Jump to content


Please note: You can easily log in to MPN using your Facebook account!

OK, the Corona Virus Isn't Going Away. Now What?


Recommended Posts

I'm going to refer back to The Hill article I posted earlier. It's already two pages back in this thread so I'm posting the link again because I think it's that important. I was surprised when I first posted this there really wasn't a big deal made out of it either for or against. I think it's worth a serious discussion.

 

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/494034-the-data-are-in-stop-the-panic-and-end-the-total-isolation

 

The entire article is very important imho but here is the quote that to me, is the most important:

 

In this virus, we know that medical care is not even necessary for the vast majority of people who are infected. It is so mild that half of infected people are asymptomatic, shown in early data from the Diamond Princess ship, and then in Iceland and Italy. That has been falsely portrayed as a problem requiring mass isolation. In fact, infected people without severe illness are the immediately available vehicle for establishing widespread immunity. By transmitting the virus to others in the low-risk group who then generate antibodies, they block the network of pathways toward the most vulnerable people, ultimately ending the threat. My emphasis.

 

What exactly is he saying here? He's saying let the younger people, meaning under 50, go out as much as they want, in fact encourage that to happen. Let them all get infected, the faster the better, that's how you create herd immunity without a vaccine. The most vulnerable among us will continue to be protected and if a young person has a grandparent or someone else in the house who's in the high risk group they'll figure it out. Most younger people are not that stupid. Some are of course, they're the ones who make the news but most are not. They're smart and respectful.

 

And Craig, to change the subject I just bought the license transfer for Studio One 4 and Notion that was for sale in the KC Classifieds forum. What's the first thing I saw after I installed everything? Your article about VCA's. Very nice.

 

Bob

Hammond SK1, Mojo 61, Kurzweil PC3, Korg Pa3x, Roland FA06, Band in a Box, Real Band, Studio One, too much stuff...
Link to comment
Share on other sites



  • Replies 1.6k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

I don't think you're going to see people going on cruises for quite some time.

 

Carnival to resume cruises in August

 

Based on what I've heard happening here in Houston and Texas with the "reopening" last weekend (restaurants and stores were packed, few were wearing masks, social distancing -- what's that? Galveston's beaches were full, traffic down there was bumper to bumper), I bet lots of people will be jumping on cruise ships. :(

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What exactly is he saying here? He's saying let the younger people, meaning under 50, go out as much as they want, in fact encourage that to happen. Let them all get infected, the faster the better, that's how you create herd immunity without a vaccine. The most vulnerable among us will continue to be protected and if a young person has a grandparent or someone else in the house who's in the high risk group they'll figure it out. Most younger people are not that stupid. Some are of course, they're the ones who make the news but most are not. They're smart and respectful.

I'm sorry Bob, but based on what I've seen and read, this is a really bad idea, especially here in the U. S. Just because someone is under 50 doesn't mean they're low risk. For one, I've seen stories talking about how one person "who had no health problems" was on a ventilator and dying or died, his wife was upset, etc. And I looked at the pictures and he was HUGE. You know the type. Just because he was in his 30s and his body wasn't complaining too hard yet, he probably doesn't go to the doctor annually so no one was telling him he needed to lose weight, etc., he thought he was okay. Then there are other cases where even I am surprised they died, like this marathoner who died from it. (Okay, he was 51, but still.) Maybe he did have underlying conditions that he didn't know about, but it's way too risky because people don't know if they're healthy, they just think they are.

 

But I think the argument against herd immunity is best stated here. I think even if you limit it to those under 50 or those of low risk (as if people knew that for themselves, as I stated above), there's way too much risk even in that population.

 

Heck, I wish you and the author of that piece were right. If we could say, "you kids go infect yourselves, we'll stay home" and that would fix this, I'd be all for it. But if we did that, I think a lot of "the kids" would be in really bad shape.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Heck, I wish you and the author of that piece were right. If we could say, "you kids go infect yourselves, we'll stay home" and that would fix this, I'd be all for it. But if we did that, I think a lot of "the kids" would be in really bad shape.

 

This exactly, PLUS the pretty important fact that NO-ONE knows yet how much immunity is conferred and how long that immunity lasts. If it's established that it's like chicken pox and generally you get it once and then have lifelong immunity (yes i know some people get a repeat as shingles), then the herd immunity approach may eventually work. If it's more like the common cold or a flu where there's immunity by strain and even then it can be temporary, then that approach is near useless...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I respectfully disagree. I do think distancing has flattened the curve somewhat. Not as much as it may have been intended or hoped for, but I believe if we didn't follow theses precautions the initial peak would be exponentially greater. Of course these opinions are simply speculation as no one knows absolutely, positively, for sure.

 

Here in Florida, there have been limited re-openings, but the response has been underwhelming to say the least. Despite the protesters storming government buildings with freedom cries, most people are not eager to get back in public. Restaurants are limited to 25% seating here, and they are lucky to get 10%.

 

Malls are opening but with very few shoppers. Perhaps a month or two off has convinced people that recreational shopping isn't necessary?

 

The beaches are moderately populated, but there is a general feeling of safety outdoors with a strong breeze that has traveled across a non-COVID sea to get to you.

 

Carnival is planning to cruise in August with daily rates of less than $29 per day to get people on. That won't even pay for your food, but they hope to make it back in the casino. Will people go? I suppose some will, but with the press about ships at sea not being allowed to dock anywhere, I really doubt that they will have full ships.

 

Will you feel save in an airplane?

 

How about a hotel room? Did the previous guest leave the virus everywhere? Did the housekeeping staff sterilize the room? Bleached or rubbed down with alcohol? A deep cleaning won't do.

 

A lot of people working at home are not eager to go back to the office. And as the managers see the work still coming in, the companies may be thinking the cost of an office with the taxes, utility bills and so on might not be worth it.

 

The US Corporationalist economy has thrived on consumers buying things they don't need. The thrill of shopping wears off soon with a product they don't need so the consumer needs to go shopping for more. Will this ever return? If so, how long will it take?

 

I have a relative who is a world famous doctor. He lectures other doctors all over the world and has written over 100 peer-reviewed papers in respected medical journals.

 

He says the way this disease tears through and damages the human body it is nothing like the flu, but hundreds of times worse. He is one of those now suspecting that COVID-19 might predominantly attack the blood system, especially the hemoglobin oxygen carrying function. When this happens, many bodies go into extreme inflammatory immune system responses, and the inflammation is what kills. It's different in different people and manifests itself in lungs, blood clots, kidney damage, brain damage and/or assorted other failures depending on the person infected.

 

Although he said some people are asymptomatic, others have mild symptoms, all end up damaged in some way. Perhaps permanently, it's too soon to know. He added that you definitely don't want to get a severe case.

 

My guess, and it is a guess, is that unless a vaccine is developed, and it's possible that won't happen, life will never return to normal. Even if it does, it will take a long time before it settles to a new, smaller normal.

 

But perpetual growth of anything is impossible in a closed system -- and that includes the stock market, corporate profits, and population growth. It will be interesting to see what happens next and who the winners, losers, and successful adapters will be.

 

Insights and incites by Notes

Bob "Notes" Norton

Owner, Norton Music http://www.nortonmusic.com

Style and Fake disks for Band-in-a-Box

The Sophisticats http://www.s-cats.com >^. .^< >^. .^<

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What's next?

 

Next we all will be standing in line for our Bill Gates vaccines and getting our "vaccinated" trackers under our skin.

 

I know that it is an extreme view and I hope that it doesn't happen, but here we are, with mad governors in Michigan, New York and California, not allowing people to go to their cottages, prohibiting the sale of seeds, and not even allowing outdoor walks in some municipalities. In Canada ,Trudeau is walking lock step with the UN and W.H.O.

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=550574275833496

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not only by doctor relative who is following the blood connection:

 

 

 

Fifteen children, many of whom had the coronavirus, have recently been hospitalized in New York City with a mysterious syndrome that doctors do not yet fully understand but that has also been reported in several European countries, health officials announced on Monday night.

 

Many of the children, ages 2 to 15, have shown symptoms associated with toxic shock or Kawasaki disease, a rare illness in children that involves inflammation of the blood vessels, including coronary arteries, the city"s health department said.

 

None of the New York City patients with the syndrome have died, according to a bulletin from the health department, which describes the illness as a 'multisystem inflammatory syndrome potentially associated with Covid-19.'

Bob "Notes" Norton

Owner, Norton Music http://www.nortonmusic.com

Style and Fake disks for Band-in-a-Box

The Sophisticats http://www.s-cats.com >^. .^< >^. .^<

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd stand in line for a vaccine! Annually, if I had to.

 

My money is on the science of medicine, that a vaccine will be developed and the only problem will be getting it deployed.

 

And this virus will join the lists of the other diseases that we rarely think about, like polio, hepatitus A&B, many strains of flue, chicken pox, rubella, measles, mumps, etc, etc.

 

The media has spread many unsettling stories about "superbugs" that will eventually devastate the human race. And that there will be "nothing we can do about it". Well, there was a time we could do nothing about tetanus - and all the other maladies for which there are vaccines. It seems much more likely that, as medical science continues to advance, that our ability to deal with diseases will increase, not meet some brick wall of doom that some writer of apocalyptic future scenarios likes to scare us with.

 

The very fear of such doomsday scenarios makes them less likely to happen as humans respond and get to work.

 

Why should this virus be the one we can't stop? Sure, we haven't stopped it yet, but the massive effort is underway, and I bet we will stop it.

 

nat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Why should this virus be the one we can't stop? Sure, we haven't stopped it yet, but the massive effort is underway, and I bet we will stop it.

 

nat

 

No-one will be happier than me if they successfully develop an effective vaccine. It just begs the question why the common cold (another corona virus) has resisted attempts for a vaccine. You're right though - I doubt there's been more focus or money thrown at the issue so you never know.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Research is selective and targeted. I think there would be an incredible outcry if billions of dollars were allocated to eradicate the common cold. There are so many other more menacing targets for research to aim at. In fact, it makes you wonder, with all the efforts and funds re-tooling to deal with the current virus, what will happen to progress on all the other slower-moving yet deadly threats out there all the time.

 

Maybe it's my 60s-bred positive outlook that somehow has survived all the decades since - but we've beat so many diseases and gotten better in battle over time. Of course there are a ton of diseases we haven't been able to find solutions for. But it seems more often than not that the scientific outlook is generally, "it's a matter of time and resources", not a matter of fate and inevitability.

 

nat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it's a mistake to paint the entire US with a wide brush. NY has half of the country's deaths. We have states almost the size of all of Europe with no deaths. What's happening in NY and NJ is not happening in ND, SD, MT, WY, etc.

 

Actually that was kind of my point. Cases are going down in, for example, NY, but they're rising where previously they hadn't been, and starting to hit rural areas. So regardless of what's happening locally, when taken on average, this thing is not going away. Recent reports seem to indicate that it has also evolved into a more contagious strain, which I guess puts the vaccine research back to square one.

 

It really seems like there are no good answers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why should this virus be the one we can't stop? Sure, we haven't stopped it yet, but the massive effort is underway, and I bet we will stop it.

 

One way or another, it won't go on forever. Best case is we discover some magic silver bullet, like no one who plays with modular synthesizers has ever become infected :) , and it ends tomorrow. Worst case is it kills everyone on earth so there are no more hosts left. I'm sure the truth will lie somewhere in between.

 

Just remember the first effective polio vaccine was demoed in 1950. Salk's vaccine came into use in 1955, and the oral vaccine didn't happen until 1961.

 

So it will stop at some point. The question is how much damage it will have done between now and then.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<...snip...>

Why should this virus be the one we can't stop? Sure, we haven't stopped it yet, but the massive effort is underway, and I bet we will stop it.

 

nat

 

It wouldn't be the first one we can't stop. People frantically invested their efforts to find a vaccine for AIDS, and to date, it hasn't happened.

 

There is no vaccine for the common cold (another coronavirus)

 

We can't stop malaria yet, and that kills more people than anything else on earth, including other humans.

 

Does that mean we can't stop this? Not necessarily. Time will tell.

 

I hope either a vaccine or a cure comes, and if it arrives, I hope for sooner rather than later. Until then especially since I'm unemployed and yet to receive one penny of government aid (thanks to the tea bag Florida ex-governor) I'm going to err on the side of caution and limit my excursions from the relative safety of my home.

 

BTW. I don't go with the 5G theory, since there is no 5G in most places that are having people die. I'd rather go with science than conspiracy theories. Any source to the left of The Atlantic or the right of The Hill I consider nothing more than propaganda and lies.

 

Insights and incites by Notes

Bob "Notes" Norton

Owner, Norton Music http://www.nortonmusic.com

Style and Fake disks for Band-in-a-Box

The Sophisticats http://www.s-cats.com >^. .^< >^. .^<

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that we all are going to get it ,sooner or later. I personally think that sooner is better, because the strains that follow may be stronger , or there may be a stronger strain.

 

There have been unusual numbers in places like Sweden and Texas where there was little to no lock down. The numbers were much lower than expected.

 

Only looking back, a year from now, will we be able to see if the lock downs helped. I think it will all average out.

 

I have a theory of my own, if anyone wants to humor me........The reason that some younger "front line" workers are dying from this is because they are being hit with MANY STRAINS at once. I have heard that there are 30 strains right now.

 

I should probably give some POSITIVE ADVICE NOW.........................MAKE MUSIC......KEEP BUSY........PRAY !

 

 

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There have been unusual numbers in places like Sweden and Texas where there was little to no lock down. The numbers were much lower than expected.

I'm not sure I agree with that. The cities in Texas, where it started to hit harder and first, did lock down.

 

Don"t Be Fooled by America"s Flattening Curve

 

The same is true in Texas: Cases spiked early on because of a surge in Houston, and after the city's peak, the state seemed to be improving. But removing Houston from the statewide figures shows the number of new cases was rising all along.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I still feel there is something good going on right now and the most logical reason is immunity. I've said for weeks now Boeing will be a good test and so was the Wisconsin election. I just did a search on both of those and no news about new infections. It's been a month since the election and Boeing went back to work April 21 so that's over two weeks now. 27,000 Boeing workers and 200,000 voters in Wisconsin. No new cases reported in either situation since the initial ones in Wisconsin several weeks ago. I've been both hopeful and worried about both of those. There could have easily been a spike of several hundred cases in Wisconsin with 200,000 people standing in line and crowded inside polling places and maybe dozens at Boeing with thousands inside a huge aircraft assembly building in Seattle and S. Carolina and either one would have thrown a big wrench into the reopening the country idea. It looks like hopeful won so far.

 

I feel some immunity is the first reason but also good health procedures on the part of the authorities and Boeing and good follow through on the part of the public. Going forward carefully of course, there will be slippage, there will be new cases and some deaths but it will be manageable. Even without a vaccine working age people will see how it's going and gradually relax about it. Again, not us old farts and people with serious underlying conditions. We will have to wait for really good therapies if not an outright cure.

 

Bob

Hammond SK1, Mojo 61, Kurzweil PC3, Korg Pa3x, Roland FA06, Band in a Box, Real Band, Studio One, too much stuff...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hope you're right, Bob. Heck, I hope those leaders who are opening their states and the people who are out there doing stuff like it's no big deal are right. Whether it's more immunity or resistance, less spread, whatever, it would be a nice thing. But I won't hold my breath. I'm going to wait. I think in a couple of weeks we'll know if Texas opened too soonâ¦

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Boeing's workforce COVID-19 numbers will probably be lower than those the meatpacking plants that the POTUS wants reeopened, because they're going to cut their workforce. At least they appear to be putting more effort into protecting the workers that will remain than Smithfield.

 

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/02/boeing-goes-from-bad-to-worse-as-coronavirus-crush.aspx

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There have been unusual numbers in places like Sweden and Texas where there was little to no lock down. The numbers were much lower than expected.

 

That's not really true, even taking into account the variables behind how statistics are derived. Check out this lengthy, but informative, article. IMHO stats are cherry-picked to make it look like Sweden is doing better, and therefore not locking down doesn't make a difference...but digging deeper shows why those stats were cherry-picked.

 

Bottom line for the link: "The claim has an element of truth in that Sweden has roughly the same number of confirmed cases per million people as Denmark and Norway [which locked down, although note that Sweden did prohibit gatherings of more than 50 people]. But it"s misleading to say that Sweden is doing no worse. The total number of confirmed cases is increasing at a faster rate in Sweden than in Norway and Denmark â even though Sweden is doing less testing per 1,000 people than Norway and Denmark. Moreover, Sweden has higher death rates."

 

COVID-19 deaths per million people (Sweden"s is higher than Denmark"s and Norway"s)

 

Sweden: 149.61

United States: 117.55

Denmark: 59.74

Norway: 27.3

 

Sweden"s ratio of confirmed deaths to confirmed cases is more than twice as high as Denmark"s and more than five times higher than Norway"s.

 

Sweden: 10.93%

United States: 5.29%

Denmark: 4.78%

Norway: 2.12%

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sigh, Craig the great wet blanket....Just kidding, it's great to have a detailed counterpoint to some of these news stories.

 

Here's one that I hate bringing up because it's definitely not PC. You see stories and pics like this all the time, this one happens to be about a family who lost 4 people to the virus. Tragic for sure however...look at the picture. When we talk about death rates, there is hardly a mention about obesity and doesn't that have something to do with it?

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/18/nyregion/new-jersey-family-coronavirus.html

 

I did not spend hours trying to find a pic of heavy people who died of this, actually this is the first one I saw about a month ago and decided to bring it up now. The Times tip toes around this. "She was a heavy set woman in good health". Sorry, someone that overweight is never in good health and yes I know, I know this is called fat shaming, everybody is beautiful in their own way and all that and we don't dare talk about it. I do not consider a 240 pound 25 year old "Plus Size Supermodel" in a bikini to be a hot babe and it's not a healthy way to live. Several years ago I commented how awesome Joey D was in a thread and I ended with what I thought was a simple innocuous comment, "I wish he would lose some weight". Several people piled on me about that. Now that we're in the middle of this pandemic obesity is a very big deal and needs to be taken into account when we as individuals worry about overall hospitalization and mortality rates. Yes, I know. There are exceptions but overall I'm not wrong.

 

Bob

Hammond SK1, Mojo 61, Kurzweil PC3, Korg Pa3x, Roland FA06, Band in a Box, Real Band, Studio One, too much stuff...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bob, I agree with you about that. I mean, to each their own, and by No Means do I want to shame anyone or make them feel bad for anything. That being said, the science is telling us this disease is ravaging the obese. I've mentioned elsewhere (this thread?) about the sad story of a couple that was in love, he was "strong," had a good job because someone saw this big guy and needed someone that could move stuff or whatever, and "he didn't have any underlying health issues." And I look at the pics and he was HUGE. I bet he thought he was fine, didn't go to regular exams, etc. I think he was in his 30s so the problems hadn't hit him yet, at least that he noticed.

 

That's one of the reasons I don't think herd immunity will work. America has too many people that are obese, including under 30 that will get slammed by this when the virus hits those places where they are. The "joke" has been America gets wider in the middle.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Immunity will still work Joe. It's not an automatic death sentence even if the person weighs 350 pounds, the odds are worse that's all. I don't know, pick a number 5-10% maybe? The rest will still survive and should have immunity like anyone else.

 

Again, tip toeing around, this is a big issue in the black and brown communities and that never gets talked about either. I've always had black friends and played with black musicians my whole life. They taught me back in the late 60's about soul food in the Baltimore and DC areas. I mean I seriously love that crap, it's awesome. Pork BBQ, grits, sweet potato pie believe me I can write out the menu for a great place called Mammies Cajun Kitchen in West LA, their Shrimp Etouffee was killer. I've been to NOLO a few times and to coin a phrase I'm in hog heaven, the food there is soooo good. And so many are soooo fat. And believe me so would I be if I didn't start gaining weight in my 50's and started cutting back before it became a real issue. I was one of those guys in the 70's who could eat everything on the menu except for "Thank you call again" and not gain an ounce. And now living in So Cal there's all the Mexican places, nothing like a big ole Breakfast Burrito to get you going. Ha, I definitely cannot do that, it's a protein shake and some fruit now. I'll allow myself one of those every few weeks, maybe. Chorizo, eggs, lots of cheese, smothered in sour cream, salsa, ahhhh CRAP. I'm totally sympathetic to all those folks, I seriously am but this is not good for them and they have to learn about food substitutions.

 

Bob

Hammond SK1, Mojo 61, Kurzweil PC3, Korg Pa3x, Roland FA06, Band in a Box, Real Band, Studio One, too much stuff...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Obesity definitely plays an issue in ability for an individual to respond to pretty much any health challenge. On immunity, it bears repeating that NO-ONE knows what sort of immunity is conferred as yet, let alone how long it will last....
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, one of my neighbors brought up a disproportionate number of Hispanics (is that what you call brown people?) contracting COVID-19 in our area. They don't look any more fat than the white people in our area, so let's forget about that. What's different between them and whites is that more white folks have telework-friendly jobs while more Hispanics work essential jobs, laborer jobs... jobs that expose them being often well within 6 feet of other humans. There's no telling how many of them are provided with masks, disinfectant, etc. or if their jobs even allow them to take breaks to wash their hands before they have to touch their faces.

 

Herd immunity at this point is a pipe dream until we either get proof that COVID-19 survivors have 0% chance of getting sick from it again (no proof of that) or we get a vaccine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's one that I hate bringing up because it's definitely not PC. You see stories and pics like this all the time, this one happens to be about a family who lost 4 people to the virus. Tragic for sure however...look at the picture. When we talk about death rates, there is hardly a mention about obesity and doesn't that have something to do with it?

I don't think it has anything to do with PC. The bottom line is unhealthy people are more at risk for any kind of illness. "Unhealthy" can apply to someone of any color/nationality/religion. Now, some people can make healthy choices, like deciding not to smoke. But some health issues are food-based or environment-based. Healthy food costs a lot, carbs are cheap. As to environment, there's not much you can do about that if you can't afford to move. I certainly wouldn't move to Flint, Michigan right now.

 

Everything is so nuanced. The attitude of some people is "hey, most deaths are in nursing homes, they're on the way out anyway, so I'm sorry, but the cost of keeping them alive is too high." The hypocrisy of those who proclaim themselves pro-life, or heap praise on "the greatest generation" when it's convenient, is palpable (after all, those people in nursing homes are part of the society that built the interstate highway system, made the US the greatest military power on earth, explored space, helped defeat Hitler, and brought amazing technological changes from which we all benefit).

 

A close friend of mine received an email from someone whose mother had died in a nursing home from COVID-19. He was devastated. She had plenty of years left, but she was not all that mobile and needed care. Is she disposable? Is she essential? Do the feelings of the people left behind who are not in nursing homes matter? What is a human life worth? What sacrifices should people make to society, and what sacrifices should society make to people?

 

I don't have definitive answers to those questions. No one does. All we have is varying opinions, in many cases, based on agenda-driven misinformation from all sides.

 

What if things opened up and I felt safe. I go to a movie theater, and some Twilight Zone-type character comes up to me and says "Enjoy the show! By the way, he's a picture of Maxine Smith. Looks like a really kind old lady, right? She's a sweetheart, raised a great family. Unfortunately she has only about 10 years left, max. We'll trade her life for you being able to check out the new James Bond flick in IMAX. Cool by you?"

 

And there's also another discussion I'm not seeing happening anywhere that I think is very important: assisted suicide. If I was in a hospital, fading, stuck on a tube, knowing the odds of getting out alive would be remote and the odds of getting out unscathed 100% against me, I'd want the option to just check out for my sake, the sake of the caregivers, and because...well, enough is enough. Maybe not everyone wants to be saved. Maybe they do.

 

I don't know.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's probably impossible to measure compliance with social distancing and other social health behaviors, but I can't help but wonder if part of the USA's problem here is a general disinclination to "behave" that is a very American personality trait.

 

I mean how much rock and hip hop and related types of music are dedicated to waving the banner of personal freedom - a sort of damn the torpedoes let's drink and carry on do what we want to do and you can't tell me what to do, ever, sort of attitude.

 

In our extended family, there is the gamut of attitudes. The oldest generation - 80s on - are putting up with a lot of loneliness and isolation. They do get visits, but they get to be with another person only on a couple of days a week at the most. All the protocols are followed by all family members with regard to the oldest of us. But every now and then one of the eldest ones just gets impatient and drives alone (which they usually shouldn't do anyway) to the store or whatever. It causes a big family fuss.

 

In my generation - boomers, basically - we're all pretty compliant but there's more "misbehavior" than among the oldest contingent. The more macho among us get a little delight in worrying the wives and others (usually female) with a bit of risky behavior. Impatience again gets to be a big factor. The women generally have more sense than the boys of all ages.

 

The generation under us, basically our kids and their seemingly endless cousins - this is where the differences are really big. My daughter (very early 30s) is married to a healthcare professional, so you know how seriously they take this. My son is on that same page - he's a science major in college. But many of the guy cousins in their late 20s, 30s, especially the (divorced) single guys, they are pretty contemptuous of the safe behaviors. Oh, they'll behave if one of us older ones meet them, but their social lives are still carried on with heavy disregard for social distancing, etc. And they are always ready with some story or other that illustrates how "ridiculous" the "panic" is, etc. One of them got the virus, had mild symptoms, and that just fueled the fire of non-compliance.

 

All this just to say - Americans have a tendency to be a horsey lot, a taste for being ungovernable if the mood takes them. Maybe it's universal, I wouldn't know, but I do know a lot of overly non-compliant and proud of it Americans.

 

nat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gov, I think you're being too literal. Just because there is no absolute PROOF there is no immunity there are plenty of indications that there is. You see the occasional mention of someone who was a confirmed case who seems to have gotten reinfected but we're talking about a few not dozens every day. And please don't be one of those that makes me have to qualify every thing I write. Of course fat is fat regardless of color of skin however I did look it up. Minorities are a bit more obese than whites, it's not by a huge amount but there is a difference..

 

Your comment about where minorities work actually bolsters my argument. What you wrote is very true about laborer type jobs where they work right next each other and do not have the best protection. They also tend to have large families crowded into a small living spaces. I've been surprised I haven't read news articles screaming about how this virus is hitting hispanics so much harder than whites. If anything that tells me there is a lot of immunity which would be great. Otherwise given their working and living conditions why do you think there isn't an obvious epidemic in those communities? Just like my comments about Boeing and the Wisconsin election if there was a big jump in those areas especially here in SoCal where whites are in the minority it would be all over the news like now, today. There's nothing.

 

Bob

Hammond SK1, Mojo 61, Kurzweil PC3, Korg Pa3x, Roland FA06, Band in a Box, Real Band, Studio One, too much stuff...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...