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Best Software Pianos 2020 edition


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What is everyone digging as the must have software piano in 2020? Is Ivory II still the acknowledged master? How do people stack them up against the Sampletekk stuff, or maybe some others that I don't know about?

 

I'm not particularly interested in playing it live with a band, I'm talking about in the box use for studio stuff - cue writing, etc. Micing up my Kawai is fun and all but only useful for a couple weeks until it's back out of tune.

Kawai C-60 Grand Piano : Hammond A-100 : Hammond SK2 : Yamaha CP4 : Yamaha Montage 7 : Moog Sub 37

 

My latest album: Funky organ, huge horn section

https://bobbycressey.bandcamp.com/album/cali-native

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I don't know any first or second quarter of 2020 projects that are notable for being "better" than what's been out.

 

For solo playing, I still like the Yamaha CFX from Garritan and the Ivory II American Concert D

https://www.garritan.com/products/cfx-concert-grand-virtual-piano/

https://synthogy.com/index.php/products/software-products/ivory-2-american-concert-d

 

For with the band, recording in a band mix the Yamaha C7 in Keyscape, "LA Custome C7" sounds pretty awesome if you have a laptop with enough guts to run it.

https://www.spectrasonics.net/products/keyscape/models/la_custom_c7_grand_piano.php

 

If you own Pianoteq, the Grotrian Concert Royal is a nice sounding model.

 

NI and UVI have bundle collections that will keep you entertained for quite a while too.

https://www.uvi.net/en/pianos-keyboards

https://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/keys/definitive-piano-collection/

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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I still use the VI Labs Ravenscroft almost exclusively, with a bit of NI Grandeur on some things.

 

I also own Keyscape, NI Noire, The Hammersmith, and Ivory II Italian, and I still think the Ravenscroft is the clear winner, but horses for courses.

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I have written about it elsewhere here, but I believe the VSL Syncron pianos to represent the pinnacle of sampled pianos at this time. The Steinway is shockingly, amazingly good. I also have the Ravenscroft. It is not loaded in my template anymore. I have Keyscape, but the VSL piano is the standard. My favorite Rhodes is the Canterbury Suitcase Rhodes.
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I always prefer to play acoustic pianos... that said, Ravenscroft is the only soft piano I have, and I haven't really used it yet - but with a careful choice and balance of the mic pairs, you can obtain a great tone. The Synchron pianos are fantastic, but expensive and they would also require a new computer....
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From all the stuff I've heard I still think I will be buying Keyscape once I get a new laptop it just sounds good and I like the variety of sounds it has. Someone online I listen to regularly recently started using PianoTeq and for acoustic that sound is big, but I will still go for Keyscape for the variety.
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The C. Bechstein Digital Grand is very good. Extremely detailed and expressive. Lots of customization options.

 

For something very different, I like Noire from Native instruments.

 

Last, I'm not sure why this hasn't be a topic yet on MPN - maybe I missed it, but there is an amazing FREE collection over at Pianobook - https://www.pianobook.co.uk

This site was created by Christian Henson of Spitfire audio. He has created various templates for people to sample instruments and they are available there for free. Over 300 instruments last I saw.

-Mike Martin

 

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The opinions I post here are my own and do not represent the company I work for.

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The C. Bechstein Digital Grand is very good. Extremely detailed and expressive. Lots of customization options.

 

For something very different, I like Noire from Native instruments.

 

Last, I'm not sure why this hasn't be a topic yet on MPN - maybe I missed it, but there is an amazing FREE collection over at Pianobook - https://www.pianobook.co.uk

This site was created by Christian Henson of Spitfire audio. He has created various templates for people to sample instruments and they are available there for free. Over 300 instruments last I saw.

 

Thanks for the link MIke!!! I had no idea this existed - bookmarked!

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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My copy of Ravenscroft on iOS doesn't get used much; for that sort of thing I am happy with the Synthony pianos in Korg Module, which take up a lot less space.

 

On macOS there is only one choice for me and that's Pianoteq. Never needed anything else, probably never will. YMMV.

Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) :D

Musician, Author, Editor, Educator, Impresario, Online Radio Guy, Cut-Rate Polymath, and Kindly Pedant

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I"ve struggled to make friends with Ivory II, Ravenscroft, and Keyscape C7. When I play them they don"t respond as expected. It"s subtle but somewhat uninspiring. Sonically they"re very good but the playing experience leaves me cold. Pianoteq is a pleasure to play but doesn"t sound as good to me. A couple of times I"ve played and recorded Pianoteq and then used the midi file to playback the Keyscape C7 which worked out great.
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I"ve struggled to make friends with Ivory II, Ravenscroft, and Keyscape C7. When I play them they don"t respond as expected. It"s subtle but somewhat uninspiring. Sonically they"re very good but the playing experience leaves me cold. Pianoteq is a pleasure to play but doesn"t sound as good to me. A couple of times I"ve played and recorded Pianoteq and then used the midi file to playback the Keyscape C7 which worked out great.

 

Hi, Al. Can you share what controller you are using. And also, do you experiment with dynamic curve settings on the controller, or do you do it from the software piano"s side? Or back and forth between the two. Some of these products actually have settings for popular controllers, like the VPC-1 for instance.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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My current favs (in alphabetical order) apart from Pianoteq:

Bechstein Digital Grand

CineSamples CinePiano

Embertone Walker Grand

Impact Soundworks Pearl Concert Grand

OrangeTreeSamples Rosewood Grand

Wavesfactory Mercury Grand

Wholesounds Baldwin Parlor Grand

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I"ve struggled to make friends with Ivory II, Ravenscroft, and Keyscape C7. When I play them they don"t respond as expected. It"s subtle but somewhat uninspiring. Sonically they"re very good but the playing experience leaves me cold. Pianoteq is a pleasure to play but doesn"t sound as good to me. A couple of times I"ve played and recorded Pianoteq and then used the midi file to playback the Keyscape C7 which worked out great.

 

this has been the general consensus over the years. Samples sound "better", but models play "better". I don't like using the term "better" because it is so subjective but in this case I find it appropriate.

:nopity:
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Hey Elmer. In recent times I"ve used the Casio PX-S3000 as a controller and made tweaks within the software pianos to adjust the dynamic curve. I was working on solo jazz piano and was striving for quite a bit of dynamic nuance. Pianoteq was the only software piano that reacted to my touch as desired/expected.

 

A few years ago I used the CP4 to trigger Ivory II and made the dynamic curve adjustments in Ivory II. It sounded really good and, as I recall, it felt pretty good. But in that situation I was playing with a group and, as a result, likely required less dynamic nuance.

 

I had a surprisingly good jazz trio experience in a studio where they had a Roland D-50 (with synth action) triggering an Acousticsamples Fazoli software piano. I didn"t make any adjustments to the dynamic curve and don"t know how it was set. Before we played I felt pessimistic about playing AP on a synth action but once we started I found that I could express myself pretty well. This kind of messed with my previous beliefs about controllers and software pianos. Truth is I"ve yet to really understand why I can express myself better with some controllers and software pianos than others.

 

Here"s a cut from the D50 / Acousticsamples Fazoli session:

D-50 with Acousticsamples Fazioli Software Piano

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I have never played a software piano from a dedicated controller or other weighted keyboard where the player connection was as good as a popular Stage DP from Yamaha, Kawai, Roland, Nord, even Kurzweil. Korg...hmm that's a tossup there.

 

Yes sonically they were better, for recording, live not so much but it depends on the speaker. I could probably be ok for a commercial rock, pop, r&b gig, but sure wouldn't want to do a serious Jazz Trio gig with one.

 

Dave, have you played Pianoteq?

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Right, it"s really a matter of dynamic curves and how 0-127 gets interpreted by the software instrument. Does mellow pp change to mp, mf, f and how smoothly have they programmed the change between layers and when that ping that piano strings make at f, ff+ is expected to happen on whatever your controller is.

 

The other aspect is latency. Can these instruments that retrieve 40gb of samples bring them under your fingers and to your ear quickly enough on your rig. That"s why need for fast cpu, Ram, and fast SSD. And the desktop operating systems. Can they deliver this as quickly as dedicated hardware like a Yamaha CP4 or what have you.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Right, it"s really a matter of dynamic curves and how 0-127 gets interpreted by the software instrument. Does mellow pp change to mp, mf, f and how smoothly have they programmed the change between layers and when that ping that piano strings make at f, ff+ is expected to happen on whatever your controller is.

 

The other aspect is latency. Can these instruments that retrieve 40gb of samples bring them under your fingers and to your ear quickly enough on your rig. That"s why need for fast cpu, Ram, and fast SSD. And the desktop operating systems. Can they deliver this as quickly as dedicated hardware like a Yamaha CP4 or what have you.

 

Absolutely yes. Any desktop or laptop system has about 100x the power of a typical keyboard. Large samplers have been standard tech since Gigasampler 20 years ago. This is completely solved tech. The Kronos streams from disk, and many here use it. It is a low powered Linux computer in there - but more than adequate for streaming multi-gigabyte samples. This is not hard in 2020.

 

The key to unlock the best samples is a great keybed. Ironically, this involves buying a top digital piano like the Nord Grand, Kawai, Yamaha, etc and then just using the MIDI output. Basically you have to buy a keyboard for the action and then replace its sounds with much better samples in the computer. My experience is that a triple sensor keyboard is important. It is important to have a keybed that gives control at the lower velocities and that lets you get at all the velocities. The Nord Grand does this for me (Kawai action). The Yamaha P515 is very capable. So are the Kawai boards. (Note they are all made by acoustic piano companies). Monitoring is important (in the studio, I play the VSL Steiway in surround - it is glorious).

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I should also add, that a big part of the "connection" is what happens at the key bottom. Keybeds like in the Kronos have padding there - as does anything with aftertouch. The Nord Grand does not have aftertouch and bottoms just like an acoustic piano. Because the VSL sample includes that sound of the action, there is the acoustic "thud" at the bottom that an acoustic piano has. I kept the Nord Grand vs. the P515 largely on account of this. The P515 is damped at the bottom. it is admittedly quieter, but in the studio, that is not a concern for me. I had better connection with the Nord, which also felt closer in weight to my Kawai RX-7.

 

But I think a great sampled piano experience is nuanced - a confluence of small details. (Just like any acoustic instrument, actually).

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Like Dave I do sessions regularly at a studio where the guy runs ivory. He has a CP33 that I use to control it. My experience with it is similar, kinesthetically I have more of a performance connection to my CP4, but the Ivory samples do sound better and I tend to be able to make music on it.

 

I am still blown away by the Syncrony VSL stuff from earlier in the thread though.

 

 

I wonder how my CP4 would do controlling them. I wish there was an easy way to know.

Kawai C-60 Grand Piano : Hammond A-100 : Hammond SK2 : Yamaha CP4 : Yamaha Montage 7 : Moog Sub 37

 

My latest album: Funky organ, huge horn section

https://bobbycressey.bandcamp.com/album/cali-native

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I'm with Dave's thinking. But I would like one that works for easy transport to live casuals, where I play solo. I don't want to carry an expensive laptop computer and an interface. I can't tolerate any added latency I get with my iPhone or iPad Pro when running my Korg Module with Ivory and Scarbee. The latency is too distracting, that experiment was money wasted. My Kawai ES110 has a better finger to sound connection (latency specs) than my Korg Module. I tried the trial version of PianoTeq on my Windows 10 desktop at home with the USB from my Casio PX-S3000, but it had too much latency for me. I set the sample size to small for all of the above software to no avail.

 Find 660 of my jazz piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Harry was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book."

 

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I'd suspect latency as the reason sampled pianos don't feel right. It might be so small you can't hear it, but perhaps you can feel it. And of course velocity curves may need tweaking for each controller vs each instrument. Whatever the reason, I've had some that feel good and some that don't over the years, with different interfaces. Most sound good in a vacuum!

 

My "best" one is Garritan's CFX Lite, it has the most dynamic range.

I like the Grandeur from NI, it's quite playable and the sound is pleasing, though not nearly as dynamic as CFX Lite.

I have the XLN pianos, I'll have to bring out the Upright based on someone mentioning it above, and compare it to The Gentleman (also from NI). Can't say I really love the Gentleman but I don't want an upright that much.

I bought Fluffy Audio's My Piano when it was 10 bucks, I have yet to install it. This I believe is a very intimate and homey-sounding upright.

 

Not idea how these stack up against the competition, I just know they all beat the Logic pianos :D They were all on sale and none require iLok-style copy protection so those were big factors. Still deciding if I "need" a SampleTekk piano; the white grand sounded a bit unique vs what I have, but frankly I'd do better saving for a weighted controllery, my modx7 is all I have right now (a million pianists just cried out in horror!) after my Studiologic 90's vintage controller finally died on me.

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If using Mac OS or Windows, True Pianos https://www.truepianos.com/ is an option (there"s a test download version). Small installation and comparatively light on system resources. Should be able to get latency down low.

 

For producers that are bringing in players for a session. They need to care more about your playing experience than their mix during tracking. Most of these guys/gals have computers that are pretty high end for running lots of instances of demanding plugins. They simply need to mute those plugins during recording and set latency way down low for performance. When the tracking stage is done, put the latency way back up again for the mixing stage of the project. If you have a good working relationship, speak up! Ask if they can set the latency lower while you"re doing your thing.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Ravenscroft is so versatile that I"ve yet to really want to go elsewhere. But every so often something shows up that I"m keen about, do the research and put it on a 'maybe sometime' list: Piano In Blue, CinePiano, Garratan CFX, True Keys American and Bechstein.

 

I often open the Pianoteq free demo and fall in love with the Grotrian every time, but the others have always sounded 'almost there.' Pianoteq is a joy to play, though. Finger to ear, low load, extremely tweakable, and Modartt keeps improving the product. I believe in modelling and keep my eye on that product.

____________________________________
Rod

Here for the gear.

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That's a really good point ElmerJFudd. I need to try that myself, reduce latency for tracking (which maybe could mean having a rough audio mix of all the other tracks so they don't have to be playing) then bump it up for mixing.

 

I feel pretty set on pianos; I have some other "gaps" to fill in any case in my sounds. But I think Pianoteq would be a good addition to the sampled ones I have, I need to look out for sales on it! Gotta be on sale!

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