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Thinking about buying a powered speaker. #3018092 12/02/19 02:11 AM
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KeyboardEric Offline OP
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The time has come and of course I am on a budget.

Someone recommended this Alto TS308 to me:

https://www.guitarcenter.com/Alto/TS308-8-2-Way-Powered-Loudspeaker.gc#productDetail

I was also looking at this Behringer Eurolive F1220D:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...live-f1220d-250w-12-inch-powered-speaker

It's primarily for practices and the odd gig where there aren't enough house wedges to go around. My guitar player owns a PA so I can always borrow one of his QSC K10s if needed but it'd be nice to have my own. He also warned me against the Alto speaker even though others have recommended it. I don't think I can really afford a QSC K10 right now. Any thoughts or suggestions out there? I run mono through a Roland VR 730 and Korg Kross 2. Thanks.

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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018095 12/02/19 02:22 AM
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Lots of discussion around here on that topic. What is your max budget?


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018096 12/02/19 02:27 AM
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Do a tour of Seattle pawnshops and music stores. Keep an eye out for an older Peavey keyboard amp, a USA made model.

Not the very best sound (not the worst either), a bit on the heavy side but very reliable and inexpensive.

Keep an eye on craigslist too, remember that it belongs to the swift!

Not long ago I bought a Peavey keyboard amp, an Ensoniq MR-76 and a nice music stand for $100. I sold the amp for $80, the stand for $10 and traded the keyboard for an Akai MPK25 in great shape with a carry bag.
Everything worked great when I got it.

Just a bit north of you in Bellingham, stuff is everywhere!


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018098 12/02/19 02:59 AM
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Quality powered speakers that are cheaper than QSC K10.2's in descending order of price:

Electro-Voice ELX200-10P
Electro-Voice ZXa1
Electro-Voice ZLX-12

also maybe Turbosound iNSPIRE iP300, there was a thread on those recently


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018099 12/02/19 03:33 AM
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Bang for the buck is high with Alto. Pun unintentional, but retained.

I've been completely happy with my (not current model) Alto TS 112A powered speakers. They fill a 2000 ft^2 -- um, about 200 meter^2 -- area nicely on open mic night. I also have TX08's for occasional use as backline monitors. Depending on your application, you may find the Alto 8's a little limited in the bass department.

An accomplished sound man buddy of mine is very happy with Alto 15" powered speakers for small jobs.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: AnotherScott] #3018100 12/02/19 03:49 AM
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Originally Posted by AnotherScott
Quality powered speakers that are cheaper than QSC K10.2's in descending order of price:

Electro-Voice ELX200-10P
Electro-Voice ZXa1
Electro-Voice ZLX-12

also maybe Turbosound iNSPIRE iP300, there was a thread on those recently





Another vote for the EV ZLX-12: love it for practices etc and easily covers gigs but I've moved to IEMs

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: nursers] #3018101 12/02/19 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by nursers
Originally Posted by AnotherScott
Quality powered speakers that are cheaper than QSC K10.2's in descending order of price:

Electro-Voice ELX200-10P
Electro-Voice ZXa1
Electro-Voice ZLX-12

also maybe Turbosound iNSPIRE iP300, there was a thread on those recently





Another vote for the EV ZLX-12: love it for practices etc and easily covers gigs but I've moved to IEMs

Make that three votes. Great speaker and lighter that you would expect.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018105 12/02/19 04:37 AM
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Yamaha DXR10 or (for less money) Yamaha DBR10.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018108 12/02/19 05:36 AM
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My ZLX-12p has been a gamechanger in many ways.

I haven't used the Yamaha DXRs but I've heard good things as well.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018111 12/02/19 07:33 AM
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I was hoping to spend no more than 300 but since I'm most likely going to finance it I'm giving myself some wiggle room. Thanks for all the recommendations so far. Much much appreciated!

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018112 12/02/19 07:49 AM
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The EV ZLX-12BT looks pretty good over at sweetwater. I might go for that.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018117 12/02/19 09:45 AM
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I would try your friend's K10 and see if you find the sound acceptable with that alone. I have a K12 which to me only sounds really good when using it with a mixer. This might be the case with other powered speaker brands as you usually get a maximum of two channels with volume control on most. If you want EQ, Effects, more channels or improved sound you may also need to add a mixer. A dedicated Keyboard amp will be more full-featured as a stand-alone unit and pretty much be plug-and-play.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018119 12/02/19 12:28 PM
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K10's don't carry very well. I know a couple keyboard players that had problems with them. I carry a K12. It can be a pain but in the long run it has really served me well.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: Shamanczarek] #3018137 12/02/19 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Shamanczarek
I would try your friend's K10 and see if you find the sound acceptable with that alone. I have a K12 which to me only sounds really good when using it with a mixer. This might be the case with other powered speaker brands as you usually get a maximum of two channels with volume control on most. If you want EQ, Effects, more channels or improved sound you may also need to add a mixer. A dedicated Keyboard amp will be more full-featured as a stand-alone unit and pretty much be plug-and-play.


Thanks for the tip.

the K10 sounds awesome. I have a mixer but I'd rather not get it involved just for the sake of logistics (more cords and crap to deal with). It's possible I'm not as particular as other folks.

Keyboard amps seem heavy and cumbersome.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018139 12/02/19 05:52 PM
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Eric, your keyboards have built-in efx and eq, correct? You don't need a mixer then, although a mixer might make editing those parameters on the fly a little easier. Sorry if I'm stating the obvious but you never know with some of the advice I see here. I'm with you – the less pieces of gear, cords, ac adapters. etc. the better. You can easily hook your boards directly to a K speaker or any other powered speaker. I've been doing it with my laptop rig for close to 15 years. If you need more gain you switch to mic-level input. That's what I did for loud gigs with my K8s and it gave me all I needed.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018141 12/02/19 06:05 PM
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I've been using the QSC K10 for a long time, and have not had any issues with it.

I've actually on a few occasions had to turn off the deep switch because it had too much bottom end.

Lately I've been using it as a form of side fill, where it is up close pointing at me. Only issue I have is the vertical position is critical to the sound up close like that, as they can take a little distance for the sound to focus.

I plug my keys into one channel, a feed from the main monitors into another channel, so I can control both my keys volume and the monitor volume.

Currently I'm using a Soundcraft NotePad mixer, but I'll probably go back to my Mackie 1202 VLZ one I get all the connections cleaned up.

I run two boards, so I need the mixer for that. I have run one or the other boards directly into the K10, with no compromise in sound quality


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018144 12/02/19 06:32 PM
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If possible, check out the Yamaha DBR10. It's a lot cheaper than the QSC K10 and Yamaha DXR10. It sounds similar to the DXR10 but it's not quite as loud (129 vs. 131db spl). It has a decent onboard two channel mixer with basic EQ and weighs only 23 lbs.

FWIW... For band work, I usually play in mono and use a QSC K12 for loud gigs and a Yamaha DBR10 for quieter gigs and rehearsals.


Live gear: Kurzweil SP6, Nord 5D 73, Hammond SK1 61, Kurzweil SP4-7, Yamaha MX88, Casio CGP-700, QSC K12, Yamaha DBR10, JBL EON515xt(2)
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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: Reezekeys] #3018171 12/02/19 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Reezekeys
Eric, your keyboards have built-in efx and eq, correct? You don't need a mixer then, although a mixer might make editing those parameters on the fly a little easier. Sorry if I'm stating the obvious but you never know with some of the advice I see here. I'm with you – the less pieces of gear, cords, ac adapters. etc. the better. You can easily hook your boards directly to a K speaker or any other powered speaker. I've been doing it with my laptop rig for close to 15 years. If you need more gain you switch to mic-level input. That's what I did for loud gigs with my K8s and it gave me all I needed.


Yes, the keyboards have eq features.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018185 12/02/19 10:21 PM
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The only issue I could imagine is that the PPAs I've seen with two inputs usually have only one that can switch between mic & line level (the other is line-only). So if you need both to be set to mic level you could have a problem. The spec sheets should tell you the gain range of each input.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018191 12/02/19 10:32 PM
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For the price range, give the QSC CP series a listen. They're lighter and a bit more compact than their K.2 cousins. I bought the CP8s to use as unobtrusive trio monitors with the K.2 8s and/or 10s out front, but I've increasingly grabbed them instead of K.2s for rehearsals or solo CP4 hotel or banquet events. I used my Key Largo as pre the first CP4 event, but after a little experimentation at home, I've since used xlr directly into them, eq'd for the room, and been happy with the result and the small, light and easy form factor.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KuruPrionz] #3018214 12/03/19 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
Do a tour of Seattle pawnshops and music stores. Keep an eye out for an older Peavey keyboard amp, a USA made model.

Not the very best sound (not the worst either), a bit on the heavy side but very reliable and inexpensive.

Keep an eye on craigslist too, remember that it belongs to the swift!

Not long ago I bought a Peavey keyboard amp, an Ensoniq MR-76 and a nice music stand for $100. I sold the amp for $80, the stand for $10 and traded the keyboard for an Akai MPK25 in great shape with a carry bag.
Everything worked great when I got it.

Just a bit north of you in Bellingham, stuff is everywhere!


I think this is pretty good advice, directionally speaking. And given your budget situation.

Where I agree is that there are truly amazing bargains to be had in your local market. Especially if you know how to negotiate a used gear transaction. Spend some time learning what to look for, and I bet you could score big before long.

Where I would disagree is to what to focus on. You say your bandmate has an older K10. Not the best of the QSC line for keys, but adequate. Find a well-used K10 (not K2.10) and you'll fit well, as well as sound good enough. But you can do better for your personal sound.

If you're buying for your own sound (not part of a band), I'd encourage you to find a pair of the previous generation self-powered 8" speakers. QSC K8s, EV ZLX-8p, the Yammies, etc. Every 8" unit I own is super-versatile: monitors, stage amplification and even FOH in smaller venues. A few hundred for a pair, and you're jammin'

Yes, avoid keyboard amps in general unless you want to spend big, and haul around a beast. The new Motion Sound amps are cool, but the rest are a dicey deal. The exception is the CPS SSv3 which surprisingly continues to please both my ears and those of others. Find one used, it might be your thing.

BTW, any time you want to blow serious $$$ on keyboard amplification, we could have a chat. I love spending other people's money.


Life is too short to be playing bad music.

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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018218 12/03/19 12:55 AM
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I love my EV ZLX 12. In hindsight, I might have considered getting 2 10"s.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018620 12/06/19 12:37 AM
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I know they're the Voldermort of keyboard amplification but has anyone tried the Roland KC 220, the stereo version of the dreaded KC series?

I'm in a similar market as the OP but as well as gigging I like the idea of setting up my keys at home (on an X-stand so studio monitors are out really) and playing through something other than headphones.

The stereo of the KC-220 would be attractive to me for home use (particularly piano patches) as well as having the single-unit form factor as oppose to two active speakers. Budget-wise it comes in around the same price as a single QSC K8.

I'd be interested to know if anyone owned or had tried one.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018630 12/06/19 03:30 AM
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Just... no.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018633 12/06/19 04:13 AM
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Moe, have you actually heard the KC220? I haven't, but I have seen some reports than it is better sounding than a lot of the other KCs have been.


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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: AnotherScott] #3018642 12/06/19 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by AnotherScott
Moe, have you actually heard the KC220? I haven't, but I have seen some reports than it is better sounding than a lot of the other KCs have been.


No, just chucking it on general principal. wink

Seriously though, if very low volume single person monitor situations are the only context in which you use it, 15W per channel into a 6.5" speaker might do the job. How expensive is this amp?

Edit: nm, I went and looked at a product page. I see the appeal now. Is this thing shipping yet?

Last edited by mate stubb; 12/06/19 07:22 AM.

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Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: Marillo] #3018646 12/06/19 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Marillo
I

The stereo of the KC-220 would be attractive to me for home use (particularly piano patches) as well as having the single-unit form factor as oppose to two active speakers. Budget-wise it comes in around the same price as a single QSC K8.


hey there, the information I'm seeing shows the QSC K8 at $649 and the KC 220 at $399. am i missing something?

also, i'm not an audio head so maybe I am missing something else but 30 watts (KC220) vs. 2000 watts (KC8)? Seems like a lot.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018647 12/06/19 09:02 AM
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that being said, stereo amp sounds kind of interesting.

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018650 12/06/19 10:49 AM
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Sorry, I meant the QSC CP 8

Re: Thinking about buying a powered speaker. [Re: KeyboardEric] #3018655 12/06/19 01:45 PM
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I've been through just about every "keyboard amp" out there--Peavey, Yorkville, Crate, you name it. Most were muddy sounding to me and heavy as all-get-out. 10 years or so ago I tried using a bass combo amp--all-in-one speaker cabinet and amp, usually containing two 10" neodymium speakers (for lighter weight) and a high frequency horn or tweeter. The ones from GK (Gallien Krueger) worked surprisingly well for my style of playing which includes classic rock tones like B3, "real" piano, horn, strings, synth, etc. I liked the thickness and punch of the tones that came out of the bass combo type amps, but I kept blowing tweeters. About 5 years ago I switched over to self contained powered speakers and haven't looked back. My first was a Yamaha DXR 10 which I used for maybe 2 or 3 months, but found it "muddy" sounding, even when I used a 3 band EQ mixer between it and my boards. Also it was relatively heavy. A friend of mine talked me into trying the Alto Professional line of powered speakers. Although skeptical based on the retail price alone (around $200 vs. over $600 for the Yamaha), I was pleasantly surprised (actually shocked) how well my keyboard sounds projected out of a single TS210 speaker! I sold the Yamaha for $500 and bought another TS210, setting them up on either side of my on stage for smaller gigs. My B3 with Leslie sounds were amazing, with the rotary effect being thrown out into the audience in a stereo sort of way, filling the room like the real thing used to do. They were extremely easy to gig with too, weighing around 20lbs and having a small enough form factor to easily transport them with all my other equipment in the trunk of an average SUV or car. BTW: I tried the 15" version of the Alto but found them similarly "muddy" to the Yamahas. I even took the plunge earlier this year--thinking I was missing out based on all the comments--and paid lots of money for a QSC K10.2. I was totally disappointed in the sound of that model based on what it cost and what I was getting out of the Altos. I moved up a bit early this Summer and bought two of Alto's newest models, their 310 which is advertised at 2000 watts (vs the 1200 in the previous models). Oddly they didn't increase the prices though, but I don't notice much difference if any between them and the lower-powered predecessor. You can usually find the Altos refurbished on the popular online auction site for close to $200 shipped. I'd recommend using the 10s for a well-rounded output of depth and clarity or the 12" version, which I have recently been gigging with..


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