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Mini Vent (not the one you think)


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I get a call from a local cover band that wants to add keys. They shoot me a list of tunes and I work out all the parts, splits, layers, patches and program them all into my "one-button-to-launch" cantabile setup. Keep in mind these guys have been a 4-piece for years - tasty lead player, lead vocals/rhythm player, bass and drums.

 

I get to the audition and we start running through songs:

 

Hard to Handle: They loved it

 

Poker Face: Lead player stops it half way through and says HE will play the gritty synth line in the intro and verses, and the melodic line in the chorus, oh and let the bass player play the synth-bass line too. I'm thinkin', OK less for me to cover. I can adjust. "Ma Ma Mah" samples and pad for bridge and chorus. NP.

 

Rolling in the Deep: After the song was over the lead player says, "Hey can you just maybe do a string pad or something over the chorus instead of the piano chord 8th-notes? I always play that part and with both of us playing it get's too choppy." I start to push back with "Guys, it's a cover tune that has well defined piano parts" I try to explain all the prep I do to setup my rig so I just hit one button and everything's ready to go for the song (which I admit leaves me sorely unprepared to just "punch up a bread-n-butter patch on the fly"). They all look at me like I'm insane.

 

In The Air Tonight: Before the song I tell the drummer I have the intro on a loop and he doesn't have to play until the roll-in. He's like "I'll just add some flava over the track". I ask if he has ear bugs or can play to a click (I have a separate click out from Cantabile all ready to go). He's like, "Nah man just play it, I can follow you." Needless to say the timing train-wreck quickly ensued (which was somehow MY fault), followed by them throwing out the dreaded...

 

"Thank you. Next!"

 

F**king guitar bands.

 

~ vonnor

 

Gear:

Hardware: Nord Stage3, Korg Kronos 2, Novation Summit

Software: Cantabile 3, Halion Sonic 3 and assorted VST plug-ins.

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Oh, you didn't know? This sort of experience is prerequisite, and required for earning "The Certificate of Incognizant Colaboration For The Professional Keyboardist". If you haven't been through this, you haven't played long enough. However, if you continue to come across this situation, you have yet to complete your education. The final course is "How to Say No to Your Old Buddies Who Want To 'Put The Band Back Together'".
Lenny
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Are they using tracks now, or just covering all music with two guitars, bass and drums? In either case, some changes to instrumentation should be expected by all during the transition period. I joined a band that wanted a keyboardist to replace the tracks they were using and it still took us a while to work through new instrumentation for all the songs, but it was collaborative. With a no-track band, I would expect the process to take longer to rearrange the parts to accommodate keys.

 

It sounds like this was more of a personality conflict where neither side was willing and/or able to give enough to make it work, and if they hadn't said no, you would have. It was good you found out during the audition.

Nord Stage 3 HA88, Nord Stage 3 Compact, Casio CT-S1, Radial Key Largo, Westone AM Pro 30, Rolls PM55P, K&M 18880 + 18881, Bose S1 Pro, JBL 305p MKII, Zoom Q2n-4K

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This sort of experience adds to the list of "Questions to ask before accepting audition." Problem is, ask too many of these questions and you get a rep for being difficult to work with.

Gear:

Hardware: Nord Stage3, Korg Kronos 2, Novation Summit

Software: Cantabile 3, Halion Sonic 3 and assorted VST plug-ins.

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Rolling in the Deep: After the song was over the lead player says, "Hey can you just maybe do a string pad or something over the chorus instead of the piano chord 8th-notes? I always play that part and with both of us playing it get's too choppy." I start to push back with "Guys, it's a cover tune that has well defined piano parts" I try to explain all the prep I do to setup my rig so I just hit one button and everything's ready to go for the song (which I admit leaves me sorely unprepared to just "punch up a bread-n-butter patch on the fly"). They all look at me like I'm insane.

 

Bill, you're a better man than me - by making it to 'In The Air Tonight'. I'd have been packing up right after their response from the previous song. They simply don't need another musician in the band when God is already their lead guitarist.

 

'Someday, we'll look back on these days and laugh; likely a maniacal laugh from our padded cells, but a laugh nonetheless' - Mr. Boffo.

 

We need a barfing cat emoticon!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Yikes. Sorry to hear about this.

 

What a bummer to waste all that time programming, prep and practicing.

 

I hate learning lessons by wasting time. I guess more questions to ask before firing up the Kronos and programming combis and split points. Of course, sometimes you ask the questions, set your expectations accordingly, do the work...and still get a surprise train wreck at the audition. But at least then it's clearly a surprise against what they might have previously stated.

 

Sounds like there is a keyboard player for them out there somewhere - someone who's just going to roll in with an Electro and comp Rhodes quietly and politely behind them. Maybe he'll even be cool enough to wrap up cords after the gig and help the drummer schlep his kit to the van too.

 

 

..
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...Sounds like there is a keyboard player for them out there somewhere - someone who's just going to roll in with an Electro and comp Rhodes quietly and politely behind them. Maybe he'll even be cool enough to wrap up cords after the gig and help the drummer schlep his kit to the van too.

Thanks Tim. I needed this. :roll:

 

Gear:

Hardware: Nord Stage3, Korg Kronos 2, Novation Summit

Software: Cantabile 3, Halion Sonic 3 and assorted VST plug-ins.

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I"m sorry to hear this.

 

Not only because I feel for your experience, but also because I"m disappointed you aren"t selling a Mini Vent by the title of the post. ð

Yamaha U1 Upright, Roland Fantom 8, Nord Stage 4 HA73, Nord Wave 2, Korg Nautilus 73, Viscount Legend Live, Lots of Mainstage/VST Libraries

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When in Rome...

 

I'll take the other side for just a bit. It sounds like you made some assupmtions beforehand as to what you were joining and what your role would be in the ensemble.

Putting in so much effort programming makes the final result sting more, do doubt.

 

OK, I am a guitarist. I do have some programmed tones for specifc songs on my Boss Katana amp. I made the programs after my current band established that we really were going to play the songs. After I needed to, not before.

 

It is good to know the material well enough to be able to shift gears and not be "trapped" by deciding how things were "supposed" to go.

If current band members have parts worked out and want to play them, that is just how it is.

Or, as a friend told me long ago - "Whatever I play, don't play that!"

 

The last band I auditioned for was a Motown band. They gave me charts and a few days to get familiar.

I did learn the sax lick at the beginning of What's Going On by Marvin Gaye. I also learned that octave part in I Want You Back by the Jackson Five, they said nobody had ever played that before and they liked it.

Then they asked if I knew Johnny Be Goode and I laughed. They said "You don't know it?" I said "I can do more like the Hendrix version, fire it up."

 

I played with them for a couple of years, we had fun and made money.

 

I've been asked to play in the last two bands (plus a side fill in "gig"), so it's been a while since I've auditioned.

A big part of the audition is finding out what the band WANTS.

That won't change.

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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Sorry to laugh at your expense, Vonnor, but I did get a laugh from this, especially after I checked out the Adele and Gaga tunes and heard what you're talking about. I don't know why they wanted a keyboard player to not play the keyboard parts. :freak:

 

Admittedly, the drummer didn't want to wait nearly four minutes to roll in, but Phil or whoever was playing drums did, so what makes him so special? :D (And when Phil played it at Live Aid, he stopped at the drum break and then continued on solo piano. Not that most people can get away from how it is on the original recordâ¦).

 

While finding out what a band wants for an audition is important as Kuru says, if you're given keyboard-heavy tunes to learn, that's what almost anyone would learn, the keyboard parts. I would assume as you did, that they wanted me to do the keyboard parts and they'd back off to their respective instruments.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

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That sucks - I feel for you.

 

Sadly it's often the case other musicians don't quite understand the set up and prep that goes into playing keys.

 

This. Exactly. Infuriates me at times. The other side of the coin is when I dare suggest that more than 25% of the band's setlist being filled with non-keyboard songs (AC/DC etc) and being told 'well can't you just play something anyway?'. I certainly could but damned if I'm spending the time coming up with something that fits, to then be told to stop it....

 

 

 

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Then there is the "What key is best for the lead singer" thing. It is another point where assumptions can be made, and broken.

 

I can't tell you how many times I've learned a song only to find out I need to transpose to another key.

The theory is not a problem at all, I can do it on the fly with most tunes.

 

If there is a signature lick, that can be interesting sometimes. Probably more a guitar thing than a keyboard thing, open strings and all that.

 

Still, if you've learned the tune in the wrong key it's frustrating.

Tonight we are going to learn Pretty Woman. As good as our lead singer is, I am skeptical that we will be able to play it in A. That might change the entire character of the signature lick since it goes down to E and I run out of notes below that.

 

I made a quick chart and learned the lick but I am prepared to shift gears and/or just drop it in favor of something the fits better.

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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Which leads to a discussion that's never been had on this forum: should you use the transpose button?

 

:D

Good one!!! My guitar does not have a transpose button but it's pretty easy if you know the fretboard. Unlike keys, where every key has it's own pattern, guitar patters are consistent up and down the neck. Scales and chords can be played in different positions but indentical fingerings. Which is why I can do it on the fly most of the time. I've spent a lifetime as second guitarist so I've been out in the middle of the neck most of the time anyway.

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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Sadly it's often the case other musicians don't quite understand the set up and prep that goes into playing keys.
Maybe I've been fortunate, but I've consistently had appreciative comments for the effort I've put into my sound design/preparation.

 

I dare suggest that more than 25% of the band's setlist being filled with non-keyboard songs (AC/DC etc) and being told 'well can't you just play something anyway?'. I certainly could but damned if I'm spending the time coming up with something that fits, to then be told to stop it....
I always throw down some distorted Wurlitzer for AC/DC - but it begs the question: if you're playing AC/DC, why do you need keys? (I know the answer now: bagpipe patch for "Long Way To The Top").

 

Cheers, Mike.

 

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I've auditioned for guitar-bands-looking-to-add-keys bands quite a few times. A definite red flag for me is seeing some songs on their list that are seemingly keyboard driven - for instance "Superstition " or "Use Me". They will never relinquish the keys parts back to you, mainly because they have been playing their version for 10,20,30 years. If I get sent an audition list and it has some of these songs on it, and I know they haven't had a keys player in decades, I'll bow out.

Professional musician = great source of poverty.

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I always throw down some distorted Wurlitzer for AC/DC - but it begs the question: if you're playing AC/DC, why do you need keys? (I know the answer now: bagpipe patch for "Long Way To The Top").
One of these days I need to get my band to learn the arrangement of "T.N.T." I came up with, that's salsa/montuno during the verses, and breakneck bebop with walking bass on the choruses. It's probably the only way our guitarist would WANT to play AC/DC.

 

Other than my piano-centered arrangement of Highway to Hell. Then the guitarist switches to drums and the drummer plays ukulele. :roll:

 

Samuel B. Lupowitz

Musician. Songwriter. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.

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I've auditioned for guitar-bands-looking-to-add-keys bands quite a few times. A definite red flag for me is seeing some songs on their list that are seemingly keyboard driven - for instance "Superstition " or "Use Me". They will never relinquish the keys parts back to you, mainly because they have been playing their version for 10,20,30 years. If I get sent an audition list and it has some of these songs on it, and I know they haven't had a keys player in decades, I'll bow out.

 

Trivia question - who did Stevie Wonder write Superstition for?

 

Jeff Beck. The video is followed by Stevie live with Jeff Beck on guitar. Seems to work well.

 

 

That said, it's Stevie's version that is iconic and got airplay. We do it with guitars, I fire up the auto-wah and do my best. We would LOVE a clavinet playng the signature riff. Our last keyboard player left by mutual agreement but we had plenty use for him and treated him well.

 

Now Christmas is coming and we will get requests for the Linus and Lucy theme as we used to play it with a piano lead. People love that tune!!!! I will do my best on guitar but it just doesn't sound the same.

It has been my experience that every band is different, making assumptions in advance can mean missed opportunities.

It took a chunk of my life to get here and I am still not sure where "here" is.
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My band's compromise on "Superstition" is for my keyboard to play the signature clav riff during the intro and first half of verses while the guitarist comps, and have him take over when I start the horn riffs.

Kurzweil PC4, Expressive E Osmose, UNO Synth Pro, Hammond B-3X on iPad, Rhodes Mark II Stage 73, ART 710-A MK4s

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Sadly it's often the case other musicians don't quite understand the set up and prep that goes into playing keys.
Maybe I've been fortunate, but I've consistently had appreciative comments for the effort I've put into my sound design/preparation.

 

I dare suggest that more than 25% of the band's setlist being filled with non-keyboard songs (AC/DC etc) and being told 'well can't you just play something anyway?'. I certainly could but damned if I'm spending the time coming up with something that fits, to then be told to stop it....
I always throw down some distorted Wurlitzer for AC/DC - but it begs the question: if you're playing AC/DC, why do you need keys? (I know the answer now: bagpipe patch for "Long Way To The Top").

 

Cheers, Mike.

 

I love your idea about the distorted Wurlitzer, might just give that a try ;)

 

And you're right - if half the set is AC/DC there'd be little point, and I have indeed suggested Long Way to the Top with no success as yet :)

 

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...A big part of the audition is finding out what the band WANTS.

That won't change.

Excellent point. That's where I failed. I knew that they did their own flair on the majority of songs, as opposed to copying the original version, but since my style has always been totally "copy-cover" I missed that clue. Also I didn't ask about conflict resolution of musical parts. I should have.

 

~ vonnor

 

Gear:

Hardware: Nord Stage3, Korg Kronos 2, Novation Summit

Software: Cantabile 3, Halion Sonic 3 and assorted VST plug-ins.

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