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Bose system plus 2 k10's


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I may have asked a variation of this conundrum-like question previously.. I plead guilty if I did.

 

I play left hand bass, ( I am not of the school of separate bass amp, as mentioned in another thread here... bass through all, suits me fine ) and sometimes play MIDI Songs through my single keyboard.

I own 2 k10's and the Bose L1 Model 2 with beefy B2 speaker.

 

My friend said the Bose mixer ( $500 ) is not that cool, and he recommends going another route.

How can I have my keyboard routed to the Bose ( with or without the Bose tone match mixer ) plus the 2 K10's?

There are occasions when my friend wants to add his powered speaker because he plays his ipad through that speaker and wants to be in my system as well.

Pretty mind boggling for me.

 

I am considering buying another mixer with presumably more than 2 outs.

Allen Heath and Soundcraft were suggested by my pianist friend.

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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Wouldn't you just go from your keyboard to the K10s and use the line out on the K10s to the Bose? Unless I am missing something that will work.
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I'm sure that you can daisy chain them as KeyMoe suggested. But personally I would either get a mixer. You could use a line mixer like the Samson SM10, an all purpose audio mixer like the ones the OP mentioned or a KeyLargo. There are multiple options, I use a small Yamaha mixer MX10U.

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QSC Mix 16 digital mixer would work great for this application. I love mine and you can set up different scenes so that when you add more people or speakers you don't have to reconfigure every time!

 

Jimmy

 

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First of all, No FOH considerations... that's for a later question.

 

Better than average music understanding, but way under average understanding of daisy chaining and mixer scene.. setups. This stuff is Greek to me. No offense to our Greek members. I mean I do what is obvious when dealing with 2 speakers, but when the number goes beyond 2, I am lost.

I did also mentioned this in thread opener, but my friend likes to add his iPad to the whole shooting match as well. I have no idea how to optimally connect cables for his ipad and mixer, plus my keyboard outs.

 

I would like to have control of which sounds go where, and maybe eq options.

 

I have asked this before, and I am still never clear... is a $150 mackie 6-8 channel comparable to an A&H 8ch ?

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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"I would like to have control of which sounds go where"

 

Ummm, you're signing up for a very complex setup. You'll need a mixer with multiple inputs and multiple outputs (aux busses). Lots of cables. Extended setup and debug time. Non-trivial coordination with FOH. I mean, I've done it (one path for APs, one path for organs, another path for synths) but quickly abandoned it as the effort was not justifying the result. It's not like I'm playing in some big-buck arena, we're talking modest gigs here.

 

As far as the original query, yeah it's pretty easy to daisy chain you Bose with QSCs or whatever. Not sure why you'd want to do that, but it should work OK. Better you have a sophisticated mixer ahead of that setup.

 

I use my Bose L1 in particular small-venue situations where it's acoustic stuff. The QSCs (or whatever) come out for electric band situations. Not sure of the rationale of mixing them.

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"I would like to have control of which sounds go where"

 

Ummm, you're signing up for a very complex setup. You'll need a mixer with multiple inputs and multiple outputs (aux busses). Lots of cables. Extended setup and debug time. Non-trivial coordination with FOH. I mean, I've done it (one path for APs, one path for organs, another path for synths) but quickly abandoned it as the effort was not justifying the result. It's not like I'm playing in some big-buck arena, we're talking modest gigs here.

 

As far as the original query, yeah it's pretty easy to daisy chain you Bose with QSCs or whatever. Not sure why you'd want to do that, but it should work OK. Better you have a sophisticated mixer ahead of that setup.

 

I use my Bose L1 in particular small-venue situations where it's acoustic stuff. The QSCs (or whatever) come out for electric band situations. Not sure of the rationale of mixing them.

 

"Not sure of the rationale of mixing them" !

 

Bigger sound, for larger rooms with more bodies.

 

PITA aside... and phasing possible issues... more speakers lend something to the resulting sound. As a hypothetical.. IF your voice was in one speaker

Strings /pads in another, bass in another, EP in a boxy Fender cab, and you get the idea. Would that have a certain charm, a certain clarity?

To exit the hypothetical... I play a tyros, and when I play a middle C range chord, for example, there is something missing in the sound to me... not exactly muddy,, but I am not hearing the chord tones in the way I would if playing a real piano. There is something missing; and I am not even talking about stereo fields or anything like that, just the clarity of individual voices, basses too.

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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To keep it simple without learning Greek with fewer cables and no speaker stands start selling off your current rig and look at the new Yamaha Stagepas 1k. A pair of those will give you built in mixers and stereo link functions. 1000 watts and 12" subs. 50 lbs and packs up nice. I use two similiar JBL Eon Ones and they're great for my purposes, clear balanced sound and good bass.. I also do keyboard/vocals, sometimes with LH Bass and use some SMFs. I also DJ with them. If I needed more juice I would go the Yamaha route. Looks like about $900 street price when they come out. With what you could get for your current stuff the trade up wouldn't be too bad.
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As a hypothetical.. IF your voice was in one speaker

Strings /pads in another, bass in another, EP in a boxy Fender cab, and you get the idea. Would that have a certain charm, a certain clarity?

In a small venue, yes, you can often get more sonic and positional clarity on sounds by putting them into their own speakers, And if this appeals to you, you might want to rethink your premise, "I am not of the school of separate bass amp" especially since you mentioned "bass in another" in particular. Similarly, if I were not so averse to bringing more gear, I'd bring a Spacestation just for organ. Organ sounds better through that than through my traditional PA speakers, just as my bass sounds better through a bass amp than through those speakers. Plus, taking the bass out of the main speakers tends to make everything else that IS going through the main speakers sound better, especially if I find I need to drive them harder.

 

I play a tyros...There is something missing; and I am not even talking about stereo fields or anything like that, just the clarity of individual voices, basses too.

Perhaps yet another reason to consider a separate bass amp. It seems like it could be somewhat self-defeating to say "I don't want to do X" and then list things you'd like to improve that could possibly best be addressed by x.

 

 

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As a hypothetical.. IF your voice was in one speaker

Strings /pads in another, bass in another, EP in a boxy Fender cab, and you get the idea. Would that have a certain charm, a certain clarity?

In a small venue, yes, you can often get more sonic and positional clarity on sounds by putting them into their own speakers, And if this appeals to you, you might want to rethink your premise, "I am not of the school of separate bass amp" especially since you mentioned "bass in another" in particular. Similarly, if I were not so averse to bringing more gear, I'd bring a Spacestation just for organ. Organ sounds better through that than through my traditional PA speakers, just as my bass sounds better through a bass amp than through those speakers. Plus, taking the bass out of the main speakers tends to make everything else that IS going through the main speakers sound better, especially if I find I need to drive them harder.

 

I play a tyros...There is something missing; and I am not even talking about stereo fields or anything like that, just the clarity of individual voices, basses too.

Perhaps yet another reason to consider a separate bass amp. It seems like it could be somewhat self-defeating to say "I don't want to do X" and then list things you'd like to improve that could possibly best be addressed by x.

 

 

Hmmm, I have tried an actual bass amp for left hand bass.. I have heard from a few locals who also subscribe to this apparent logic. Problem is I was not impressed. BUT, I didn't try the separate amp for bass, that often. I guess I can try again.

But I guess for tracks ( I am relatively new to playing MIDI tracks ) this means routing bass parts into the bass amp as well?

I have a suspicion the Separate organ amp would be cool too. And a Fender like amp for Rhodes as well. But having said all that, I am still wondering about the chords when playing piano and strings, and how clear each note would be. I have some kind of distrust of the Tyros in this regard... leaving separate bass amp out of consideration.

 

I am not stubborn.. so, I am going to use one 12 " bass amp and 2 10" qsc to see if the chords are clearer.

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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I did a LH bass gig a few months ago. First time I heard the Kronos thru a lovely Ampeg stack.

Piano sounds going in stereo thru a pair of 12 QSCs. Night and day difference to everything in the 12s.

 

By the way... Was the sound guys idea to run the bass from its own output, and he asked if I wanted stereo monitors. Thats rare, but its so much appreciated haha

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I did a LH bass gig a few months ago. First time I heard the Kronos thru a lovely Ampeg stack.

Piano sounds going in stereo thru a pair of 12 QSCs. Night and day difference to everything in the 12s.

 

By the way... Was the sound guys idea to run the bass from its own output, and he asked if I wanted stereo monitors. Thats rare, but its so much appreciated haha

 

Yes, Ampeg goodness... I used to own SVT and a B15.. used in the studios. I will have to try this again.

You don't have ideas, ideas have you

We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement

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QSC Mix 16 digital mixer would work great for this application. I love mine and you can set up different scenes so that when you add more people or speakers you don't have to reconfigure every time!

 

Actually, this is a great suggestion. It took a while to sink in. Sorry, getting slower as I age?

 

I had one of these for a while. I may have one again. Its superpower is 6 aux outputs, plus a pair of stereo mains. You could send the flutes to one place, the bass to another, the strings somewhere else -- well, you get the idea. Once you get it set up, it's all push-button. Oh yes, and an obscene boatload of tasty effects if that is your thing. Not mine. A tablet is nice to run it, but not needed.

 

The reason I ditched mine was simple -- I was trying to mix the band line AND play multiple keyboards. Y'all don't pay me enough to do that, so it's done. But it was a solid piece of kit. The other super-digital-mixer in this category is the Behringer X-Air 16/18 with a similar number of aux outs. But there's no control surface, so bring your device -- and a dedicated wifi router.

 

It's an interesting path you're on. Split the keys through different classes of amplification, depending. And I'm never going to try it because it means too much damn gear at a low-paying gig. If I followed this to its logical conclusion, it'd be a pickup truck full of gear -- just for me.

 

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This is assuming he could split all these different instruments out separate outputs on his Tyros.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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