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Behringer DS-80 #2988479 05/07/19 12:10 PM
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SteveCoscia Offline OP
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Just saw this on FB. Uli includes a little commentary.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/synthesizer.freaks/permalink/10158974472983849/


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: SteveCoscia] #2988480 05/07/19 12:17 PM
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Figured they would beat Yamaha to the punch.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2988481 05/07/19 12:18 PM
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Closed group. Can you copy paste Uliís comments?
Price?


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2988482 05/07/19 12:20 PM
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Uli's Comments:

As promised here is our DS-80 design draft;

Multi-Timbral 8-Voice Polyphonic
Analog Synthesizer with Dual Channels
per Voice, Polyphonic Aftertouch,
Ribbon Controller and Patch Memory

We want to be absolutely clear that this a very complex synthesizer project and it is at a very early stage. It will take us a long time to complete, however we are committed to deliver.

Why are we showing you this project at such an early stage? We believe that including you in the design process from the very beginning while help us and the synthesizer community to create a better product - and that's all that matters to us.
Thank you for your participation and now let us hear your feedback... Uli

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: SteveCoscia] #2988485 05/07/19 12:30 PM
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mate stubb Offline
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1. Sliders suck compared to paddles.
2. All that panel duplication for presets is obsolete and stupid these days.
3. WHERE"S THE BLEEDIN' RIBBON? NO PITCH BENDER?


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: mate stubb] #2988487 05/07/19 12:34 PM
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I was inclined to agree with point number 2 from Moe, but...
the ability to quickly change to basically 5 live panels, with direct access to sliders at the appropriate corresponding position- that sounds kind of appealing to me.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2988490 05/07/19 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
Figured they would beat Yamaha to the punch.


and it's not being called a BS-80. laugh


A reason why I collect old keyboards is that I feel partly responsible for doing it, responsible for preserving history and being a custodian for these things
Plus, old gear has a story. I like that.
Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: mate stubb] #2988492 05/07/19 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted By: mate stubb
2. All that panel duplication for presets is obsolete and stupid these days.

In a fully analog design architecturally derived from the CS80, digital user set-and-recall of all functions may not be possible...?

Originally Posted By: mate stubb
3. WHERE"S THE BLEEDIN' RIBBON?

Under the colored factory patch buttons in the middle. Hard to see in the photo.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: AnotherScott] #2988498 05/07/19 01:05 PM
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Uli's trying to box Yamaha out, because he knows they won't dare try a literal 1:1 translation such as this.

And neither should Behringer. Let's get real here.

"We are committed to deliver" is a pretty strong statement, but please concentrate on getting that UB-Xa out first.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Bill H.] #2988502 05/07/19 01:22 PM
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With all of the R & D they have itís sad to see them waste time on something years away that wonít get close to the real sound, and even if it did so frigginí what?

2020 is approaching, synths might be able to levitate before long, try something from the current century.
None of their hardware even gets close to the sound of the old dinosaurs they seek to emulate.
Stop wasting time and innovate.
Whatís next? The Behringer BThree and Lesly Nielsen Cabinet.

These people bore me...


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: hardware] #2988508 05/07/19 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted By: hardware
With all of the R & D they have itís sad to see them waste time on something years away that wonít get close to the real sound, and even if it did so frigginí what?

This is fun for baby boomers with cash to burn. I couldn't afford one of these back then - gives me a second chance to be one of the cool kids. I couldn't afford the OBX either.

Behringer is delivering more than just products. Dreams come true.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: hardware] #2988531 05/07/19 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted By: hardware
Whatís next? The Behringer BThree and Lesly Nielsen Cabinet.


You sound unimpressed, Hardware, what is it?

It's a hypothetical tonewheel organ clone and matching rotating speaker, but that's not important right now.

Cheers, Mike.

Last edited by stoken6; 05/07/19 04:52 PM.

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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: hardware] #2988532 05/07/19 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted By: hardware
None of their hardware even gets close to the sound of the old dinosaurs they seek to emulate.

There seem to be a lot of happy Model D owners.

Originally Posted By: hardware
Stop wasting time and innovate.
...These people bore me...

Different companies do different things. They don't all need to appeal to the same customers. In the big picture, the diversity of designs and approaches is a good thing. There are a lot of Behringer customers who seem to be happy someone is doing what they're doing. If the stuff didn't sell, they'd stop doing it.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: AnotherScott] #2988545 05/07/19 04:11 PM
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Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Randelph] #2988575 05/07/19 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


I disagree. They innovate plenty where they see the opportunity. Case in point? The X-Air mixer which blows away everything at that price point. The DeepMind is another example. I'm sure there are others.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: cphollis] #2988578 05/07/19 07:18 PM
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You think Behringer isnít copying Yamaha UI for legal reasons?
Why did they feel they could copy UI on Moog D and ARP Odyssey?

The DM-12 I think was innovative in the sense that Behringer used their acquired IP from TC and engineers from Midas to build an inspired synth - not a clone.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2988580 05/07/19 07:29 PM
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I'd wait for the Yamaha, whatever it might be. I think most of the Behringer clone stuff is cool (never found one to try though), but this time I don't see the point. Is it going to weigh the same amount too? Some things should be updated/expanded rather than cloned. Just my opinion. And this concept art is ugly, and the layout does NOT appeal to me at all. Ick. I don't have a problem with clones, but this one makes me really scratch my head.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: cphollis] #2988585 05/07/19 07:42 PM
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All of this CS-80 talk makes me itch like a crusty old Andy-Rooney-style uncle who hates everything. smirk

I saw Eddie Jobson playing one live. How could I not be biased by a high bar like that? I also have to bite down on that BS, because instrument choice and musical direction are 99% subjective. That's your call to make, case closed. I've also laid hands to a Synergy, Matrix-12 and Prophet T-8. There is a very solid line between lesser fun-synths and the Big Kahunas. I'd casually "hate" to see a decent new CS-80 that mostly sat in the middle of a pile of Erebus modulars and 3 Kaoss pads. That would be "wrong." facepalm rolleyes

I have no stake in the matter, aside from hoping that a decent number of players would embrace it with Eddie in mind a bit. When someone really wails on a CS-80, it draws a clear line between Real Mavens and mere knockoff Taiwanese androids. If you only use it for pads, you don't need one! cop

If a manufacturer offered just the keyboard mechanism and got it right, I'd be all over that and Arturia's CS-80V before the sun set.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: cphollis] #2988614 05/07/19 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: cphollis
Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


... They innovate plenty where they see the opportunity. ... The X-Air mixer which blows away everything at that price point


The X-Air mixer IS a cost effective Midas XR where the Midas model comes w/ hotter outputs and better S/N ratio.

A.C.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: SteveCoscia] #2988615 05/07/19 10:10 PM
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Behringer should come up w/ a "poly AT" MIDI- controller keyboard offering the ribbon, PB & Mod-wheels in addition, 2 switch pedal- and 2 CC-pedal inputs as well.
That controller had a display and preset selector buttons and would be usable w/ every synth expander module (they offer).

The DS-80 sound architecture and all DS-80 specific play-mode haptics should go into a desktop module,- leaving the obsolete vintage preset slider section where it belongs to ... in the past.

A.C.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Al Coda] #2988628 05/08/19 12:57 AM
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Speaking only for myself, the CS80 sound, with poly aftertouch and the ribbon ... is good enough. It's a doorway to a world of expression. The rest is up to me.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Randelph] #2988629 05/08/19 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


There's a bit of innovation here and there. Check out the augmented reality interface they have for the DeepMind synth:








Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: psionic11] #2988653 05/08/19 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted By: psionic11
Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


There's a bit of innovation here and there. Check out the augmented reality interface they have for the DeepMind synth:



Hadn't seen that before... thanks for posting. Looks like fun! smile


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: mate stubb] #2988694 05/08/19 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted By: mate stubb
1. Sliders suck compared to paddles.
2. All that panel duplication for presets is obsolete and stupid these days.
3. WHERE"S THE BLEEDIN' RIBBON? NO PITCH BENDER?
One of the best things about the CS-80 was the chunky feel of the paddles, I guess it would be expensive to duplicate. And I am curious to see if they really do come out with a PolyAT controller. But I can't help feeling that this is a big Behringer tease, just like the Jupiter 8 clone and the UB-Xa; just announcing these can cause people to hesitate in their synth purchasing.

Also, the CS-80 had a unique Oscillator structure (Hz/V or something like that), which the Deckard's Dream did not duplicate and why the DD doesn't quite sound like a CS-80. If Behringer is really going to clone it, will that mean actually cloning the electronics in SMT form??

So these days I am now waiting on:

-Moog One (with major bugs and MIDI implementation fixed)
-Black Corporation Xerxes (Synthex clone)
-Behringer Jupiter 8
-Studioelectronics/Roland Omega/Code polysynth
-and now the DS-80 (will it be the BS-80?)

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: SteveCoscia] #2988719 05/08/19 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted By: SteveCoscia
gives me a second chance to be one of the cool kids.


No, it makes you the keyboard equivalent of the guy that bought this in the 80's and called it a "Jeep": wink razz



Quote:
Behringer is delivering more than just products. Dreams come true.


Only if you never played the original. twothumbs


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Sven Golly] #2988738 05/08/19 04:19 PM
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There are lots of ways you can innovate. You can take something beloved but that most people, if they could afford one and had one - these days wouldn't think of gigging with it for various reasons, and use innovation in materials, modern design, manufacturing technics, etc to make a feasibly giggable, affordable, reliable version.

Cars were invented long ago, but that doesn't mean every modern car is just copying the Model T. There's lots of innovation.


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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: J. Dead] #2988744 05/08/19 04:50 PM
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If it sounds and plays well people will buy it and play the shit out of it....its a fantastic time to play keys. New keys around the corner everyday, problem is more how to limit oneself.

Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: Sven Golly] #2988745 05/08/19 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: Sven Golly
Originally Posted By: SteveCoscia
gives me a second chance to be one of the cool kids.


No, it makes you the keyboard equivalent of the guy that bought this in the 80's and called it a "Jeep": wink razz



Quote:
Behringer is delivering more than just products. Dreams come true.


Only if you never played the original. twothumbs


Cute story Sven ... my youngest brother bought a Suzuki Samurai many years ago (because at that time he couldn't afford a "real" Jeep) and he put a lift kit, big tires, locking axles on it and joined a club full of mostly Jeep owners. Over the course of the next several years he used his winch and pulled many a Jeep out of trouble. That little Samurai would go places a Jeep just couldn't sometimes go. Plus it weighed about half as much. He has a Rubicon now but still kept his Suzuki. Sorry to go OT, it just reminded me.



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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: cphollis] #2988797 05/09/19 05:16 AM
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Originally Posted By: cphollis
Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


I disagree. They innovate plenty where they see the opportunity. Case in point? The X-Air mixer which blows away everything at that price point. The DeepMind is another example. I'm sure there are others.


The Xair is not original in any way. I saw an Australian company (forget their name) showing the original product lineup of 3 models at Music Messes about 5 years ago. They got a lot of attention inside the industry. Behringer just made copies.

The Australian company product line morphed into the SoundCraft line of Ui12, Ui16, and Ui24R. I don't know if the company was bought or the design was licensed or how that happened.

Last edited by SynMike; 05/09/19 05:24 AM.

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Re: Behringer DS-80 [Re: SynMike] #2988803 05/09/19 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted By: Al Coda
Originally Posted By: cphollis
Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


... They innovate plenty where they see the opportunity. ... The X-Air mixer which blows away everything at that price point


The X-Air mixer IS a cost effective Midas XR where the Midas model comes w/ hotter outputs and better S/N ratio.

A.C.

Since Behringer owns Midas, I guess they can do things like that. They did the same thing with the X32/M32, where one is Behringer with Behringer preamps and the other is Midas with Midas preamps at different price points.

Originally Posted By: SynMike
Originally Posted By: cphollis
Originally Posted By: Randelph
Behringer doesn't innovate, they make cost effective designs of existing products.


I disagree. They innovate plenty where they see the opportunity. Case in point? The X-Air mixer which blows away everything at that price point. The DeepMind is another example. I'm sure there are others.


The Xair is not original in any way. I saw an Australian company (forget their name) showing the original product lineup of 3 models at Music Messes about 5 years ago. They got a lot of attention inside the industry. Behringer just made copies.

The Australian company product line morphed into the SoundCraft line of Ui12, Ui16, and Ui24R. I don't know if the company was bought or the design was licensed or how that happened.

Didn't the XAir also come out like 5 years ago? I'm not saying they didn't steal the idea, but it just seems a bit difficult to steal an idea and come out with it the same year as the thing you stole it from. Seems like it would take a bit of time to reverse engineer it to steal it. Really, at the core the XAir stuff is a shrunk down version of the X32 stuff with a built in wireless access point. So maybe they just stole the idea of adding a built-in access point from this company?

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