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Forum Dare- Tell me if/why you don't dig Neon Vines


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I was going to invite her to enjoy the many fun and interesting post topics.

 

I thought , for sure, everyone would be enthused about seeing a young lady playing electronic keyboards on this forum.

 

But after some of the posts, well, maybe not such a good idea ?

Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ?

My Soundcloud with many originals:

[70's Songwriter]

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I was going to invite her to enjoy the many fun and interesting post topics.

 

I thought , for sure, everyone would be enthused about seeing a young lady playing electronic keyboards on this forum.

 

But after some of the posts, well, maybe not such a good idea ?

 

 

The posts were certainly engendered by the title, which does not persuade a positive result. Sorry but that's how I see it.

 

If you read "Forum Dare- Tell me if/why you don't dig Neon Vines" would you jump right in and say "Gosh, she is just the best thing ever"?

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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I said I was impressed by the get go on the performer.

 

I asserted an A grade on her talent and skill. And I was consistent.

 

Other folks gave their balanced evaluation, you know , things they liked , and areas , not so impressed.

 

If someone thinks I am forcing them what to think and post, I had no idea I had such power

on the Internet.

 

Have a good Easter.

Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ?

My Soundcloud with many originals:

[70's Songwriter]

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The bedroom producer is the next place for the record industry to tap for talent. It started as an underground scene, producers all sharing their work on sites like SoundCloud and Clyp. It"s branching out into more mainstream platforms like YouTube, TikTok, etc. The focus seems to be on the song, timbres, technology used to achieve this or that effect or ear candy. All it takes is for a few people from this scene to break through and there will be a feeding frenzy.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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I said I was impressed by the get go on the performer.

 

I asserted an A grade on her talent and skill. And I was consistent.

 

Other folks gave their balanced evaluation, you know , things they liked , and areas , not so impressed.

 

If someone thinks I am forcing them what to think and post, I had no idea I had such power

on the Internet.

 

Have a good Easter.

 

OK, be honest now. Would you post a flyer for your band saying "BandX - ClubA-Friday Dare - Tell us what you Don't Like?

Own it, it's yours. Cheers, Kuru

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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About the click count:

One question I'd want to consider regarding the number of views is...who's doing the viewing?

 

I'd be willing to bet that there's a very, very high percentage of adolescent girls doing the clicking. Not an age group known for their critical acumen.

 

Grey

I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play.

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I was going to invite her to enjoy the many fun and interesting post topics.

 

I thought , for sure, everyone would be enthused about seeing a young lady playing electronic keyboards on this forum.

 

But after some of the posts, well, maybe not such a good idea ?

 

I'm with you, actually very disappointed in some of the posts here. If I were her I would stay far away from this forum. Which is a shame because while I don't write, play or produce music in the style that she does, I think I can recognize musical talent and her Roli soloing chops alone show me that she has that. She also obviously has her head together with the software side and seeing someone with both those talents simultaneously is nice because with a lot of electronic music folk it's usually one or the other.

 

IMO dissing someone's music because you don't like the style is wrong, and maybe even a sign of one's own insecurity. I wonder how anyone here that's posted their work in Shameless Plugs would feel if the tables were turned and their stuff was on another forum to be judged. I'll bet that if Neon Vines was a regular member here and posted those same videos we wouldn't see comments like what's been posted in this thread. What would the difference be? It's the same music! Obviously it's the personal connections fostered from participating here over time. We're nice to each other â but "strangers" are fair game for our true feelings â especially if they have a lot of youtube hits!

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I don"t know what"s wrong with our generation. They are all a bunch of hater bastards. I play with young players whenever I can. On average the energy levels are high. They on average seem to progress at a faster rate than we did. The current day knowledge availability is a game changer. Music from the 60s,70s, and 80s wasn"t frickin" Rachmaninov either.

 

It"s not just music. Old farts hate on everything. The school system is a big one. My kids went to the public high school with the worst reputation in town. They completed Calculus II their senior years. In our day that was a college sophomore course. Oh and all young people are effed up except THEIR kids. Their personal children were always raised fine.

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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Amazing, but... not surprising.

 

If anybody asks me what I DON"T DIG about something, I will tell them.

 

In case you missed it, the TITLE of this thread is Forum Dare- Tell me if/why you don't dig Neon Vines.

 

I will grant you that in retrospect it might be better if the OP posts some of their own work instead of hanging somebody they don't even know on a meathook for scrutiny.

My bad for responding at all I suppose, I will admit that mistake and try to do better in the future. Ignoring negative click bait will be a good starting point for my change.

 

Some of you whose delicate sensibilities are now injured will point out every minute detail of a keyboard that you feel falls short. You are wounding the tiny and precious feeleings of the designer, the hard working folks in the keyboard factory etc.

 

But you don't care, in fact many of you are blunt and brutal in your critique of keyboards. It is the only reason anything you say has any validity.

 

Gushing about how much you like EVERYTHING renders your opinion worthless, invalid, a Hallmark happy moment.

 

OK, you can all go back to bashing bashers now (including, presumably, myself). Water off a duck's back in the end.

 

Have fun, Happy Easter!!!

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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Seems to me--as has been pointed out several times--that the title of the thread said "tell me [...] why you don't dig." So...I answered and gave specific reasons 'why,' rather than just a generic, pablum "it's not my thing." If you want a thread without the why, then start one and invite her to comment there.

 

I stand by my statements. My daughter (in her teens) might get off on that stuff and would be inherently less critical. I don't see above-average talent. She can hit buttons on time? Seriously, guys? Seriously? Uh...isn't that what musicians do...hit keys/frets/whatever on time? If things have devolved to the point where being able to hit a key on time is a remarkable skill, then...jeez, I dunno what to think, but I'd hope that folks had higher standards. Multitasking? There are any number of one man band performers who do much more. There's a Weather Report link in another current thread where Zawinul is playing percussion (not well lit, but I think it's bongos between two of his keyboards) at the same time as keys. Emerson and Wakeman played multiple keyboards at the same time, all the time adjusting knobs and stuff. I've seen any number of players who would play and bridge over to the pitch or mod wheels with their pinky finger and do both simultaneously. I just...I just...sorry, I just don't see this "multitasking" thing at all. Pretty? She's nice enough looking, but my local Hooters can do better on an off night. I like attractive women as much as any guy, but I like looks in addition to ability--not instead of.

 

Let me ask you this: Since several people have commented on her looks. If she was ugly as homemade sin, would you still think as highly of her abilities? Just shooting from the hip, I'd guess that at least some would (if they were to answer truthfully) have to say no.

 

Tell you what, since there seems to be a disconnect between the title of the thread and the content therein, plus the fact that some people appear to be taking it personally that others are pointing out that the emperor (empress?) has no clothes, I'll bow out and leave those who feel that she's the greatest thing since sliced bread to have their say unopposed. The web is full of conversations that have gone astray due to people not being to hear other peoples' tone of voice. Emojis were an attempt to address the problem, but I don't use them because they're just as likely to be misinterpreted as words. On my end, I'm not 'speaking' harshly, but others are taking it that way because I'm not...um...fawning over the girl. If I was wild over her people would take it in stride, but because I'm not impressed, they're taking it as an attack on their opinions. It'll be easier for everyone if I leave the thread rather than get into some sort of more serious conflict.

 

Grey

I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play.

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I have already explained my reasoning for the 'provocative ' title.

 

Here is my reasoning:

 

The performer or Naked Vines had demonstrable talent and potential I was 100% impressed thus

my provocative title, a clumsy way of saying,

 

" she is so good, I see nothing to dislike ".

 

Thats the best I can communicate here in public.

 

I am perfectly ok with viewpoints on how I said, what I said.

Anyone can PM me about anything I have said, what I said, How I said, etc.

 

Its my humble request to focus on music production, keyboards discussion.

 

Music and making it is our #1 passion.

 

Have a Healthy and Happy Easter !

Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ?

My Soundcloud with many originals:

[70's Songwriter]

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I think only one other person has commented on the fact that she's not singing live in the video. There's no variation in the sound regardless of where her mouth is relative to the mic. So I'm a little less than over the moon about her walk and chew gum skills.

 

But I agree with those who said she's worthy based on her Rolli licks alone.

 

I can't say this video makes me want to see more of her, but I'm not her intended audience.

 

There's a lesson to be learned here about how to title a thread, but I won't excavate that expired equine.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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I think only one other person has commented on the fact that she's not singing live in the video. There's no variation in the sound regardless of where her mouth is relative to the mic. So I'm a little less than over the moon about her walk and chew gum skills.

 

But I agree with those who said she's worthy based on her Rolli licks alone.

 

I can't say this video makes me want to see more of her, but I'm not her intended audience.

 

There's a lesson to be learned here about how to title a thread, but I won't beat that expired equine.

 

She uses Waves Vocal Rider. Keeps the levels consistent throughout an entire performance live. Set it and go, it"s basically automatic automation.

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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S

I stand by my statements. My daughter (in her teens) might get off on that stuff and would be inherently less critical. I don't see above-average talent. She can hit buttons on time? Seriously, guys? Seriously? Uh...isn't that what musicians do...hit keys/frets/whatever on time? If things have devolved to the point where being able to hit a key on time is a remarkable skill, then...jeez, I dunno what to think, but I'd hope that folks had higher standards. Multitasking? There are any number of one man band performers who do much more. There's a Weather Report link in another current thread where Zawinul is playing percussion (not well lit, but I think it's bongos between two of his keyboards) at the same time as keys. Emerson and Wakeman played multiple keyboards at the same time, all the time adjusting knobs and stuff. I've seen any number of players who would play and bridge over to the pitch or mod wheels with their pinky finger and do both simultaneously. I just...I just...sorry, I just don't see this "multitasking" thing at all.

 

No attacks here. I want to try and explain a little further.

 

It"s more difficult than it looks. For one, it"s not really the same as playing a regular instrument on time. Loops are usually tempo-locked and they keep playing once you"ve hit the button, plus it"s a bunch of different things keeping in sync rather than one or two play buttons. Percussion loops, bass loops, synth loops, all independently triggered. I used to think this stuff was a joke until I tried doing it myself. It is a nightmare.

 

If you ever get the chance to visit a Guitar Center again, there"s usually a section with some pad controllers and computers, set up kind of like what Neon Vines is doing. Try and mess around with it and see what a mess you can make accidentally! :laugh:

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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She's not only triggering loops - she's playing one-shot samples on those pads as well.

Yep, and notes too (like the bass on the original song).

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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This is how I see it. If someone/anyone (with or without massive tits ;) manages to have a full life doing what they love the most -music in particular- , I have all the respect in this world for them . For all you know she might have handled her music life a lot better than %95 of all music forum users combined. She likes what she's doing and from what I see she's got a pretty good fan base as well. I like her, because I like successful musicians even if I don't care for their style or whatever.
www.youtube.com/c/InTheMixReviews
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OK, this has calmed down a bit - which is good. I've never come on here to fight, rather to make new friends.

 

It may be helpful to understand that I took 60 units in Photography at college.

Others may have made more intelligent choices, my hat is off to them.

 

Point is, we had Critique often - live and in person.

The Instructor would select a few student images from one of our assignments, post one on the wall and we would gather around, taking turns making comments on the image. The comments were all in the spirit of learning from our mistakes and ways of improving our results. After the students were done the Instructor would critique both the image and our critiques. He never held back, he said what he felt needed said. Once in front of the class he said to me "I am still waiting to see if you will ever make a good print." That stung but in retrospect he was spot-on.

 

I took my whuppin's gracefully, it is tough to see your "masterpiece" that you worked so hard on go down in flames but the spirit of the critique was always positive.

As mentioned above, the interwebz is really lacking in expression. It makes conversation more difficult than it should be.

That said, I've never learned one single worthwhile thing from receiving false praise. Mistakes are important, if they are descibed and a path forward comes of them.

Most of my best licks were mistakes to start with, I have a style because of error. If I'd learned to play everything just the way others did it, I would not sound like me at all.

 

I learned from those critiques, I value that straightforward, honest approach ot engendering improvement. If one is not used to it, it can be a difficult thing to accept. I forget sometimes how that can come off when you cannot see or hear how I express it.

 

I do not want sugar coating, if I am falling short I want to know how to get to the next level.

Receiving honest, heartfelt praise is priceless. Getting a "gosh, that's nice" comment can cause me to dismiss further comments from that person.

It is much easier to detect sincereity and the lack thereof in person, MUCH easier.

 

If Greg C is happy with his title I can't take that away from him, nor do I want to. I spoke my piece, I'd say the same things again.

 

I do want to correct one thing. I WAS THE ONE who mentioned that I didn't think Neon Vines was actually singing on the OP video. When Mighty Motif Max posted the video clip with Neon Vines playing the acoustic guitar and singing, the angle was completely different from the angle shown in the video in the OP. She was facing forward instead of to the side. That changed everything.

 

She had the mic off to her left side and angled. She was not singing directly into it. If you have a well-engineered cardiod pickup pattern you can do that and still get excellent sound. It is an improvement because you are not hitting the diaphragm with plosives or sibilence. A pop filter is not needed using this technique.

 

I could not see that in the video shown in the OP but that is probably how the mic was positioned. She very well could have been singing live. If you've used large diaphragm condenser mics, you've surely noticed how sensitive they are, especially when you are that close. The hgihly processed vocal tone with tons of compression and other fun tricks did not throw me at all, since she had headphones on the mic was not picking up any of the electronic music.

 

It was the lack of pops and spitting noises combined with a difficult angle to parse that led me to comment that way. Enjoy your day! Kuru

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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Like I said I know she uses Waves Vocal Rider. That mic is a U87AI I believe, so not exactly a cheap mic. Combine those and you can get a very even level.

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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By the way I"ve started a new thread with the videos I posted earlier that are now buried. People can head over there to get a better idea of what she can do. That thread is not a dare to tell everything you dislike. It"s a general thread about her instead.

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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IMO dissing someone's music because you don't like the style is wrong, and maybe even a sign of one's own insecurity.
An interesting thought. Following it down the rabbit hole ... if you don't like [jazz], you should not criticize any [jazz] player's music. Fill in the blank with the style of music you don't like â rock, pop, blues, hip hop, electronica, classical, free jazz, and on and on.

 

But I wonder: if, for instance, I don't like rap, is it fair to say that I can't criticize a bad performance when I hear one? And if I do say "that's badly performed rap music," is that a sign of my insecurity? There are some styles of music that I don't like. Still, I think I can hear when someone is playing in that style and doing a poor job.

 

I dunno ... maybe we shouldn't make generalizations. Or maybe all generalizations are wrong, including this one. :guinness:

These are only my opinions, not supported by any actual knowledge, experience, or expertise.
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Anybody can say whatever they want. These are opinions and we all know what opinions are like, right? So speaking for myself I'll just say that, no, I wouldn't offer negative criticism of another musician just because I don't like the style of music they do. If I don't like a style then I probably haven't listened to a lot of it, I probably don't know much about it, and the logical inference is that makes me unqualified to offer an intelligent and informed opinion on it. So I don't. I draw a distinction between informed opinion and uninformed opinion. The former I'm fine with, the latter not so much. Hearing "your jazz sucks" from someone who doesn't like jazz in the first place tells me everything I need to know about the person doing the criticizing. If they say "your jazz is great" that's almost worse! Of course in my younger days I probably did some of this â I'll admit it. Looking back, I believe that putting something or someone down and broadcasting those feelings to others is a way to build ourselves up a bit, to try and show others that we have a certain authority and that we should be listened to. A quest for validation. I know this about myself now, and I try to avoid it. And yes, I think that might make me a little more sensitive to it when I see it displayed like it has been a few times in this thread (IMO!!). I'll wear the snowflake cap if it makes you happy!
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