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Moog One Survey


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I just completed a survey from Moog directed to One owners which seems to indicate that they're considering a version with a stripped-down feature set. The questions were about usage of cv i/o and the sequencer, how much I use it as a midi controller, how much it's controlled by other midi controllers, whether I use expression/sustain pedals or the sub outputs. They asked for additional sequencer features we'd want, but my guess is they'd ditch it in a skinny version . So, how would you design a Moog Point Five and how would you price it?

9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it

 

 

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Hopefully you are not violating an NDA...

 

Eight Voice - maybe only two oscillators per voice

Better sounding VCOs, as Markyboard put it, more "balls"

Retain dual filter structure

Slim down or even delete sequencer functionality

Retain a basic arrpegiator

Maybe simplify, or lose the effects entirely (unless they can be implemented properly)

No fans?

Still need a 5-Octave controller, no 4 octaves please

 

$2999-3400

 

Oh, and I personally wouldn"t mind a desktop expander-like module for use with my own controller...

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Hopefully you are not violating an NDA...

 

Nope. It's all over GS. My changes would be like yours. Lose the multitimbrality, keep the 3 vcos, go down to 2 lfos, ditch the sequencer, the whole FX section, and maybe even the xyz pad. Asking about i/o speaks to real estate and makes me wonder if they're thinking module or 4 octave board with a cheaper cabinet. Seems to work for Dave Smith. ;)

9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it

 

 

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I did not take it that way at all.

I saw it as getting feedback to be used in allocating development resources in the short term, to focus on the improvements and features most desired.

 

The survey went to owners only, I believe, who would not exactly be the market for a stripped down version. Your line of thinking, planning for a new product, did not cross my mind at all. I am not saying you are wrong, just that it did not strike me that way while taking the survey. An interesting thought.

 

I could absolutely see them coming out with a new poly like you suggest, in the same niche as the P6/OB6, maybe slightly more expensive.

Moog The One, VV 64 EP, Wurlies 200A 140 7300, Forte 7, Mojo 61, OB-6, Prophet 6, Polaris, Hammond A100, Farfisa VIP, ,Young Chang 6', Voyager, E7 Clav, Midiboard, Linnstrument, Seaboard
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I did not take it that way at all.

I saw it as getting feedback to be used in allocating development resources in the short term, to focus on the improvements and features most desired.

 

Which would be very nice. I spent a couple of years in MI and can't help thinking about the next product, and since their newest release is a repackaging of an existing instrument, it seemed like a rational conclusion. But hey, no matter how they use the data, everybody wins.

 

 

9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it

 

 

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Pardon me for being cynical, but it sounds as though they're not selling as many Ones as they projected. Or, to put it more bluntly, they're asking "Where did we go wrong?" just in more oblique terms.

 

Yes, it's normal to leverage a circuit topology into as many new models as the market will bear--that's not my point. My point is the survey itself. That's not normal. When's the last time you saw a survey about how a business should proceed after buying a refrigerator, a clock radio, a [fill in the blank]? Never, or close to it. I can only think of one similar case off the top of my head. If someone's got a product that's selling, they know what they're doing, they know where they're going, and they'll keep selling it, alongside as many variants as possible.

 

As I've said elsewhere, I'm worried about Moog. I love their stuff, but am seeing signs that they've lost their way.

 

Grey

I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play.

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For whatever reasons (and it could be planned) it sounds like the One is nearing the end of it's production run, and Moog is casting about for what to do next. Something with the feature set and price range of a Prophet 6 or OB6 might work - if it's got what players perceive a Moog should sound like this time. That was the key to the success of the Prophet 6 and OB6 - they sounded like they belonged in the lineage of their respective brands.

 

Heck even One owners would be tempted by that. There are players who own several different Dave Smith polysynths because they each bring something different to the table.

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Pardon me for being cynical, but it sounds as though they're not selling as many Ones as they projected. Or, to put it more bluntly, they're asking "Where did we go wrong?" just in more oblique terms.

 

Yes, it's normal to leverage a circuit topology into as many new models as the market will bear--that's not my point. My point is the survey itself. That's not normal. When's the last time you saw a survey about how a business should proceed after buying a refrigerator, a clock radio, a [fill in the blank]? Never, or close to it. I can only think of one similar case off the top of my head. If someone's got a product that's selling, they know what they're doing, they know where they're going, and they'll keep selling it, alongside as many variants as possible.

 

As I've said elsewhere, I'm worried about Moog. I love their stuff, but am seeing signs that they've lost their way.

 

Grey

 

I am not anticipating any new features in either my Refrigerator nor Clock Radio, but there is ongoing development on the Moog One firmware. I HAVE gotten similar surveys from software companies, specifically to help determine which features should be worked on.

They also, I believe, sold MORE than expected, hence the lengthy delay in meeting demand for pre-orders.

 

Sorry if this comes off as argumentative - not intended that way- and just my 2 cents.

Moog The One, VV 64 EP, Wurlies 200A 140 7300, Forte 7, Mojo 61, OB-6, Prophet 6, Polaris, Hammond A100, Farfisa VIP, ,Young Chang 6', Voyager, E7 Clav, Midiboard, Linnstrument, Seaboard
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At first, I wanted a One because of the surface attributes: beautiful, well-made, a poly-Moog, etc. But, my Solaris covers all that ground and then more. No, it isn't exact. But it covers that territory and lots more. And I decided that I already have dream analog synths. My interest is in digital things like the Quantum, the Osmose, etc at this point. I have thought about getting one as a long term investment, but I've never really done that. I've expected instruments to be played.
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Eric Levy (current Night Ranger touring keyboardist, and keyboardist with Under The Street Lamp) has a Moog One.

 

He posts all kinds of cool video of himself doing improvisations in his studio.

 

Here's an example

[video:youtube]

 

The this one he did as a bit of a tribute to Neil Peart. He really digs into the Moog One a few minutes in.

 

[video:youtube]

David

Gig Rig:Casio Privia PX-5S | Yamaha MODX+ 6 | MacBook Pro 14" M1| Mainstage

 

 

 

 

 

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Eric is a monster player. He also seems to be a man after my own heart in that watching his Moog One videos over time, he has slowly developed a signature sound on the instrument, rather than making a thousand patches that all sound different. That is similar at least to what I STRIVE to do - a small palette of "instruments" created on the One that evolve over time and have variety unto themselves. In the way that a Hammond is one instrument that has a huge range of expression, but is still a Hammond, I like to think of the One as being able to create a few distinct instruments with a similar range and their own personality,

Lofty goals that I will never reach, but some kind of a roadmap to my approach,

Of course some days it all goes out the window and I bang out a bunch of fun and weird patches for the hell of it. ;)

 

Moog The One, VV 64 EP, Wurlies 200A 140 7300, Forte 7, Mojo 61, OB-6, Prophet 6, Polaris, Hammond A100, Farfisa VIP, ,Young Chang 6', Voyager, E7 Clav, Midiboard, Linnstrument, Seaboard
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They also, I believe, sold MORE than expected, hence the lengthy delay in meeting demand for pre-orders.

 

I really hope this is the case. I think I can speak for all of us that we want what's best for Moog.

 

I just completed a survey from Moog directed to One owners which seems to indicate that they're considering a version with a stripped-down feature set. The questions were about usage of cv i/o and the sequencer, how much I use it as a midi controller, how much it's controlled by other midi controllers, whether I use expression/sustain pedals or the sub outputs. They asked for additional sequencer features we'd want, but my guess is they'd ditch it in a skinny version . So, how would you design a Moog Point Five and how would you price it?

 

A Moog .5 without a sequencer, all the ins and outs, and a price more in line with a Prophet 6? Yeah I'd be interested.

 

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Unless Moog specifically mentioned future products, it could be an effort to prioritize bug fixes for current owners. The sequencer supposedly has timing issues, the FX gain is wonky, etc.

 

The text of the email read, "In the spirit of continual improvement, we look to our creative family to help guide the next evolution of Moog instruments." Phil focused on "continual improvement" and I focused on "evolution of Moog instruments," plural. So it's vague enough to go either way. I'm down with whatever.

 

David-- Thanks for those Eric Levy videos. He's killing it. And yeah, he's getting his own sound out of it and it's ferocious. I'll dig deeper into his stuff.

 

Grey and Bill H-- As of 8/26/19 Moog had shipped 2k units. I don't know how that's divided between the two configurations. But 2k in 10 months isn't shabby. It's not time to hang crepe.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it

 

 

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Aye, but if they'd expected to ship, say, 5k Model Ones by that date then 2k comes up rather short. The 2000 unit figure lacks context; the number in isolation doesn't impress me. It may be a good number or it may be disappointing to the powers that be. Either way, they'll tout it as being good--admitting that sales are coming up short ain't likely to happen. My views on Moog's corporate health and vision for the future aren't based on just my subjective impression of the One--I'm seeing a lot of disparate things that seem to me to paint a worrisome picture. Don't get me wrong, I adore Moog and have four of their products. I want them to be around for the long run, but Bob's gone and they seem to be trending in a different direction. I just hope they know what they're doing.

 

Grey

I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play.

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Unless Moog specifically mentioned future products, it could be an effort to prioritize bug fixes for current owners. The sequencer supposedly has timing issues, the FX gain is wonky, etc.
Yeah, you are probably correct. But I was also under the impression that Moog had a "road map" that they were following with regard to bug fixes, updates, etc. As someone prominent in the MI world told me not too long ago, "they aren't the same company they were when Bob ran it!"

 

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Just for fun (and comparison) I looked up the production run and number of units sold for several classic flagship analog polysynths. My guess is that Moog's corporate size and target numbers would be more in line with manufacturers of 40 years ago rather than today's Behringer (for example).

 

Source: Juilan Colbeck's excellent Keyfax Omnibus.

 

Yamaha CS80: 2000 (1978-1980)

Roland Jupiter 8: 2000 (1981-1984)

Rhodes Chroma: 3000 (1982-1983)

Moog Memorymoog: 3500 (1982-1985)

 

As far as I know these were all considered successes, and if Moog sold 2000 Ones in just 10 months... well they're in pretty good company.

 

Back in those days Dave Smith hit it out of the park with the Prophet 5 (8000 units and a six year production run) but that was a groundbreaking product that hit the market at just the right time.

 

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Rhodes Chroma: 3000 (1982-1983)

 

 

Hmmm...wonder if this one is correct...

Seems a bit high especially since the production lasted

only one year?

 

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Arthur Schopenhauer

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Rhodes Chroma: 3000 (1982-1983)

 

 

Hmmm...wonder if this one is correct...

Seems a bit high especially since the production lasted

only one year?

 

That's the number Phil Dodds gave, and he would know.

 

Yeah, Phil would know..

 

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Arthur Schopenhauer

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