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New B3 VST from IK


kwyn

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Hmm, my first impressions from the official demos (I haven't watched Jim's video yet), are that this is probably the best emulation yet for rock organ. I'm going to compare to my XK-1c now though, as I think I may prefer it for the jazz and gospel sounds overall; a bit warmer and richer and three dimensional. It would only be a bit over $100 with JamPoints though, using the loyalty discount of $149 as the basis.

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I have gone over ALL of my organ parts on currently active projects (totaling a couple dozen songs or more that actually have organ, out of over 120 in active rotation). My off-the-cuff perceptions were reinforced, but I think the IK plug-in might have a bit more lower register definition and clarity than the XK-1c.

 

I do prefer the XK-1c for most of what I do with organ, which primarily is reggae, ska, dub, calypso, and small doses of gospel and jazz. In the upper register (which is most of what I use when it comes to organ), I think the XK-1c is a bit warmer and more articulate. I also seem to prefer its Chorus/Vibrato and Percussion a bit.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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Looks like a good deal to me. Sounds great and am I correct in thinking they"ve integrated the existing IK multimedia Leslie software into this B3X? Jim mentions it in his overview but not sure if they include the full version? An iPad version would be awesome.
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I thought it sounded fabulous. Product demos are sometimes so carefully and slickly recorded that I wonder if I can expect the same great sound at home. Jim"s walkthrough felt like he just turned it on and started playing while I was in the room, and I"ll get what I heard.

Yamaha P515 & CK88, Pianoteq, Mainstage, iOS, assorted other stuff.

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Can you separate the organ and Leslie sections so that you could route the organ to some other effect before sending it back to the Leslie, or send some other VST through its Leslie effect?

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If they make this an iPad app, I"m all in.

 

 

I would like to hear a demo first of their iPad app once it comes out and compare it to Galileo 2 which I presently use at jams.

 

Oh, heck yes...my Modx (my malfunction-at-gig thread notwithstanding!) can easily hook up an ipad audio and midi with one cable...galileo didn't sound that great to me on demos, do you like it for the jams?

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Can you separate the organ and Leslie sections so that you could route the organ to some other effect before sending it back to the Leslie, or send some other VST through its Leslie effect?

 

In Jim"s video someone asked about rerouting, placing fx before or after the Leslie.

He suggested asking IK to implement this, it doesn"t seem possible right now.

Offering their Leslie as a separate VST/AU would help a lot.

Then we could stick whatever FX we want in before the amp.

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Does it have an easy midi learn function? Would it learn 2 sets of drawbars and play nice with the buttons and knobs on my Legend Solo?

 

Yes it does have MIDI learn. I didn't find it until later in the video because I was on a Mac and right-clicking on a Mac is still confusing to me (I'm a PC guy). It would work just fine with the Legend Solo.

 

 

Can you separate the organ and Leslie sections so that you could route the organ to some other effect before sending it back to the Leslie, or send some other VST through its Leslie effect?

 

No. For that, you'd need the full Leslie plug-in, which is a separate product.

 

 

 

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Does it have an easy midi learn function? Would it learn 2 sets of drawbars and play nice with the buttons and knobs on my Legend Solo?

 

Yes it does have MIDI learn. I didn't find it until later in the video because I was on a Mac and right-clicking on a Mac is still confusing to me (I'm a PC guy). It would work just fine with the Legend Solo.

 

 

Can you separate the organ and Leslie sections so that you could route the organ to some other effect before sending it back to the Leslie, or send some other VST through its Leslie effect?

 

No. For that, you'd need the full Leslie plug-in, which is a separate product.

 

 

 

Thanks Jim! So you think the midi learn would be cool with the c/v knobs and percussion buttons too?

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IK sells their Leslie Collection as add ons for T-racks or Amplitube for $129.99 or $179.99 to work with both.

Amplitube 4 is $149.99, same for T-Racks.

 

$280 is a lot of scratch to be able to move the IK Leslie collection around in the signal chain.

 

Hopefully they listen to user feature requests when they update B3X.

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IK sells their Leslie Collection as add ons for T-racks or Amplitube for $129.99 or $179.99 to work with both.

Amplitube 4 is $149.99, same for T-Racks.

 

$280 is a lot of scratch to be able to move the IK Leslie collection around in the signal chain.

IIRC, you can run the Leslie sim in a more limited free package, you don't need the full T-Racks/Amplitube. I looked into it when the Leslie sim was available at its sub-$100 intro price. There was supposed to be a demo available, but I couldn't find it.

 

Since I usually gig in mono, I'd be interested in how this compares to the other sims in that config. I'm also curious about overdrive.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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Downloaded the demo version so i could compare first with my AS B5v2.5 before spending 200.00.

Since i stopped gigging i have practiced solo piano most of the time.

Sold my HX3, Numa and Nords and only have acoustic samples B5 on my computer.

First difference is that the fundamental tone of IK is cleaner. The B5 has the organic grunt baked in more.

The C3 chorus is more shimmery on the IK and it sounded a bit after C2.....maybe because the basic B5 tone+C3 is different as stated above..

 

I expected the IK leslie to be a step up, but both sound very good and to my ears the IK doesn"t give me this 'clearly better" feeling.

 

It is very early days, but for me personally it is not a B5 V2.5 upgrade.... i like the B5 better.

Doesn"t mean that the IK isn"t a splendid instrument, but not for me.... now.

I could never warm to any Hammond sk and xk series (excluding the XK-5) and liked the Mojo ,HX-3, Nords and KeyB"s better.

Far better organ players have always played on Hammond Suzuki ,... so take the above with a grain of salt.... just somehing personal

 

 

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I'm on the fence as well -- I listened all the way through Jim's demo last night, and at times was blown away by the richness, fullness, and liveliness, so I suspect the Leslie and Distortion are both better than in the XK-1c.

 

It's interesting to hear the comparison to the AS B5, which I recently sold (having decided that I like my XK-1c better, in all sound categories including rock), and saying the IK is tamer, as I feel the XK-1c is tamer still.

 

The controller mappings for existing Hammond-Suzuki Digital Organs, makes me more inclined to grab the IK as a low-risk experiment, but it's good to hear there's a demo copy, as another forum stated there is none!

 

Just to reiterate, even though Jim is a magnificent player and quick to get the best out of any new instrument (virtual or physical), I do still have a preference for the XK-1c for my most typical B3 organ tones.

 

One thing I still have not done, is compare the XK-1c with IK's Leslie engaged. The simple reason I haven't done this yet, is that I have been unable to get IK's Leslie plug-ins to launch (vs. stall) for many months now.

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Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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I spent about 90 minutes with the demo just now, and have decided it isn't for me. I put every B3 clone to the Reggae test right away, as that's the hardest thing to nail. My XK-1c isn't perfect but is close enough, especially in the mix. What I find with the IK product is that note separation doesn't seem to be as good, and the overall drawbar sound is for some reason darker and brighter -- even harsh, at times -- and colder.

 

I'm not sure how to attach my Reggae preset file, for others to try if they wish. It 100% matches my custom XK-1c preset. My Ska preset is fairly similar. I use these starting points the most of any, and it's also the context in which I am most likely to use distinct lower and upper drawbars, as I use organ all the way through the song in the island genres, and switch between staccato-ish comping and sustained melodic leads.

 

Even after lots of adjustments, playing with the Leslie editing, etc., I'm somehow left with the impression that the timbral range isn't as wide as the XK-1c. But of course this product will probably evolve over time, and I absolutely love the GUI and wish I had an editor for the XK-1c that is this quick and intuitive to work with.

 

I ran through a bunch of the factory presets too, but all seemed a bit harsh and bright to me, without the warmth of my XK-1c.

 

Interestingly, if I use the Leslie 122A amp vs. the 122, things get lost in the mix. It sounds almost like there's too wide a dispersion, but that makes no sense as that is where the cabinet matters, unless I'm mistaken about which part of the modeling covers the rotating horn. At any rate, the difference between the 122 and 122A was far greater than I expected. I couldn't shut it off in favour of using the full plug-in (T-RackS), as that one still crashes in DP10.

 

I definitely prefer the Chorus in the XK-1c. IK's full Leslie effect for T-RackS, might be better, if I could get it to not crash. The version in the IK Hammond, doesn't seem to have as much mic angle control as the XK-1c, where I can set the mic to 150 degrees (for instance) -- something I do especially for Reggae and Ska.

 

Although I can no longer do a direct comparison after selling a bunch of music software recently, my aural memory tells me that this modeled B3 may be a bit closer to Blue in sound, than the other options. I think I probably liked the basic timbre of the AcousticSamples product a bit better. I remember it being fairly warm, after its update. The IK product somehow reminds me a bit of the Korg CX3 organ overall.

 

In spite of my misgivings, I very much admire this product and what went into it. I definitely feel it is better than the Arturia organ, and most organ libraries I have or have owned. It has some features and details that the XK-1c doesn't, and vice-versa. If I had more time, I'd evaluate it in a rock setting, even though I rarely use organ outside of island genres and jazz (plus soul/r&b). But the 10 day demo will expire before I have a chance to do that (I'm moving this week).

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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Based on the demos sounds good. A little different to Acousticsamples B5, my go to Hammond, and VB3. But while doesn't set a new high point for tone, it does set a high point in terms of being the most expensive Hammond emulation currently available. You could buy both VB3 2 and B5 and have change left over compared to the price of IK's B3X.

 

Interesting IK chose to follow the VASE III and B5 hybrid sampled plus modelled option rather than the VB3 modelled option. Wonder if they used the VASE 3 samples?

A misguided plumber attempting to entertain | MainStage 3 | Axiom 61 2nd Gen | Pianoteq | B5 | XK3c | EV ZLX 12P

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After watching demos, to me, the top end sounds thin and digital. I"m not using clones anymore since quitting gigging so my ears are now tuned into my C3 solely.

 

I"m not hearing any improvement over what you can already get software wise (for a lot cheaper)

 

I wonder if running the engine at 96k or more cleans up the brittle high end on any of these modeled instruments.

 

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Based on the demos sounds good. A little different to Acousticsamples B5, my go to Hammond, and VB3. But while doesn't set a new high point for tone, it does set a high point in terms of being the most expensive Hammond emulation currently available. You could buy both VB3 2 and B5 and have change left over compared to the price of IK's B3X.

 

Interesting IK chose to follow the VASE III and B5 hybrid sampled plus modelled option rather than the VB3 modelled option. Wonder if they used the VASE 3 samples?

 

The price of getting the Hammond stamp of officiallity.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Interesting IK chose to follow the VASE III and B5 hybrid sampled plus modelled option rather than the VB3 modelled option. Wonder if they used the VASE 3 samples?

 

The price of getting the Hammond stamp of officiallity.

I doubt Hammond cared how they did it. For one thing, Hammond themselves have used both approaches (i.e. MTW in the XK5 instead of VASE III). Practically speaking, it's probably mostly a financial/licensing agreement. Though there could be some sharing of IP as well.

 

Good to see a demo is available. If I can figure out how to get the separate Leslie demo to work, I'd be interested in evaluating mix-and-match combos, i.e. not just B-3X vs. Blue3, but also each one's organ through their own Leslie sim vs. the other's.

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I've been a VB3 user for many many years. After demoing VB3II and Blue3II (bummer to me that B5 can't be demo'd) I felt it wasn't really so much a question of one being better than the other, as they were all good, just different. But at one point I did demo Amplitube Leslie and using that with all of them absolutely made much more qualitative difference than any difference between the plugins themselves.

 

So I figured B-3X would be a clear winner. But after a couple of hours with the demo, I'm not positive it is. First problem for me is the cpu hit is severe. I'm running on an old laptop, i5, 8gb ram, but I run Diva in Divine mode no problem B-3X was right on the edge.

 

As it's sampled (partly?), the presets take a second or two to load. Otherwise it seemed pretty cool. I only have VB3 VI to compare with at the moment, but I most definitely can not say it is head and shoulders above even that. B3X has quite a bit more to tweak and FX etc so it is very possible with some work and time to maybe come up with something that does in fact blow me away. But quickly dialing in similar settings didn't have any clear winner... even in terms of the Leslie, which is puzzling me the most.

 

It definitely is a great sim, excepting cpu hit for me.. But I don't feel it quite hit me like how I remember using Amplitube Leslie with VB3 I and II and Blue3 II.

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FYI I was running at 96k. I probably should have mentioned that.

 

Now that I think about it, this might also be why I'm having trouble with the separate Leslie effect, the past few months.

 

I'll give it a go on a 48k project today and see if it loads there.

 

I didn't experience performance issues with the B3 VI though, so maybe that's because I do have a newish machine (2017).

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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I was able to get the T-RackS Leslie plug-in to load in a 48k project. But I don't have time right now (I am moving this week, and busy packing boxes), to do what it would take to execute a fair shootout with that effect in place of the slimmed-down Leslie built into the Hammond clone. As far as I can tell though, one is still stuck with a binary choice of 90 degrees, and 180 degrees, for the miking. But there is more control over the slow and fast speed of the Leslie effect, so I might be able to get a bit closer to my XK-1c settings for a fairer comparison.

 

The projects where I am using a B3 the most are mostly 96k, and I only made two custom presets for the IK clone so far. Maybe I'll find some time later today to load one up in a 48k project, disable the internal Leslie, load T-RacKs Leslie, and determine if there is a significant difference in sound once one takes advantage of the slightly greater control in the separate dedicated plug-in.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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I'm not noticing much difference in the sound regarding D.I. vs. Guitar Amp vs. Leslie, compared to how the XK-1c timbre changes when engaging different gain stage settings.

 

As a result, I didn't detect huge differences between the built-in Leslie and the stadalone T-RackS Leslie plug-in; just a few extra controls that are fairly subtle in their impact.

 

The GUI needs to be improved when it comes to the on/off nature of those three switches in the Mixer section. It's so subtle that I didn't notice at first that they are toggles vs. labels.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1,

Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager

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