Motion Sound KP612S vs. KP610S?

[BenWaB3]

This question for comparison may be slanted a little more towards those who attended Gear Fest and could have had a chance to hear them side by side. Probably the biggest concern would be how much bass response are you giving up? The specs say 50hz for the 612 & 60 for the 610. However, as we all know, specs don't always mean that much in real life. Of course the weight & dimensions favor the 610. On the 612 discussion thread from a few weeks ago mention was made of it having castors. Would the same be available on the 610? Sweetwater lists the 612 as only $100 more than the 610 so it's almost better to plunk down the extra, but the 610 is already bigger than I would like & the 6 pounds would make a difference in the lug factor.

 

My mixer crapped out right before this past week's performance. Of course the financially sound option would be to replace that instead of spending big bucks on a new amp. However the 2 separate channels on the MS are all I need. Right now I use a Spacestation so with its one channel a mixer is mandatory and we're all familiar with the gripe about the SS not being good for acoustic piano. Doing a comparison on the Sweetwater site it lists the 612 as having 8 1/4" inputs and the 610 as having 4. The pictures of the control section look the same though. so it's probably just a mistake from when they were rushing to get the 612 & 408 out (this was discussed on another thread). Either way though, that looks like it would entail plugging 2 separate keyboards into the same channel, which might not work too well.

 

Anyway, if anyone has any insights into comparing the two, or insights into the 610 in particular, your sharing of these insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[zxcvbnm098]

Do you know for sure that they exhibited at Gearfest?

[mate stubb]

Do you know for sure that they exhibited at Gearfest?

 

They did not.

[Mitch Towne]

I will be at Sweetwater with Motion Sound in July.

 

As for your questions about the 612 vs the 610:

 

The 610 can have castors added for an additional $40. It doesn't normally come with casters.

 

The amps in the 610 and 612 are the same with the same amount if inputs (8 inputs = 4 stereo pairs). The difference between the two will be the amount of bass output of the 12s vs the 10s. The 12s are going to give you more bottom end than the 10s. Both amps have a Speakon connection for a non-powered sub, so you can add bass to the 610 that way if needed.

 

I should get a 612 soon, and I can offer a hands-on review vs the 500 then. Let me know if you have any other questions!

 

Mitch

[sherry]

I thought the weight difference between the 610 and 612 was only 3 pounds, correct?

[BenWaB3]

Thanks, Mitch!!

[BenWaB3]

For Sherry: The MS site lists the weight difference as 6 pounds. However in their rush to get the specs out they may have made a few errors.

[DaBous]

I have the KP 610S.

 

I pre-ordered through Sweetwater so I have had it since April. One of the first I think.

 

Really like this amp. I play a lot - I have a weekly Thursday night gig plus about 40 weekend gigs a year with my classic rock band so portability matters.

 

I think MS has a winner with this one. Handles all of the volume I can throw at it - very clean sound. I used to use 2 EV ZXA1s. This sounds just as good with less gear to lugg around.

 

Weight is reasonable to 43 lbs. I did end up putting casters on it although it is borderline whether they are needed.

 

It has both mono and stereo outs on the back for connecting to FOH. That is pretty convenient. Some local clubs are still mono - ugh.

 

My current rig is Yamaha CP 73 for bottom board and NS3 73 on top. Everything sounds great - AP especially is clean and bright. For the NS3 B3 with the internal leslie sim I had to EQ off some of the high end.

 

 

I don't usually get excited about keyboard amps - they are a necessary evil. But this is the best one I have ever owned. Not cheap but clean sound at a reasonable weight. Would highly recommend.

[JeffKeys]

Ive had the 612 for two weeks and its awesome. I was using a 500 but it was one of the first (a SN) and theres no comparison between the two, especially in the acoustic piano dept. Real clear with lots of overtone distinction. Ive been getting great comments on the authenticity of my Leslie sim through it (Vent) as well. Strongly recommended!

[MPN21]

Ive had the 612 for two weeks and its awesome. I was using a 500 but it was one of the first (a SN) and theres no comparison between the two....

I am looking into purchasing a used 500. How can one find out if is not "one of the first"? Thanks.

 

 

 

[JeffKeys]

I would get the serial # and contact Motion Sound. The first ones were KP-500SN (N for neodymium speaker magnets). Later they dropped the N and stopped including those as standard in the cabinets. Thats one indication.

[Lou_NC]

Does anyone know whether Motion Sounds intends to continue production of the KP-500S along with these new KP6xx models? I've been eyeing a new KP-500S for some time based on reviews here, and am wondering whether I should consider pulling the trigger sooner rather than later?

 

My goal is getting as close to the bass response of a 15" Leslie as possible with one of these Motion Sound amps (without having to resort to a subwoofer).

 

Thanks,

Lou

[JeffKeys]

Lou,

At the MS website (msamps.com) theres an Ask the Pros tab and Im sure theyll give you an answer to that question.

[Mitch Towne]

Lou,

 

It looks like Jeff answered your question at the Motion Sound site! For those of you who might be curious about the KP-500, here is the answer:

 

The KP-500 will stick around to at least the end of the year, maybe longer.

[emenelton]

Ive had the 612 for two weeks and its awesome. I was using a 500 but it was one of the first (a SN) and theres no comparison between the two, especially in the acoustic piano dept. Real clear with lots of overtone distinction. Ive been getting great comments on the authenticity of my Leslie sim through it (Vent) as well. Strongly recommended!

 

Why is the SN version of the 500 referenced?

I have it.

[JeffKeys]

Just to distinguish it from the more recent KP-500S which the folks at MS told me had other upgrades over the years. I have a SN which Ive lived using for 10 years or so until I just purchased a 612.

[emenelton]

Just to distinguish it from the more recent KP-500S which the folks at MS told me had other upgrades over the years. I have a SN which Ive lived using for 10 years or so until I just purchased a 612.

 

I tried to contact MS one time about the background hiss of my 500SN, but did not get a response. Does the new one cut better in a mix?

[dazzjazz]

Anyone know of an Australian distributor for this? I cant seem to get a return email from Motion Sound.

[niacin]

Darren, until recently Motion Sound was imported by Pro Audio in Canberra, but they closed when the store stock was moved to the new premises of Better Music, which is co-owned by the same guy who owned Pro Audio. I can't see anything on Better's website, but it might be worth giving them a call, Rudy will know.

[JohnCorda]

Delighted to have discovered that Motion Sound has released a new line of amps.

 

I've had a KP500SN since early 2015, and it's been pretty great, although not always as loud as I need it. I don't need to blast everyone away, but the Nord Stage 2 likes the headroom I give it by feeding it through a smaller mixer (this is my preamp solution in a stereo path) that sits on the amp.

 

Also have an a Hammond XK-1c through a Vent2 for the other channel on the amp. Volume rarely an issue there.

 

But I know the sound of all my patches (acoustic piano, EPs, synths, B3, effects) could be better still, and I can sell my amp after purchasing an upgrade.

 

Main problem with these amps is the knobs can get lopped off during travel or just by virtue of it getting moved from car to venue and back, or at least I learned the hard way when I first received it. Fashioned a protective hard cover flap made out of canvas material and duct tape. Never a problem again and will do the same for the next amp.

 

I also own a KBR-3D, used it for ten years before the KP500SN, but it's not doing well these days, and it's too heavy anyways (and piano sounds terrible through it, I was in denial). However it was a great amp for what it could do, which was quite a lot. But now I like a lighter stereo amp with a Vent2.

 

So the question is. 2x12 / 612 or 2x10 / 610. I feel like I won't be happy unless it's 2x12.

 

I've probably already made up my mind. The 612 is about the same weight and dimensions as the KP500SN, albeit slightly less (1lb lighter, half an inch less in each measurement).

 

Unless the 610 can really provide the low end and headroom while being nicer to my back... sometimes I have to cover LH bass.

 

Many gigs have FOH, but I have a weekly gig I love that does not, and some medium size clubs where I might only have the amp for room sound.

 

I'm curious to know the volume differences between the 610 and 612, and perhaps more importantly the difference between the 612 and the 500

 

 

 

 

 

[JeffKeys]

Well, I have both of those amps (described above in this thread) and the sound isnt even close. Get the 612 and youll have a BIG upgrade! (And then get a LeCover padded cover for it and youll never have a knob loss problem again!)

[JohnCorda]

Well, I have both of those amps (described above in this thread) and the sound isnt even close. Get the 612 and youll have a BIG upgrade! (And then get a LeCover padded cover for it and youll never have a knob loss problem again!)

 

Good to know thanks!

[Mitch Towne]

I will be at Sweetwater next week doing an in store demo of the 612, 610 and the 408, so I should be able to offer a better opinion on the differences.

[bill bosco]

yea that is good to know , had the 500 for about a week but had to send it back , the stereo effect and the volume were great , but just couldn't dial in the midrange

i was looking for , was too blunt , for lack of a better term

[BenWaB3]

I will be at Sweetwater next week doing an in store demo of the 612, 610 and the 408, so I should be able to offer a better opinion on the differences.

 

We will looking forward to hearing your impressions!

[sherry]

Hey Mitch: if you could let us know the exact date and time, that would be great. Hoping to be able to hear the difference between each model to make a determination. Thanks.

[Mitch Towne]

I will be there all day on Wednesday, July 17!

[sherry]

I will be there all day on Wednesday, July 17!

 

Ah, crap. That's the only day I CAN'T make it. Hope a video is made with high quality audio. Thanks, Mitch.

[Mitch Towne]

I had a FANTASTIC time at Sweetwater this week! The Sweetwater campus is amazing and everyone is incredibly nice and knowledgable. Jeff Bollinger, head of Motion Sound, and I went there to do a demo of the new KP lineup (612, 610 and 408) for the sales reps so they would be familiar with the product and so they could hear first hand how great these amps sound and what the differences between them are.

 

Here is my general overview:

 

KP-408 - In my opinion, this is a fantastic amp for anyone who is playing piano, EPs, synths, pads, etc. It is loud and clear. I used this one as the start of the demo because the amount of sound this amp puts out is very impressive (the expressions of the sales reps confirmed that). I would not recommend the 408 to a player who needed a lot of bass in their parts. I wouldn't want to do a jazz organ gig with it, for example. But for anything short of that, this amp is great

 

KP610 - The next step up from the 408, with 10 inch speakers. Obviously, the larger speaker surface offers a bigger sound, and the 610 projects more than the 408. However, here is where it gets interesting. The 610 and the 612 have a Speak-On output that pulls an additional 250 watts to drive an additional passive sub. So, you have 250 per side in stereo AND an additional 250 for the sub. This makes the 610 a very attractive amp for a modular system - take the 610 when you don"t need as much bass, bring a sub when you need MOAR BASE!!! (Seriously, though, this is a big feature

 

KP-612 - The big one. Huge sound and plenty of bass. I would easily use this one for jazz organ gigs with pedals. Here are the main differences between the 612 and the KP500 -

 

1. The 612 is a few pounds lighter (56 lbs vs 49).

2. The new MS amps have an improved crossover. One user on this forum who has both says the 612 is warmer and rounder. I haven"t put them side by side yet, but I will next week. I"ll be able to speak more about that then.

3. The Speak-On output.

4. The 612 is front-ported, while the 500 is rear ported. This gives you a more direct forward sound. Those are the things that come to mind.

 

So, the bottom line for me is that all of these amps are fantastic and I really wish there had been something like this 10-15 years ago. Motion Sound is definitely full-steam ahead and has a great future. This company is a labor of love for Jeff and he really cares about the user experience. You can feel good about the support you'll receive after the purchase.

 

Let me know if you have any questions.

[M_G]

Thanks Mitch!

 

One question:

Do the 408 and 610 also have cooling fans inside?

 

That's one of the things that I do not like very much

on my KP500S.....