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I've felt it was inevitable and waited a while to allow more information availablity and de-bugging to occur. I'm lazy like that.
First step was to move archived resources around until I had space to create 2 bootable external drives with High Sierra and all of my applications. Done and tested, there is a path back to my safety zone if I need it.

Next step - update my Arturia, Izotope, IK Multimedia, Native Intruments and Presonus softwares. These companies all make it very easy, much appreciated. The Presonus update for Universal Control automatically brought up the latest firmware update for my Quantum interface. The Waveform DAW just came out with an upgrade, installed.

I ran the update for Catalina from the Apple App Store, you can still get High Sierra and Mojave at this point so it seemed a good time to jump in. I installed late last night, did some testing and found that Waveform 11 (just released) would play back, allow me to create drum beats from plugins but it the input from the Quantum did not work in Waveform. After trying the things that came to mind at that point, I gave up and jumped back in this morning.

Long story short, I found this page on the Sweetwater website. https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/macos-10-15-catalina-optimization-guide-for-recording/

I followed all the instructions - there are quite a few of them!!! Now it works!!!!! HUGE Kudos to Sweetwater for this resource!!! Disclaimer: I am a paying customer for Sweetwater, no other connections.

I can even use my Adobe Photoshop Elements 2018, I thought I would lose that and it's handy around here. Works fine.
Since others may have tried to get Catalina running and ended up going back to a previous system I thought I would share this.

Yes, you will probably lose your 32 bit goodies. I have way too many plugins already so it doesn't bother me. That's another project, organizing and cleaning up the plug in barrage. I've got a custom set of folders already and Waveform will keep a dozen or so of the last plugins I use in a folder at the top called Favorites. That's handy.


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Recorded some tracks last night, probably had latency set a tick to short, there were a couple of tiny pops. One more click should take care of that.

Otherwise, smooth sailing. The Joy of re-sorting plugins begins, Waveform 11 has 128 plugins included. I probably have quite a few of them sorted already.


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I've been able to use Painter 2016, Adobe Photoshop and Premier Elements 2018. Turns out they are all 64 bit but have small chunks that are 32 bit.

The same may be true for other software.

I used Go 64 and some of the applications show a yellow triangle with an exclaimation point. Clicking on that brought up a line of text at the bottom of the window.
Painter 2016 is 64 bit but the Leopard Add-On is 32 bit. Leopard was a LONG time ago.

4 year old software and it runs.

It might be smart to check all of your applications and see what is truly 32 bit. I am running some stuff that showed 32 bit but is mostly not. Digging a little deeper has been rewarding.

Go64 is free.


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Thanks for this, Kuru. I encourage other people who make the move to Catalina to post their experiences here as well.


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Today I updated to v 10.15.4, the latest update.
So far so good, one of the two folders in the Relocated Items folder on the Desktop has disappeared, which could be due to them now having a place to be.
The Configuration folder has a folder within a folder within a folder that contains 8 bits of software.

Makes my tiny brain hurt but everything works fine so I'll worry about it later or never.

Haven't had any crashes, glitches or inabilitiy to use my software. So far so good.


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One of the other guys in my IT group has been running Catalina since it was in beta... I'm sure it will be fine, but now that I actually use my MacBook for live performance, I think I'll sit with Mojave for a little while longer. Good to know I can check in here if I have questions.


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Originally Posted by samuelblupowitz
One of the other guys in my IT group has been running Catalina since it was in beta... I'm sure it will be fine, but now that I actually use my MacBook for live performance, I think I'll sit with Mojave for a little while longer. Good to know I can check in here if I have questions.

I'm happy to help to the extent I am able. I got most of my useful answers from the Sweetwater page above. All the procedures I describe in the OP that I did are just common sense safety backups.
If you are running Mojave you've got more time. I wanted to move up from High Sierra, hard to say how long it will be posted.

Again, I was surprised that my Painter 2016 software runs perfectly fine. I got it when it first came out, introductory upgrade. Since I haven't used it much but it is a fantastic program, I kept it to see what it would do. Nary a glitch.
So you are probably safe to prepare and upgrade during this time of self quarantine. We have zero gigs on the books up here, guessing you are in the same boat?

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/macos-10-15-catalina-optimization-guide-for-recording/


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After the latest update I needed to go to System Preferences > Security & Privacy > Privacy > Microphone and allow Waveform to use "my microphones".

I updated both Catalina and Waveform so not sure the source but it's fixed.


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The added security stuff can be a little annoying. I haven't figured out how to whitelist certain websites so you don't get an "are you sure?" EVERY time you want to download something...


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Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
The added security stuff can be a little annoying. I haven't figured out how to whitelist certain websites so you don't get an "are you sure?" EVERY time you want to download something...

Safari - Preferences - Websites select Downloads in the left column and you should be able to adjust the overall setting as well as for each website you've previously downloaded from.

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I'm still on macOS 10.13 (High Sierra). I've heard the stories about Catalina and I appreciate this thread and its resources. My question is can I safely go from macOS 10.13 (High Sierra) to 10.4 (Mojave) without any glitches or problems? I'm trying to take this one step at a time. I just ordered some software that requires 10.4 or greater is the reason I ask.

After finding this thread, I am considering taking a chance and just go ahead and updating to Catalina (and will eventually anyway) based on what I'm seeing in this thread. Or I may wait for a few more people to adopt it before taking the plunge.



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Originally Posted by midinut
I'm still on macOS 10.13 (High Sierra). I've heard the stories about Catalina and I appreciate this thread and its resources. My question is can I safely go from macOS 10.13 (High Sierra) to 10.4 (Mojave) without any glitches or problems? I'm trying to take this one step at a time. I just ordered some software that requires 10.4 or greater is the reason I ask.

After finding this thread, I am considering taking a chance and just go ahead and updating to Catalina (and will eventually anyway) based on what I'm seeing in this thread. Or I may wait for a few more people to adopt it before taking the plunge.


Hi midinut,
At the very least, I highly recommend you consider creating your "path back home" while High Sierra is still available from Apple's App Store.
If you don't have a spare hard drive, get one. Use Disk Utilities to prepare it for Mac OS and then run the installation. At a certain point in the installation you will be asked if you want to copy anything from your boot drive. Click yes and then click on the options you want to copy. At the very least, copy your Applications.

Even if you wait a while to go to Catalina or even just move to Mohave, you can run all of your current software by plugging in the backup drive, restarting the computer and holding down the Option key. That will give you the option to boot from the external drive with a copy of all of your Appllications. I would test this as soon as you've created the external boot drive, then you know you have a way to keep your present workflow.

That's what I did and I haven't had to use it at all. I was pretty surprised that Painter 2016 worked fine but it did.

Catalina is fairly mature now, I waited but I don't regret moving to it at all or skipping Mojave.

I would also recommend using the link in the OP to go to the page on the Sweetwater website with all the handy tips and tricks for using Catalina. When that page is open, go to File > Print in your browser (both Safari and Firefox have this, probably others do too). In the lower left corner is a button that says PDF, the drop down menu will have "Save As PDF". Save that onto both of your drives and even if they eventually take it down you will have it handy.

Hope all this helps!!! Cheers, Kuru


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Thanks Kuru:

I've got a boatload of VSTs that I'm worried may or may not yet be compatible with Catalina (which is why I haven't taken the plunge yet). Most of the major players (Native Instruments, Arturia, Spectrasonics, Steinberg, Ableton, and of course all the Apple stuff. I didn't see High Sierra or Mojave either one in the App Store. The only OS option is Catalina (for me), unless I'm doing something stupid. What do we know of VSTs that WILL NOT run on Catalina? If all my stuff is going to work fine under Catalina, I would just as soon skip Mojave and go straight to Catalina. Let me research myself which software is not working on Catalina yet.

I will for sure save and print out that Sweetwater guide posted above. Thanks again for the heads up!



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Go here:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208969

Down the page there is a link to High Sierra. Step 4, the sentence below the box about Catalina has the High Sierra link, it will open App Store.
App Store had a pop-up ad with a Continue button. It took me straight to an installable High Sierra.

So it is still there - get it while you can!

Mojave is not that big of an upgrade, I'd create backups and just skip right to Catalina. High Sierra works fine. I'm sure you could find Mojave if you really want it and make your backup disk with that.
Then if your VSTs don't work you still have a bootable disk you can use them on.

I used Go64 software - it's free.

https://www.stclairsoft.com/Go64/

It quickly sorted which of my software files contained 32 bit data. What it didn't tell me was that some of my software had non-essential chunks that were 32 bit and the rest was 64 bit. If I recall correctly, Painter 2016 had a bit that allowed it to work in a much older OS X system. All the stuff that doesn't work in Catalina will end up in a folder on your desktop called Relocated Items. I've still got way too many plugins, am sorting them into Custom folders according to type. Waveform sorted them into their folder system but it didn't always make as much sense to me as my system. It's a LOT of work!!!
I do use plugins but I have way too many that I don't use. I give them a spin and if they offer something I really like I keep. If not, I want as much stuff gone as I can possibly get rid of!!!!
Plugin clutter is just a waste of time in my opinion.

You can also go to About this Mac > Overview > System Report (it's near the bottom of the window just right of the center) and find your various bits but it isn't nearly as fast or easy as Go64.
Neither of them will really tell you what actually runs and what does not. I can't say I miss anything that wouldn't work, I've never been tempted to use my backup drive. Still glad to have one though!

I've long since stopped using VSTs if an AU version is offered. By the way, the Apple system has some nice AU plugins included. I am a big fan of AUNew Pitch and the aUGraphic EQ - there are many more that I haven't explored yet.


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Thanks for all the help and guidance. I am going through a compatibility checking for all my hardware and software to see if they are compliant or not. THAT will take a day or two. lol
I have been using Logic Pro X ever since I got my MacBook but I bought into Cubase back around SX version on the PC and have a bunch invested. It has some amazing plug-ins as well. And after all, they are the ones who started this whole VST thing in the first place! I added Absolute 4 VST Collection a few years ago. Since Yamaha bought Steinberg, I have about all the sounds in my VSTs that I have in my hardware. I also have Arturia V-Collection 7 and that adds just about every synth I ever lusted after to my collection.

Who would have thought or imagined all this 30-40 years ago?



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As I've mentioned, be aware that something may come up incompatible and still work.
My Adobe Elements Software had some sort of Adobe website browser - more a marketing thing than a useful tool
It was 32 bit. Photoshop and Premiere Elements run fine, they are 64 bit. I just can't use the thing I don't really want anyway.

It's never a bad idea to have a backup of your files. I've got a couple of those too. Replacing all that work would be impossible, passing it along from drive to drive is pretty cheap insurance.


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I found a guide in the Apple Support forum on how to upgrade from High Sierra to Mojave. I think I may take that approach for starters. I recently purchased Steinberg's VST Connect Pro in hopes that my band and I can do some recording while we are quarantined. It requires macOS Mojave or later (which means it works with Catalina too). I have done a Time Machine backup already and will give it a shot. I eventually will upgrade to Catalina, but when I did check compatibility on all my software, there are still a few stragglers that haven't made their stuff compliant yet. Nothing mission critical mind you. More of the rare boutique stuff.



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Sound good! Bear in mind they may err on the side of caution.

I did wait for the latest update to Waveform 11 before jumping in although I've been using the 64 bit version since 8 and 10 does run fine on Catalina.

Upward and sidewayser!!!! Cheers, Kuru


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And now for a tale of misery and loathing!!!

From out of nowhere today, my cursor started jumping around erratically, even if I was not touching the mouse. I unplugged it and kept my hands away from the trackpad, same thing.
A booger!!!!
I ran Avast, a free virus scan. Didn't find anything. I did a bit of cleanup I've been meaning to do anyway, still nothing. I managed to reboot to the High Sierra backup sector I have on the same computer.
I ran that virus scan and it found two things. I tossed them, booted back to Catalina. No love.

The cursor leaping everywhere was driving me insane. I backed up my desktop on an external drive. I have everything else on there too, installers for software, all the recordings, etc.
Googled "reinstall Catalina" since trying to use the App Store was madness with the cursor jumping.
Instructions were to restart and hold down Command and R. I did that.

It installed Mojave!!!! That which cannot be done by mortals is done with impunity by Apple. Perhaps a sign that they've given up on Catalina completely and want it to go away.

I went with with it. Usually a reinstall leaves everything more or less intact. Not this time, it hosed the Applications folder. So I have some reinstalling to do to get back up and running.
The cursor was a bit squirrelly at first but is behaving now, perhaps the computer took my unseemly language to heart and is complying in sheer terror.

I will concede that Catalina may be fraught with peril. I apologize if anybody got optimistic and plunged in, Good Luck!!!!


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Seems like things keep getting more and more complicated to fix after they break themselves. When I first started playing with computers (I've always been on the Intel/Microsoft side), I had MS-DOS 2.1 installed on a floppy drive. If something went wrong, I'd just copy the original set of operating system files on a new floppy disk, copy all the rest of the files on the floppy to the new one, and I'd be up and running again. We can't do that any more.

As for me, the attic fan in my house became flaky a couple of weeks ago, then finally quit. After a few hours of troubleshooting in the attic on my hands and knees, I managed to wrestle the motor out of hiding, opened up the cover where the wires went into the motor housing, and saw deteriorated insulation, a few burned wires, and in general, a mess. I dug out the leads that went from the terminal board to the motor windings, tried connecting power to them to see if there was something I could repair, and that blew the circuit breaker shortly after smoke and flame came out of the opposite end of the motor. So I decided it was time for a new motor.

My local Grainger was open for business, had a suitable replacement motor in stock, and I was pleased to find that the form factor hadn't changed significantly since the 50+ year old motor I was replacing. But a couple of differences of 1/4" between the old and new motors meant I need to rebuild the motor mounting block and get a slightly shorter belt between the motor and fan pulleys. The last PITA hurtle was that I didn't remember which direction the fan blades needed to turn, but there was only one way to mount the motor. So I bolted everything down enough so it would stay in place when powered up, and, sure enough, the fan sucked. So it was one more motor extraction, swap a couple of leads inside (it was impossible to get to the power leads and wires that needed to be swapped to reverse the motor), put it back together, and finally it was working.

Started the job on Saturday, finished on Wednesday. Fortunately a few of those days were fairly cool, but still by Noon, it got too hot enough to work up there.

Frankly, I'd rather work on a computer.

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YikeS!!! Mike, me too!!!
It's nice just clicking the "Install" button and doing something else while the computer chugs along.

I had a job in Fresno installing phone systems, which could mean crawling around in a attic full of fluffy pink fiberglass.
I learned how to punch down backboards quickly so I had more important work to do.

On a 105 degree day, you could roast like a chicken up there and nobody would know until you were desiccated.


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Not to belabor the point but I am really glad now that I made my own list of passwords and kept copies off line. That is coming in really handy right now.

I am also re-evaluating what plugins I've use and want. Scarbee Rickenbacker is pretty cool but over 6gb and I have 2 nice basses AND a Tech 21 Bass Driver, the newer version.
I like real bass and don't play keyboards for crap so I don't need a bass guitar plugin taking up space. It won't be reinstalled.


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I'm getting a new MacBook sometime next week, to replace my old work MacBook (a 2014 that I had running Mojave; it had belonged to my predecessor at work so I'm pleased it lasted as long as it did). We'll see how I feel about Catalina when the new one arrives!


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Originally Posted by SamuelBLupowitz
I'm getting a new MacBook sometime next week, to replace my old work MacBook (a 2014 that I had running Mojave; it had belonged to my predecessor at work so I'm pleased it lasted as long as it did). We'll see how I feel about Catalina when the new one arrives!


I am using a refurbished 2014 MacBook Pro and it was running great on Catalina, until it wasn't.
Still a couple of "twitchy glitches" with Mojave but the cursor is now steady. I think I may need to shuffle things around a bit and add a keyboard back to the mix.

A newer computer should be better and as I said, I ran Catalina for quite a while and it was fine. The latest update (which I set for my permission, won't happen) was to re-install Catalina.
I think I'll say here. Maybe shop around for a used Billy G Box to surf the inter webs and just disconnect this one. I might put it in a different spot in the room if not for the internet connection (cable).

System 11 will be here soon, I'm sure they will have fixed most of the boogers. I'd wait until version 11.1 though... on the cutting edge there is pain.


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Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
System 11 will be here soon, I'm sure they will have fixed most of the boogers. I'd wait until version 11.1 though... on the cutting edge there is pain.
Yes, I try to stay on a similar schedule to my office (which is a Mac shop on a campus that is more dominantly Windows): wait a full calendar year after the new OS drops before updating.

Of course, the way it's been, that means we tend to update right before the next new OS drops. But it keeps me from having to spend my days in the computer lab, helping figure out why students can't record audio or some other nonsense that was working fine before. Or at least it did, back when I went into the office, and our computer labs were open...


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Still experiencing occasional cursor drift.
Hunting down the source, there has to be a reason for it.

I have no valid reason to suspect Siri but I dislike Her and that will suffice.
I told Siri that I did not love her but her sister was cute.

I commanded her to go away forever and never come back. She does not obey.
I attempted to launch her square into the Trash but she simply cannot be placed there, more's the pity.

Back to the problem I guess...


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Went into preferences and shut of Siri, Mission Control, WIFI and Bluetooth.
Bluetooth showed an active mouse, it was not mine.
Hopefully I killed all annoyances.


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For whatever reason, I am back on Catalina and everything is working well. I lost the Adobe Elements Photoshop/Elements programs, the only thing I miss is the batch processor in Photoshop.
I plan on downloading the free DaVinci video editor anyway, Premiere on a Mac is not great.

Someday I may buy last year's Photoshop Elements, maybe this year or maybe next year. I've been getting things done with Preview, a bit slower but I'm not in full on production mode anyway.


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Why don't you look at one of the Photoshop competitors, like Pixelmator or Affinity Photo? I've been using a version of Pixelmator for a years now. I was never a PS power user, just needing a convenient tool to do basic image creation and editing, and Pixelmator is probably much more powerful than I use it for. I think I saw they just made it scriptable via AppleScript!


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Originally Posted by Joe Muscara
Why don't you look at one of the Photoshop competitors, like Pixelmator or Affinity Photo? I've been using a version of Pixelmator for a years now. I was never a PS power user, just needing a convenient tool to do basic image creation and editing, and Pixelmator is probably much more powerful than I use it for. I think I saw they just made it scriptable via AppleScript!


Thanks for the tip! Will it do batch processing? Since I primarily post things I am selling online even the setting for the smallest file still makes a bigger file than I need.
Elements would process a huge number of images with just a couple of clicks.

Other than that, I started on Photoshop 1.07 in the early 1990s at college and know it really well. I don't have to do much thinking to get results in Elements.
So yeah, a learning curve thing. I will take a look though and see if it clicks. Some software is just easy and other stuff seems indecipherable.


There is never enough time to be in a hurry...
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