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Digital piano with realistic action under $2000?


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Hi, I don't know if this is a good place to ask so I'll just drop it here.

 

I'm looking for a digital piano under $2000 that simulates the action of an acoustic piano as faithfully as possible. My candidates so far are:

 

Kawai CN-27 tried it, like it, but a bit too pricey at around $1800

 

Korg G1 air didn't try, but it sounds good from the description...any ideas? 120 polyphony seems alarmingly low, considering that one note can use up to 4 oscillators

 

Roland F-140 didn't try and I'm hesitant, I tried F-90 and I don't like the action. Does 140 have the same action?

 

Roland Juno DS88 tried it, like the action, but it doesn't have a cabinet-style stand (just the flimsy X), lacks triple pedal unit, doesn't feature sympathetic resonance

 

Yamaha P-515 didn't try it (sadly, I live in an area with not as many music stores as I would like), but they say it has natural wooden feel to the keys but I'm skeptical, as other from P-series (45, 115, 125) feel nothing like a real piano

 

From the description the Grand Feel II action (Kawai) sounds really good, but instruments featuring this action are crazy expensive.

 

Many times the catch is that the instrument itself is cheap (e.g. $1200), but you have to buy a stand, bench, pedal unit...some synths don't even have spekers, external amplifier and speakers are assumed (like Roland Juno DS) so we're at around $1600 again. I actually like the elegant cabinet-style of Kawai CN-27 with the rolling cover, pedals and bench included. That price tag tho :(

 

Any other brands and models I should be aware of? What else did you try and you like it? Thank you.

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If good key action is all you care for - take a look at kawai vpc1. Although it is a midi controller, not a digital piano - so you'll need to get the sounds from a pc/laptop. I have it myself and am very pleased with it overall.

 

if you can't tell the difference, does it matter?
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The yamaha P515 is probably as good as it gets at that pricerange. Im choosing between that and the CP88, which suits my stage needs better. If that doesnt fit the bill you need to go to a real piano.

 

F

 

 

Hi, I don't know if this is a good place to ask so I'll just drop it here.

 

I'm looking for a digital piano under $2000 that simulates the action of an acoustic piano as faithfully as possible. My candidates so far are:

 

Kawai CN-27 tried it, like it, but a bit too pricey at around $1800

 

Korg G1 air didn't try, but it sounds good from the description...any ideas? 120 polyphony seems alarmingly low, considering that one note can use up to 4 oscillators

 

Roland F-140 didn't try and I'm hesitant, I tried F-90 and I don't like the action. Does 140 have the same action?

 

Roland Juno DS88 tried it, like the action, but it doesn't have a cabinet-style stand (just the flimsy X), lacks triple pedal unit, doesn't feature sympathetic resonance

 

Yamaha P-515 didn't try it (sadly, I live in an area with not as many music stores as I would like), but they say it has natural wooden feel to the keys but I'm skeptical, as other from P-series (45, 115, 125) feel nothing like a real piano

 

From the description the Grand Feel II action (Kawai) sounds really good, but instruments featuring this action are crazy expensive.

 

Many times the catch is that the instrument itself is cheap (e.g. $1200), but you have to buy a stand, bench, pedal unit...some synths don't even have spekers, external amplifier and speakers are assumed (like Roland Juno DS) so we're at around $1600 again. I actually like the elegant cabinet-style of Kawai CN-27 with the rolling cover, pedals and bench included. That price tag tho :(

 

Any other brands and models I should be aware of? What else did you try and you like it? Thank you.

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@ElmerJFudd - I got most of my ideas from pianoworld, I just wanted to ask here as well :)

 

@chigson - does it simulate sympathetic resonance, or is it matter of the software one uses to produce the sound?

 

@fjzingo - CP88 is above my budget. I'd much love to have a piano, but there's just too many arguments against that: 1) I'm a grad student, I'm not staying here forever and moving it is a hassle. I'd probably sell it and buy another one where I'll move, which seems like a hassle. DP can be transported easily in a car. 2) Acoustic piano is a loud instrument...I have roommates and I don't think they would appreciate hearing the same thing over and over again as I'm practicing it. 3) I want to record what I play to a computer without using a complicated microphone setup

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I spent the entire last week shopping for a digital piano, trying all kinds of actions: P series, Clavinova, Dexibell, Roland, Kawai and Casio.

 

My suggestion is to do the same. Go and try as many as you can because only you can decide.

 

Also, if you thrive on the soundboard vibrations through the keys of an acoustic piano, no digital will replace that. You have to make compromises in that department as a lot of people do.

 

I also suggest when you're trying stuff, to make sure you test the new Casio Privia PX-S series, both you and your wallet might be pleasantly surprised.

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I'd forget the furniture style stand if you want to transport in the back of a car

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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Kawai CN-27 tried it, like it, but a bit too pricey at around $1800

 

You might be able to negotiate a better deal with the dealer.

 

If you like the CN27, I would also suggest taking a look at the CA48 - very similar instrument, but with a fully wooden-key keyboard action and superior speaker system.

 

Having said that, if you're planning to move in the future, perhaps a slab-type instrument such as the ES8, FP90, or P-515 with the custom stand is a more flexible better option?

 

Cheers,

James

x

Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

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Ive owned Yamaha , Roland , Kurzweil, Fatar and Kawai weighted actions. The newly designed Casio PX-S1000 and S3000 actions are very realistic. Their dynamic control, weighting and motion

is superior in my opinion.

 Find 660 of my jazz piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Harry was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book."

 

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@Keepitsimple If only I didn't live in a sh*tty hole where dealers say "sorry that's a high-end instrument, we don't keep that kind in stock, you have to go to a bigger showroom to see that" and suggest a city 5 hours away. I don't have a car, so...$100 bucks spent on a bus is $100 bucks less towards the instrument itself.

 

From what I've seen locally only Roland Juno DS88 and Kawai CN-27 had a proper action, I also tried Roland FP-90 and didn't like it. Not sure about the difference between FP-90 and FP-140, I'm not super optimistic.

 

@CEB the cabinet style didn't occur that big to me when I looked on the internet, but you might be right...but still, I wouldn't need professional piano movers to move something of a weight and size of a desk...just take another pair of hands, put it inside a truck and haul it across the country, right?

 

@Kawai James - great nick! ^_^ well, this is what I'm hoping for, but my local dealer is telling me generic brochure BS on how Kawai is exceptional amongst other brands and the higher price has its reasons. While I totally agree that Kawai is amazing (the digital piano he has in his showroom totally got me hooked up the first time I touched it), there is only so much I can afford, so... :) but totally, if he's willing to drop the price at least a bit, I wanna work with him, if he can provide a good deal compared with the music store right next door.

 

@Jazz+ I checked PX-S1000 and I don't know the action ("scaled smart hammer action"). I can ask local dealers whether they have it so I can touch it, but I'm not sure anyone in this town does :D

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Looks like Jazz+ beat me to it by a few minutes:

 

Check out the recent Casio Privia PX-S1000. The action is good, sound is good, it does sympathetic resonance (i.e., silently press a treble triad, bang sforzando/staccato on a bass note, and be astonished at what you hear), and as of this writing it costs less than $700 US.

-Tom Williams

{First Name} {at} AirNetworking {dot} com

PC4-7, PX-5S, AX-Edge, PC361

 

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Kawai ES8. Good pianos, great keybed. The best Ive played actually.

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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From what I've seen locally only Roland Juno DS88 and Kawai CN-27 had a proper action, I also tried Roland FP-90 and didn't like it. Not sure about the difference between FP-90 and FP-140, I'm not super optimistic.

 

I have a Roland Juno DS88 that I purchased because the action is very similar to my the Young Chang Studio Upright that sits in my house that my parents bought 25 years or so ago when I was taking lessons as a kid. For me it is a feel that I was very comfortable with and was familiar. That being said, the action is on the lighter side and might not be the choice of a lot of other people.

 

I wouldn't be concerned about not having a furniture style stand. If you are concerned about stability and don't want to use a X stand you can always get a Z stand, Tabletop/Platform stand, H Stand, or the Roland curved C stand.

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To the OP: I agree that Yamaha P515 is a front-runner here. Some of the most discerning of our KC brethren rate it highly. It has a different action from the P45/115/125 and good built-in speakers.

 

As mentioend above, a slab-style piano like this, (with the L515 stand) is much more transportable than a console-style DP.

 

If you can't travel to try one - can you buy online and return it? (I don't know how the costs would work out).

 

Cheers, Mike

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Kawai ES8. Good pianos, great keybed. The best Ive played actually.

Thank you for the tip! I looked online and the action is said to be RH3, i.e. the same as in CN-27? However, it doesn't come with a stand and pedals, which puts it at $2000+ range (for the whole bundle)...what sets it apart?

 

I wouldn't be concerned about not having a furniture style stand. If you are concerned about stability and don't want to use a X stand you can always get a Z stand, Tabletop/Platform stand, H Stand, or the Roland curved C stand.

 

Thanks, definitely looks useful! If other options fail, I might go for this option, however since that thing lacks speakers and triple pedal unit (neither me or the shop employee I talked to found one), I would rather not.

 

To the OP: I agree that Yamaha P515 is a front-runner here. Some of the most discerning of our KC brethren rate it highly. It has a different action from the P45/115/125 and good built-in speakers.

 

As mentioend above, a slab-style piano like this, (with the L515 stand) is much more transportable than a console-style DP.

 

If you can't travel to try one - can you buy online and return it? (I don't know how the costs would work out).

 

Cheers, Mike

Thank you Mike for your answer! Yes, P515 sounds amazing from what I read about it and I'm curious whether my local shop can get one to demo.

I might do what you suggested, but you mentioned costs...yes, while shops might be courteous enough to include free shipping, I would probably have to pay a lot to ship it back in case I want a return.

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See thread topic: Casio Privia PX-S1000 ($600) and S3000 ($800)

 

A lot of very positive comments about this new keyboard and its piano action. I'm a new owner of a 3000. My business partner just bought a 1000 and he's very particular about keyboard action. We are both very happy with the action.

These are only my opinions, not supported by any actual knowledge, experience, or expertise.
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Kawai ES8. Good pianos, great keybed. The best Ive played actually.

Thank you for the tip! I looked online and the action is said to be RH3, i.e. the same as in CN-27? However, it doesn't come with a stand and pedals, which puts it at $2000+ range (for the whole bundle)...what sets it apart?

 

...

 

That action is also in the MP7SE. If you could use headphones and no triple pedal, just a single pedal for now you could get a bundle for $1,849.99 plus tax. [url= https://www.kraftmusic.com/kawai-mp7se-stage-piano-key-essentials-bundle.html[/url]

 

No speakers in the MP7 but there are speakers in the ES8. If you bought the components separately and didn't need the fancy bench, you could piece a set together for a tidge cheaper than the bundle, at $2,077 plus tax (ES8 @$1,649 + HM4B Stand @$259 + F-301 triple pedal @$169). That wouldn't have a bench or headphones though, but there would be speakers in the ES8 anyways.

 

I didn't realize that you needed the full pedals and everything at one time. I was just recommending a board where the base cost was under $2,000. If I were in the same position, I'd buy the main keyboard and a stand first (since generally the keyboard will come with a cheap sustain pedal), then later add the triple-pedal unit. It's also possible that there are other triple-pedal units that will work besides the specialized ES8 one.

 

What sets it apart? The action. I've never played a CN-27 or an MP7SE but if all those have the same action, they would all be ok. MP7SE would be better if you didn't need internal speakers and wanted more controllers and non-piano stuff. Both the ES8 and the MP7SE have the same pianos as well.

 

Piano sound-wise, I was partial to Yamaha for a long time but am not a fan of their newest pianos as much as I was in the past. Not that anyone has something I really prefer over the old ones, but the Kawai is very nice. Polyphony is good too. The sampling is apparently the same as on their CA-97 flagship.

 

 

 

Used CLP and CVP Yamaha Clavinovas are nice too. In your case you would want something newer than around 2008 I think (CVP-400 series on up, CLP is way more complicated - go on a model-by-model research basis).

 

 

 

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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See thread topic: Casio Privia PX-S1000 ($600) and S3000 ($800)

 

A lot of very positive comments about this new keyboard and its piano action. I'm a new owner of a 3000. My business partner just bought a 1000 and he's very particular about keyboard action. We are both very happy with the action.

 

One of the local dealers says he is an exclusive Kawai dealer and the other shop they seem to focus mainly on Yamaha and they say they don't have Casio. So...If I wasn't concerned about money, I would try it, but if I'm buying something, I have to be sure about it (i.e. touch it myself). Thank you very much for your input though!

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If you could use headphones and no triple pedal, ... $1,849.99 plus tax ... No speakers ... didn't need the fancy bench, at $2,077 plus tax .That wouldn't have a bench or headphones though, but there would be speakers in the ES8 anyways.

 

Thank you very much for the bundles you found! However, at that price range Kawai CN-27 (RH3 action) is already a small cabinet style piano (no stand needed), has internal speakers, comes with a bench and my local dealer offers it at $1700. Though your setups are definitely useful if one tries to find different, not necessarily cheaper, alternatives.

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Where are you located?

 

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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Guitar Center in Tallahassee carries Casio if you wanted to try them out.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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So I went to Guitar Center, the only good thing in terms of action they had was Roland Juno-DS88 (doesn't have speakers, stand sold separately...). They also have a bunch of Yamahas and a console DP called "Williams". Never heard of it but its action was no good. I asked them about DPs with a better action and the guy told me that to try something better I should go to a bigger showroom, in Atlanta (4.5 hours away). Though I might've bumped into a person who doesn't know much about DPs, as it's called Guitar Center.
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Strange. Every guitar center I've been in has had multiple models from Casio. They do have a 30 day return policy - you could have one shipped to the store and if need be, return it to the store without incurring any shipping costs.

 

Yes, stay away from Williams, it's crap.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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I can't really answer that question for you. I would say the Yamaha and Kawai's have great actions. The Casio's have great actions for the price point. It would be up to you as to whether the price difference justifies the differences in action, especially since action is very subjective and only you can determine which you prefer. Even with acoustic pianos, there are some I prefer more than others. I guess the only point I was making is that you don't have a lot of financial risk going the GC route - just more your time and trouble. But to save a bunch of money, it may be worth it.

Dan

 

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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ChopinAcolyte, before you reject the Casio option, have you read through the thread? Posters are very positive about the quality of the action 846 posts in that thread. https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2971234/Casio_Privia_PX_S1000_600_and_#Post2971234
These are only my opinions, not supported by any actual knowledge, experience, or expertise.
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If you liked the Roland DS-88 action, there is a Roland FP-10 with updated version of this action, and it's just $500. (very nice actually)

 

But if you can afford Kawai CN-27, Kawai ES8 or Yamaha P515 - go with one of those, you'd be much happier.

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Well, I'm deciding mainly between Kawai CN-27 (local shop, tried) and Yamaha P-515 (hopefully I can audition it at another local shop). If the local dealer says that he doesn't have better models and I should go to Atlanta, I choose amongst those who are willing to work with me. Sometimes it's also about customer's experience...if those two options didn't exist, I would probably order online and hope for the best, but now that I have an option to try models that actually sound good right there in the shop, why not...
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