 0 Depth and 50/50 Wet/Dry really warms up the tone, and is clearly visible on a spectrograph as well. The Feedback parameter then boosts the the low mids in a way I like (beefs it up), but probably not good in a mix context.

 

By the way, I listened to your podcasts on your FM tutorials, your approach is much appreciated! They helped me decide to get a TG77 knowing how fond you were of your SYs. I wanted to have another point of reference for comparing FM between my MODX7 and MOD7.

 

Anyway, the Hydrasynth really is a great synth, esp for a first release. It's got a lot of unique abilities, and covers a lot of ground. And for a decent price.

 

Thanks !

 

The Hydrasynth is definitely a great bang for the buck, arguably best out there at the moment-- especially with the rate of updates of useful features and refinements. When you add in the feel and playability of the keybed and poly AT, I'm like 'all in' to the point that after playing the 1.5 update I ordered (and just received) a desktop version to pair with the KB for double the poly and layering.

 

As you noted, there's some timbral shaping possibilities in the Mutant wet/dry. This is due to the little bit of phase cancellation going on from the wavecycles it takes for the Mutant to calculate (i.e. a slight processing delay that introduces a phase shift in the 'wet' vs the 'dry' signal).

 

Glad you found the FM tutorials and podcasts useful. If you want to emulate the evolving intricacies FM-ing two wavesequences on the TG, you can do quite a lot with the looping envelopes and offsetting the timing for multiple modulators.

 

Someday I have to pick up a Kronos to dive into MOD7 as it appears to pick up where AFM in the SY's/TG's left off. The FM-X in MODX/Montage is a bit of a 'sideways' evolution -- massive realtime controllability of so many paramenters, yet IMHO a slightly backward step in timbral space possibilities.

 

Manny

[marino]

I, too, have a bit of a problem with the Hydrasynth overall sound. Not because I find it harsh and metallic (it's not difficult to tame that aspect), but because for certain applications, I find it a bit 'weak'. Extremely clean and detailed, but with some lack of body. That of course can be attenuated with the usual random LFO tricks, plus the wave stack, drive, effects, etc.

 

That said, the architecture is just too interesting to give it up. There are parameters that I had never found on an hardware synthesizer before. And the new distortion algorithm was overdue. The Steiner filters sound very good. They seem to be really behind their instrument. So it stays.

[Dave Bryce]

Cool! I'm on it.

 

Thanks, Zalman!

 

dB

 

I guess this means an update to the Gear Lab review thread?

I would imagine...

 

A Gearlab thread is not meant to be a one-way narrative. We'd love to have the community participate and all share their own impressions...so as soon as someone who's revved their unit wants to tell us about it, hopefully others will join in.

 

I'm lost in a studio refit, and hope to get to the rev this weekend.

 

dB

[GovernorSilver]

Cool! I'm on it.

 

Thanks, Zalman!

 

dB

 

I guess this means an update to the Gear Lab review thread?

I would imagine...

 

A Gearlab thread is not meant to be a one-way narrative. We'd love to have the community participate and all share their own impressions...so as soon as someone who's revved their unit wants to tell us about it, hopefully others will join in.

 

I'm lost in a studio refit, and hope to get to the rev this weekend.

 

dB

 

 

It is indeed a massive update, so I've no doubt it'll take some time to update the rev. Good luck w/ the refit!

[Dave Bryce]

Good luck w/ the refit!

Thx!

 

The last time I did this, I was in my mid-40s, and the physical demands were much less noticeable in terms of their toll on my aging frame.

 

I'm pretty sure this is the last time I do a room this size by myself...

 

dB

[Marzzz]

I, too, have a bit of a problem with the Hydrasynth overall sound. Not because I find it harsh and metallic (it's not difficult to tame that aspect), but because for certain applications, I find it a bit 'weak'. Extremely clean and detailed, but with some lack of body. That of course can be attenuated with the usual random LFO tricks, plus the wave stack, drive, effects, etc.

 

That said, the architecture is just too interesting to give it up. There are parameters that I had never found on an hardware synthesizer before. And the new distortion algorithm was overdue. The Steiner filters sound very good. They seem to be really behind their instrument. So it stays.

My sentiments exactly, though it is still early for me and I have much exploring to do. I still haven't really cracked the manual yet, but I am finding that it is so intuitive to use that I am flying around the interface. btw- one of my favorite tricks to add "body" to the sound is to run the output thru a compressor, like PSP's VintageWarmer 2; it may be cheating in a way, but it works wonders on VSTs, for instance.

[AquilaRift]

Anyone else wish the Trigger Env sources included other envelopes or perhaps even mod matrix settings? How about the tap tempo button as a source? It's odd that the sources are limited to only Note on, LFOs, Ribbon on/off, sustain pedal and Mod 1 & 2.

 

I suppose I'm gonna have to experiment with routing a Mod out to a Mod in with a patch cable to see what can be done with that -- but if anyone has already done this, please post your results. Otherwise, perhaps just post your top wishlist items.

[Iconoclast]

I'm seriously considering buying this synth for some very simple reasons:

 

Ribbon Controller (aftermarket ribbon controllers cost almost as much as this synth)

Polyphonic Aftertouch (How is this not mandatory in 2020?)

More LFO's and Envelopes than I can currently use (Even the VST's that I use don't have this many)

The price point

 

It might sound a little digital, but it currently has almost no competition on the above points.

[DrSynth]

I'm seriously considering buying this synth for some very simple reasons:

 

Ribbon Controller (aftermarket ribbon controllers cost almost as much as this synth)

Polyphonic Aftertouch (How is this not mandatory in 2020?)

More LFO's and Envelopes than I can currently use (Even the VST's that I use don't have this many)

The price point

 

It might sound a little digital, but it currently has almost no competition on the above points.

 

Looking at the gear in your sig, the Hydrasynth would be perfect for you. I've seen a lot of gear over a lot of years and the keyboard Hydrasynth was the easiest, most satisfying purchase I've made in a long time, for just those reasons you mention (so much so I got the desktop as well for layering and poly expansion). Added bonus is the keyboard feel and the aftertouch response (fully adjustable) is superb.

 

Remember those 8 knobs are assignable so it's a fantastic VI controller if your DAW can handle all the CC/NRPN's

 

Manny

[DrSynth]

Anyone else wish the Trigger Env sources included other envelopes or perhaps even mod matrix settings? How about the tap tempo button as a source? It's odd that the sources are limited to only Note on, LFOs, Ribbon on/off, sustain pedal and Mod 1 & 2.

 

I suppose I'm gonna have to experiment with routing a Mod out to a Mod in with a patch cable to see what can be done with that -- but if anyone has already done this, please post your results. Otherwise, perhaps just post your top wishlist items.

 

More triggering options would definitely be a great thing, especially from other envelopes. I'd like both the ability to trigger when another envelope hits a certain level, and to trigger at the end of a 'free run' cycle to chain the envelopes sequentially. Would also like to see the ability to specify the 'hold time' at the sustain before going to the release stage... and in general have the 'loop' mode have that ability has well.

 

Manny

 

BTW, I've not tested it, but I think from seeing some of Ken's postings that doing the Mod out / Mod In patch thing does level based triggering...