Jump to content


Please note: You can easily log in to MPN using your Facebook account!

New California law for freelance musicians...


Recommended Posts



  • Replies 50
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

My first reaction would be to consider forming an LLC and doing business as the LLC instead of as an individual. For federal taxes, I believe there is a threshold of $600 before a 1099 is required to be sent, which should reduce the reporting requirements for small engagements. Of course, LLC laws vary by state and I have no idea what the costs and rules are for LLCs in CA.

Nord Stage 3 HA88, Nord Stage 3 Compact, Casio CT-S1, Radial Key Largo, Westone AM Pro 30, Rolls PM55P, K&M 18880 + 18881, Bose S1 Pro, JBL 305p MKII, Zoom Q2n-4K

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For federal taxes, I believe there is a threshold of $600 before a 1099 is required to be sent, which should reduce the reporting requirements for small engagements. Of course, LLC laws vary by state and I have no idea what the costs and rules are for LLCs in CA.

Pretty sure that's $600 per individual per year - not per transaction.

 

Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.

-Mark Twain

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From where I sit as a gigging weekend warrior, I don't see evidence that this is likely to affect shmucks like me. No one has breathed a word about this regarding my usual gigs. Laws like these are not self-enforcing. If the government doesn't show signs that it's serious about enforcement against a particular sector, folks are likely to go about their business as usual.

 

 

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For federal taxes, I believe there is a threshold of $600 before a 1099 is required to be sent, which should reduce the reporting requirements for small engagements. Of course, LLC laws vary by state and I have no idea what the costs and rules are for LLCs in CA.

Pretty sure that's $600 per individual per year - not per transaction.

Correct. $600 paid over course of a year.

https://www.irs.gov/instructions/i1099msc

 

 

Nord Stage 3 HA88, Nord Stage 3 Compact, Casio CT-S1, Radial Key Largo, Westone AM Pro 30, Rolls PM55P, K&M 18880 + 18881, Bose S1 Pro, JBL 305p MKII, Zoom Q2n-4K

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The thing that gets me is if you look at the list of independent contractor types that are exempt its full of the type of people it's like they are intenticially going after musicians and music teacher who teach out of a music store. So many gigs have been killed by BMI and ASCAP combined with city government going after small bars and restaurants that used to have live music try to charge the businesses. They say they are protected composers, but like streaming how are they protecting a composer when they just want a flat fee for per month. Then cities are hitting places want to force them to get cabaret licenses for having live music on weekends.

 

Remember when music was everywhere all types of retail stores would have a radio or a CD player in the background to give the store some atmosphere. That's disappear because of BMI and ASCAP going after little businesses again for a flat fee for playing a radio in the store. The music business is killing the music business.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From where I sit as a gigging weekend warrior, I don't see evidence that this is likely to affect shmucks like me. No one has breathed a word about this regarding my usual gigs. Laws like these are not self-enforcing. If the government doesn't show signs that it's serious about enforcement against a particular sector, folks are likely to go about their business as usual.

 

 

Maybe so. I'm sure that's the case with bunch of laws that we haven't even heard of. This one though has the potential to turn into a fine-collecting resource.... I hope you're right.

www.youtube.com/c/InTheMixReviews
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The thing that gets me is if you look at the list of independent contractor types that are exempt its full of the type of people it's like they are intenticially going after musicians and music teacher who teach out of a music store. So many gigs have been killed by BMI and ASCAP combined with city government going after small bars and restaurants that used to have live music try to charge the businesses. They say they are protected composers, but like streaming how are they protecting a composer when they just want a flat fee for per month. Then cities are hitting places want to force them to get cabaret licenses for having live music on weekends.

 

Remember when music was everywhere all types of retail stores would have a radio or a CD player in the background to give the store some atmosphere. That's disappear because of BMI and ASCAP going after little businesses again for a flat fee for playing a radio in the store. The music business is killing the music business.

+ 1000

 

Have never understood going after restaurants/bars for this. More understandable for radio play, but live music? Live music is already disappearing, no additional obstacles needed!

Numa Piano X73 /// Kawai ES920 /// Casio CT-X5000 /// Yamaha EW425

Yamaha Melodica and Alto Recorder

QSC K8.2 // JBL Eon One Compact // Soundcore Motion Boom Plus 

Win10 laptop i7 8GB // iPad Pro 9.7" 32GB

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Exactly! Although it did make a come-back at farmer's markets after the initial run on those a few years back. I can't go into detail in case someone from BMI or ASCAP is reading this.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok here's what you do. Form music based non profit charities in which the band members are on staff. The charitable organization spreads joyful love and spiritual wellbeing through sound therapy. The service is provided to venues on the understanding that they make donations, possibly tax deductible. You can even call it love gifts. I think some other industry does this but I don't recall the details.

FunMachine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All of Californians have been talking about this law bigtime on Facebook.

 

But I'm afraid this kinda violates our rule about talking politics on the forum ?

Kawai C-60 Grand Piano : Hammond A-100 : Hammond SK2 : Yamaha CP4 : Yamaha Montage 7 : Moog Sub 37

 

My latest album: Funky organ, huge horn section

https://bobbycressey.bandcamp.com/album/cali-native

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We can talk about the economic aspect as that is just life. But I have already sensed a few comments are veering into political territory.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So many California gigs are pay-to-play these days where the band is issued a certain amount of tickets to sell. If they can't sell the tickets they have to pay for them out-of-pocket if they want whatever exposure the gig provides. This applies mainly to original bands without much of a following. As far as making a living the California (and surrounding states) cover band scene dried up in the early 90's when the clubs, restaurants, hotels, etc. that had live music five nights a week went bankrupt. Which is the reason I relocated to the East Coast where there are decent theater, festival, casino, and Jersey Shore gigs to be had. Many of the California musicians I know who are still doing it for a living have formed tribute bands and travel across the country to get good paying theater and casino gigs. This has been going on for many years since there are few local California gigs that pay enough to sustain career musicians. Relatively, there is so little money involved in the local California cover band scene that the state has little to gain from regulation with enforcement costs likely outweighing any return from prosecution. If anything clubs that have a particular local band in maybe once a month would have to hire the same band every weekend or more likely eliminate live music.
C3/122, M102A, Vox V301H, Farfisa Compact, Gibson G101, GEM P, RMI 300A, Piano Bass, Pianet , Prophet 5 rev. 2, Pro-One, Matrix 12, OB8, Korg MS20, Jupiter 6, Juno 60, PX-5S, Nord Stage 3 Compact
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it will be enforced out or sheer meanness. I did a weekly gig a few months back for $30 and a couple beers. It was fun until it wasn't. Then I quit. Now my beers will be taxed. And I'll pay for someone's uh...elective surgery when 25% of my $30 is withheld. I guess pay to play is now better. You can't tax red ink. Or can you?

FunMachine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:facepalm: This is why I'm not going to go into music as a full-time profession. Underappreciated, unstable, and constantly stepped on. :freak:

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is a waiver (sign away your rights) we can sign and submit for various venues as needed to get around it. Basically we relinquish our right to sue under the new law.

Who has a link for the waiver form???

 Find 660 of my jazz piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Harry was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book."

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is a waiver (sign away your rights) we can sign and submit for various venues as needed to get around it. Basically we relinquish our right to sue under the new law.

Who has a link for the waiver form???

I"m not a lawyer, but two entities cannot typically circumvent an existing law by signing agreement that is contrary to the law. Otherwise, what"s to stop any company from requiring its employees to sign a waiver and work as independent contractors? Have any attorneys weighed in on the law as it applies to musicians?

 

Also, for anyone who wants to read it, here"s a link to the text of the current bill:

https://legiscan.com/CA/text/AB5/id/2054107

Nord Stage 3 HA88, Nord Stage 3 Compact, Casio CT-S1, Radial Key Largo, Westone AM Pro 30, Rolls PM55P, K&M 18880 + 18881, Bose S1 Pro, JBL 305p MKII, Zoom Q2n-4K

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Much of bar gigs is under the table anyways. I know for a fact a good portion of the collected cover charge ends up in pockets in pants not worn by me. So in that scenerio I'm not an employee or a subcontractor. I'm renting the venue and hiring the doorman to collect my cover.

FunMachine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Much of bar gigs is under the table anyways. I know for a fact a good portion of the collected cover charge ends up in pockets in pants not worn by me. So in that scenerio I'm not an employee or a subcontractor. I'm renting the venue and venue provides the doorman to collect my cover.

FunMachine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is a waiver (sign away your rights) we can sign and submit for various venues as needed to get around it. Basically we relinquish our right to sue under the new law.

Who has a link for the waiver form???

 

I'm a government lawyer who enforces regulations. My field is environment, but the concepts are universal. Though I haven't researched this issue, but my off the cuff reaction is that someone is giving out laughable legal advice. Waivers and arguments about "renting the venue" will not protect you if you become a target of enforcement. The only real question here is how extensive will enforcement be? How far down the gig foodchain will the government go? It's not unusual that a legislature will pass a law but will not appropriate enough resources to enforce it to it's full extent. It's also not unusual that the people charged with enforcing that law will not be interested in full and complete enforcement. How often do you see pedestrians being cited for jaywalking?

 

My gigs are pretty low profile. The more steady and high profile your gig is, the more likely you and/or your venue are to become a priority for enforcement.

 

I edited this entire post after giving it further thought.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a useful thread, at least for Californians. The law is what it is, so it's useful to talk about how to deal with it. People's views on whether the law is a good idea would just be useless venting.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We had something similar happen in The Netherlands in the late 90"s or early 00"s. Tax collectors/reviewers dislike irregularities and inefficiencies, and the gig economy is obviously irregular by nature. So the Dutch 'solution' was to entice people to become one-man LLC"s (so-called ZZP"ers) with tax breaks, streamlined/simplified filing etc.

 

I understand why CA is doing this, there are legit reasons to regulate the likes of Uber etc. Musicians are just an unfortunate casualty. Like in The Netherlands, the idea is that we all become one-man LLC"s (or S-corps or whatever) and make every payment a business-to-business transaction. Of course, unlike The Netherlands, CA is not offering any incentives that I"m aware of, and there"s the $800 flat tax you have to pay annually as an LLC.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Assemblywoman Lorena Gonzalez, author of AB5 "expressed willingness to create a 'clean up bill" and add clarification for the music community - essentially carving out certain music professionals from the law. She explained that come January 6th when the Assembly is back in session, they can get to work on drafting language for the new Bill and once the language is agreed upon by all interested parties (us, RIAA, A2IM, AFM), they will vote on it. She did say that it will be voted on before September 1st (the deadline), but we shouldn"t expect it much sooner - these things take time."

https://aristake.com/post/gonzalez-meeting?fbclid=IwAR2SGuTK5ecXQ39vA2RuW2xygi0DBQ3opL4lYKYaOmKjcvDUStW_PVmMauQ

These are only my opinions, not supported by any actual knowledge, experience, or expertise.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...