Music Player Network

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? #3002280 08/08/19 03:04 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
R
robmix Offline OP
Platinum Member
OP Offline
Platinum Member
R
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
Many years ago I had a beautiful console, loads of outboard gear, and usually worked with 16 stereo pairs from Pro Tools into the board. Recalls were fast and easy, and I had a good template. For a change of pace I started mixing a song or two all ITB, and low and behold my clients could not tell the difference. Listening back these days I can't tell either.

There were a couple plug-in's that made it possible for me to go completely ITB - Sonox reverbs, and the Cranseong Phoenix. And of course the speed of recalls is a huge benefit.

What's your experience?


Rob Hoffman
http://www.robmixmusic.com
Los Angeles, CA
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: robmix] #3002289 08/08/19 03:33 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 20,531
Dave Bryce Offline
KCFFL Champ '14,'16,'18
20k Club
Offline
KCFFL Champ '14,'16,'18
20k Club
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 20,531
I need something that looks like a mixer. I just do...I like the tactile feel, and do not want to get rid of it. I like having a mixing surface that has recall though...that is awfully convenient. idea

I work with a TASCAM DM3200 (in an Argosy shell) for a mixing console. I have all sorts of keyboards in my studio, and they all return to it after being submixed elsewhere. I run 32 channels of audio back and forth from the computer (I'm a DP user)...and I even mix down to an outboard device (TASCAM DA-3000). I even come out of the box during mixdown to use an effect! (Bricasti M7).

Hey, it works for me...

I do have a smaller ITB rig that I use for VO work - retired Mac laptop, Audient ID4.

dB

Attached Files
IMG_5433.JPG (389.56 KB, 42 downloads)
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: robmix] #3002308 08/08/19 04:42 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 413
samuelblupowitz Online Content
Senior Member
Online Content
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 413
Millennial that I am, I grew up with the ability to record on my laptop long before I set foot in anything resembling a pro studio. But my heroes were The Beatles and Led Zeppelin and Elton John, so that was always the goal: set up the whole band in a nice big room, capture a performance, enhance as desired. I've had a chance to do various versions of that over the years, and usually there's at least some analog gear before it hits the DAW. But the convenience of mixing on your home computer is tough to beat, and some of my favorite records in the past few years, even retro-sounding ones, were made with laptops.

Sure, there are pitfalls of too many options and too much convenience -- the endless tweaking possible with instant recall, layering plugin after plugin and chasing one's own tail, deferring decisions endlessly. Some folks still talk about poor summing and conversion in the DAW; on my more DIY-centered records of late, I've taken to summing my final mixes through the analog equipment at a nearby studio. But I have a feeling that the difference is as much to that studio's owner/engineer's ears and knowledge as it is to the sound of the gear. If I had that stuff at my disposal, the end results would still sound different.

As much as my daydreams in younger days usually had me on the musician side of the glass, tracking and mixing at my computer definitely makes me more aware of my limitations than if I were sitting behind a console. But all things being equal, given the choice between upgrading my room or upgrading my mixing/tracking gear, I'd need to choose the improved source over the equipment. I love living in a time when the tools to make a great record are more accessible to everyone, even if it demands different problem-solving, and that we accept that a record can sound subjectively great without sounding like it was made by Glyn Johns or Phil Spector.

Oh, and dB, more photos of your studio space would not be unwelcome. wink


Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: samuelblupowitz] #3002310 08/08/19 04:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 20,531
Dave Bryce Offline
KCFFL Champ '14,'16,'18
20k Club
Offline
KCFFL Champ '14,'16,'18
20k Club
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 20,531
Originally Posted by samuelblupowitz
Oh, and dB, more photos of your studio space would not be unwelcome. wink

No prob!

Mostly full of keyboards - no surprise there....

Here are the two corners of the wall the mixing setup does not occupy.

dB

Attached Files
IMG_5432.JPG (361.99 KB, 42 downloads)
IMG_5553.JPG (172.06 KB, 44 downloads)
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: samuelblupowitz] #3002370 08/08/19 09:32 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
R
robmix Offline OP
Platinum Member
OP Offline
Platinum Member
R
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
Originally Posted by samuelblupowitz


Sure, there are pitfalls of too many options and too much convenience -- the endless tweaking possible with instant recall, layering plugin after plugin and chasing one's own tail, deferring decisions endlessly. Some folks still talk about poor summing and conversion in the DAW; on my more DIY-centered records of late, I've taken to summing my final mixes through the analog equipment at a nearby studio. But I have a feeling that the difference is as much to that studio's owner/engineer's ears and knowledge as it is to the sound of the gear. If I had that stuff at my disposal, the end results would still sound different.

:


I've done that a few times as well. Got the mix to where I was happy at home, and then taken it to a big room with loads of outboard and a console. In every case there were some mixes that worked better, and some that the ITB was fine. There hasn't been any pattern to it, some are ballads, some are hard hitting, etc.


Rob Hoffman
http://www.robmixmusic.com
Los Angeles, CA
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: robmix] #3002448 08/09/19 05:53 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
R
robmix Offline OP
Platinum Member
OP Offline
Platinum Member
R
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,195
And for fun, a pic from the console days, and now...

Attached Files
IMG_4526.jpg (471.52 KB, 33 downloads)
IMG_4001.jpg (228.62 KB, 32 downloads)

Rob Hoffman
http://www.robmixmusic.com
Los Angeles, CA
Re: ITB, OTB, hybrid does it matter anymore? [Re: robmix] #3002559 08/10/19 04:49 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 956
harmonizer Offline
Gold Member
Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 956
Most of the mixing I have done is of live performances by the 7-person covers band I play in. 6 of us sing at various times, so there is a real challenge fitting everything into a limited number of lines. I have used a Korg D3200, which can capture either 12 or 14 tracks at a time, depending on whether the moody digital connection for the 2 extra inputs is working. I do both my capture and mixing on the D3200 - despite its tiny black and white screen - so I guess I am "Way ITB". One interesting thing about the Korg D3200 is that it has a mastering function that just works, with no tweaking (it is a "Final Effect" with a name "Mastering Comp"). This mastering function has worked fine both for mixes of our rock covers band, and of our jazz quartet at church. I would like to get past the limiitation of capturing only 12 or 14 tracks, and get one of these: https://tascam.com/us/product/model_24/top. But that's just a dream for now.


Moderated by  robmix 

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3